Talk:Flight engineer/Archives/2016

Service Engineer
My father was a licenced engineer who also worked as a flight engineer for a small airline that operated between remote pacific islands. Because of the remoteness and isolation of some the the islands they flew to, we would also perform aircraft servicing. He told me this combined role of Flight Engineer and ground grew engineer was called 'service engineer', but I've been unable to find any reference to this role online. Has anyone else heard of it?

R/ SIR

GOOD EVENING

I HAVE DONE DIPLOMA IN ELECTRICAL ENGINEERING.

MY EXPERIENCE ALL ELECTRICAL MACHINE CONTROLS OF PANELS VFD AND HMI RELATED

I AM HANDLING FOR CRITICAL BREAK DOWN

KINDLY NEED A JOB POSITION FOR ELECTRICAL ENGINEER IN MAINTENANCE DEPARTMENT

SO PLEASE YOU PROVIDE ME JOB ELECTRICAL ENGINEER POSITION

The paragraph on this page is NOT about the first and second officers / Pilot Flying and Pilot Not Flying.
The paragraph on this page concerns the 3rd officer in the flightdeck. The Technical officer who monitors / monitored the myriad systems and gauges of an aircraft before the advances in technology allowed the air operator to do away with the need for them.

the new aircraft being manufactured for commercial transport use have reduced the amount of whistles and bells in the cockpit to the point that a very low time pilot can operate the aircraft in all but the most dire circumstances.. hopefully without a computer power failure..

154.20.161.29 (talk) 07:21, 6 August 2016 (UTC)

Air Engineer is NOT the same as "Flight Engineer"
AIR Engineer / Air Engineer / air engineer in Canada this was an Airworthiness Inspection Representative of the Canadian Air Board - Department of Militia, 1919 under authority of the JAG - Judge Advocate General. By 1922, under the provisions of the National Defence Act, 1922, the powers, duties and functions given the Air Board under the Air Board Act of 1919 are fully vested in the Minister of National Defence. The executive duties previously carried out by the Air Board are now all performed by the Canadian Air Force. The Air Force includes an inspection directorate in the Chief of Staff's Branch of the Department of National Defence, headquarters at Ottawa. Headquarters branch is charged with: 1) the inspection and licensing of aircraft for airworthiness; 2) the examination of Pilots for competency, 3) the examination of AIR Engineers for competency, 4) the examination of Air Navigators for competency Commonly spelt "Air Engineer" or air engineer.

The breadth of the scope of Canadian military law is reflected in the fact that the Judge Advocate General is a legal advisor to both the Department and the Canadian Armed Forces. Designation of person to execute Minister’s functions : The Governor in Council, on the recommendation of the Minister of Defense, may designate any other person in addition to the Minister of Defense to exercise any power or perform any duty or function that is vested in or that may be exercised or performed by the Minister under this Act. The Minister of Transport attained this same ability when TC was seperated from the DND in 1968 - 1970.

NOTE that the AIR Engineer in Canada from 1919 onwards is distinct and greatly different from the "Flight Engineer" - a position and role created by RAF Bomber command in 1943.

By 1936, the UK has an Air Registration Board - which assumes control of 1) the inspection and licensing of aircraft for airworthiness; 2) the examination of Pilots for competency, 3) the examination of AIR Engineers for competency, 4) the examination of Air Navigators for competency, amonst other things.

This same situation developed here in Canada - however the "Operations Branch" assumed a number of these functions which had normally fallen under the Engineering and Inspection Branch ( which was associated with the National Research Council Laboratory in the same manner that the UK's reserch branch was the ACA laboratory at RAF Farnborough)

On 05 January 1952 the Canada Gazette contained a Department of Transport job vacancy, Edmonton, Alta. $214-9242 per month. Open to qualified male residents of the Edmonton Air Services District (which consists of the Province of Alberta, the Northwest Territories west of the 110th meridian, Yukon Territory and that part of British Columbia north and east of a line ten miles west of the Alaska Highway). Qualifications required included: 1) Possesion of an Air Engineer's Certificate endorsed in categories “A " and "C" or 2) Possesion of the "new" Aircraft Maintenance Engineers " M " licence under Category “A” for at least one of the following aircraft; Douglas DC-3; Lockhead 1848. 10-A or 12-A; Beechcraft C-18-VS or D-17-S; Avro Anson V ; DeHaviland DHC-2.

AIR Engineers are the Canadian equivalent of the British Aircraft Ground Engineer for the same period - their training and licencing follows the British format and guidance materials.

The power of delegation of authority and responsibility is a long accepted principle of British public law that, within the administration of government in the United Kingdom ( and Canada), the functions which are given to Ministers (be they Civil or Military Ministers) are functions so multifarious that no Minister could ever attend to them It cannot be supposed that this regulation meant that, in each case, the Minister in person should direct his mind to the matter. The duties imposed on Ministers and the powers given to Ministers are normally exercised under the authority of the Minister by responsible "officials" - The 1919 Air Regulations created the Ground Engineer as such an official. Public business could not be carried on if that were not the case. Constitutionally, under UK law, a decision of such an official is, of course, the decision of the Minister. The Minister is responsible. It is The Minister who must answer for anything that his officials have done under their authority, and, if for an important matter the Minister selected an official of such junior standing that such junior officer could not be expected competently to perform the work, the Minister would have to answer. The legal principle which permits delegation in this way is predicated on the proposition that the Minister is responsible for things done under his or her authority. Therefore, the exercise of the delegation is dependant on two things: the conferment of power must be permitted under legislation; and the existence of a person to whom the can delegate, without parting with their ultimate responsibility. Parliament has conferred powers directly on the Minister because of the personal qualifications of the Minister but allows the Minister to delegate those other functions for which qualifications are not required in their position at the apex of the hierarchical structure put in place to support him or her. Those delegated functions relying on “personal qualifications” can only be delegated to equivalently trained and competent persons. Whilst members of the Minister’s internal and external staff may be described in “an instrument of delegation” as a proper and appropriate agent; that person does not become “the proper and appropriate person” as their actions under a delegation are those of the Minister. Delegations must be identified and updated with each new Minister. Delegated members of a Minister’s staff cannot exercise delegated functions unless the individual has been : specifically trained to accomplish the specific delegated functions - Inspection of Civil Aircraft to ensure compliance with regulatory requirements for airworthiness specifically authorised in writing by the Minister - A delagation document commonly known as an AME Licence, specifically authorised by the Minister only to the extent indicated by the Minister’s instrument of delegation - Category and Type ratings In 1970 Transport Canada adopted the FAA system - but only in part, and it was not well done ar well implemented... principle among that adoption was the A&P and the A&P with I.A... however TC failed to create a seperate trades-persons certificate along the lines of the A&P or to identify that persons who were trained as AIR Engineers were in fact the equivalent of the US A&P with I.A.... resulting in the issue of only 1 document to the "AME"..

One of the (multitude) of findings from Moshansky Commission and one of Justice Moshanky's recommendations was that the scope and authority of delegations to AIR Engineers be strengthened and increased. A finding similar to the Dubin Commission of 1969-1970.

CanadianAME (talk) 00:00, 6 August 2016 (UTC)

Multiple usages of "Air engineer"?
In the context of early flight engineers, the article references: Stringman, D.C. (Flt. Lt.); The History of the Air Engineer: Training in the Royal Air Force, U.K.: RAF Finningley, 1984.

Can anybody confirm whether Stringman uses the term "air engineer" to mean specifically ground or flight staff or both? The situation might be complicated by, say, a flight engineer needing to be also qualified as a ground engineer. &mdash; Cheers, Steelpillow (Talk) 11:35, 7 August 2016 (UTC)