Talk:Flushing, Queens/Archive 1

Demographics
Flushing is a diverse neighborhood in New York. http://www.flushing.com Flushing contains white-Hispanics(including Ashkenazi Jews from Latin america),Black Hispanics, and even Japanese-Peruvians(asian hispanics)

larger than manhattan's chinatown
Yes it's larger than manhattan's chinatown.

http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=16885790&BRD=2731&PAG=461&dept_id=574902&rfi=6

quote from ny State Comptroller

"Hevesi added that the Chinese population of Flushing now exceeds that of Manhattan’s Chinatown"

Naming
Why is Flushing at Flushing, New York and Jamaica at Jamaica, Queens? john k 00:36, 15 Nov 2004 (UTC)

The Queens neighborhood entries seem rather inconsistent that way. Someone better versed with moving stuff should probably fix this. I'd vote for all Foo, Queens. --Elijah 23:25, 2004 Dec 8 (UTC)


 * Along the lines of the previous comment, should this article be merged with Fresh Meadows Queens New York? - Jtalledo 19:32, 8 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I wouldn't suggest merging them. Traditionally Fresh Meadows would fall under the Flushing post office branch (see under Queens), but it legitimately a different neighborhood with a different character. --Elijah 23:25, 2004 Dec 8 (UTC)

I too vote against merging the above-mentioned articles. Flushing, Jamaica, Corona, Fresh Meadows, etc. are indubitably distinct.

Since town names have more significance in Queens, primarily due to the fact that all Queens neighborhoods were infact independent towns for the majority of their existence. People in Nassau county don't refer to Great Neck, North Hempstead, they refer to Great Neck, NY. The idea is exactly the same to list Flushing, NY as Flushing, Queens. --24.215.137.129 10:09, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Chinese population
l find it very difficult to believe that Flushing has the largest Chinese population in the U.S. Lets look at...

San Francisco, California - 19.6% (152,620)

Honolulu, Hawaii - 10.7% (39,600)

Oakland, California - 8.0% (31,834)

Daly City, California

Monterey Park, California - 41.2% (24,758)

San Marino, California - 40.6% (5,260)

Alhambra, California - 33.1% (28,437)


 * This is not about the city with the largest Chinese population, this is about the largest Chinatown. Flushing's Chinatown is larger than Lower Manhattan's, which is larger than San Francisco's.--Pharos 13:15, 4 Jan 2005 (UTC)


 * Actually, not. The most recent count has San Francisco w/more than Manhattan, which has more than Flushing. The "new" Chinatown out there in San Francisco's Richmond District even has more than Flushing.67.115.155.101 (talk)


 * and I wouldn't go as far as to claim that San Francisco's Chinatown is largest. Area-wise, I think it's safe to say that Dubai's Chinatown at 800 hectares(10 sq. miles) is easily the world's largest, being 20 times larger than either San Francisco's or Manhattan's.67.115.155.101 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:16, 22 March 2010 (UTC).

largest chinatown eh?
what evidence do you have that flushing is the largest chinatown? i have here 2 documents that will disprove your statement. read this. http://education.yahoo.com/reference/encyclopedia/entry/VancouvCan;_ylt=Al4BtEICR04aqtg0BPW9gM5Vt8wF according to this article, flushing doesnt even make the top two, let alone the largest chinatown position. this next article also disproves your statement, meaning that flushing wouldnt even make the top 3. http://www.ameinfo.com/23403.html in any case, im positive that there are other chinatowns that will be larger than flushing, especially in places like viet nam, cambodia, indonesia, malaysia, cambodia, laos, burma, philipines.


 * sorry, but that yahoo columbia encyclopedia citation (from 1991) is waaaaaaaaaaaay out of date. demographics, census data have changed radically since then. and then the other cite you mention talks about chinatown around the world.  let's focus on the USA.  if you want the largest chinatown in the world, that would be Shanghai at 16.7million people (2000 chinese census) .................also make sure to sign your name and date with four tildes, whoever you are. Lucky dog (talk) 07:39, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Flushing is the largest.
First, this is not about which city has the most chinese people dispursed throughout. New York's population is significantly larger than San Francisco in that category with 361,500 Chinese residents as of 2000, http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/census/mapsf16.pdf. Second, since Flushing is not a popular tourist destination like Chinatown Manhattan or San Francisco, many people do not know about it and have never visited it, including most non-Chinese New Yorkers. Flushing is much larger geographically than Chinatown, and it contains more Chinese residents. Here is a breakdown of the Chinese population by county for the 2000 Census. http://www.aafny.org/cic/briefs/chinese.pdf. Not included in any data is the amount of undocumented immigrants living in these neighborhoods. It's estimated that Flushing has many more undocumented immigrants than Manhattan. I don't know the estimates on San Francisco, however a person can work in Flushing without speaking any English at all. This is not the case for Manhattan Chinatown or San Francisco, which rely heavily on tourism for revenue. Flushing is filled with markets, restaurants, and stores aimed at the Chinese-American and Korean-American. There is also a line between the Korean section and Chinese section. Having lived in Flushing as a non-Chinese, there were many occasions where I had to have friends translate what I wanted from menus, as many places had no English language menus. In addition, nowhere does the article say anything at all about Canada or North America or the United States, even (though it is the largest in the United States), only that it is larger than Chinatown in Manhattan, so where is the dispute?


 * I hate to say this, but your propaganda is blowing New York's Chinese pop. stats out of proportion. The 2008 city-mandated count has San Francisco somewhere at roughly 300,000 which is still less than New York's. However, the 300,00 is within a 44 sq. mi. area, whereas New York's is at 300 sq. miles. Bring in the density factor, and San Francisco is well ahead at 6,819 p/ sq. mi. to NYCs 1,205 p/ sq. mi.67.115.155.101 (talk)

"dont make a claim if you know nothing about san fran or any other chinatown such as vancouver. leave it for people who have actual facts to back up what theyre saying. so far, youve showed a worthless stat listing the breakdown of the 5 boros of new york, showing nothing specific about flushing or flushing's chinese population. thats great that you have queens' chinese population but queens does not equal flushing. you are making a claim about flushing, dont show us queens stats. i dont know what the point of you bringing up undocumented chinese was. you think new york is the only place with undocumented chinese? you really need to get out of new york at least once in your life."

Please post a new reply, instead of editing mine. If you read the second paragraph before starting a fight, you would have your answer. San Fran was only brought up to address the previous posters. Who cares about Vancouver? Certainly not the article that is "disputed" here? If we're talking about world cities, the largest is certainly some city in China. The article doesn't even talk about San Fran, so there really should be no dispute unless you're arguing for chinatown manhattan. "The Chinese community in Flushing is in fact now the largest in the New York metropolitan area, having surpassed Manhattan Chinatown several years ago." This is the disputed sentence, yet not one argument disputes it. They all raise San Fran, other Cali towns, and Vancouver arguments. If those are in the NY Metro area then the Metro area is a lot bigger than it used to be.

BTW, i was born in Mississippi, raised in Texas, and lived in Mexico and Venezuela prior to moving to NY, so i've hardly been in NY all my life. Go back to Vancouver. This thread doesn't concern canadians. See how we can make generalizations about where people are from? Nobody said New York is the only place with undocumented Chinese. I only said Flushing has more than Chinatown Manhattan. Incidentally, I worked for the Census 2000 in New York and that was a larger issue in Flushing than Chinatown as Flushing is geographically much larger than Chinatown Manhattan. The only way to make an argument for Manhattan over Flushing is by narrowing what is Flushing to just downtown Flushing, though there may be more Chinese in downtown Flushing alone than Chinatown Manhattan. Buildings that carry a Flushing address take up an area about 2/3 the size of all of Manhattan. Do you care to make an argument for Chinatown Manhattan, or perhaps Brooklyn or are we in agreement that Flushing is bigger?

Really?
''The Chinese community in Flushing is in fact now the largest in the New York metropolitan area, having surpassed Manhattan Chinatown several years ago(disputed — see talk page). ''

Have there actually been studies done to quantify and qualify the largest Chinatown in the United States or was this sentence subjectively written by some overproud New Yorkers?


 * Actually, the claim made was that Flushing is the largest Chinatown in the New York metro area.

Re: Really?
There is no such thing as an "overproud" New Yorker.


 * Why so skeptic? None of you seems to be comparing the same thing.  You can't compare San Francisco City with the neiborhood of Flushing.  One is a city, the other is part of county which is part of a city.  You should consider that there are 3 Chinatowns in NY City.  How many are there in SF City?

Do you have a problem with Flushing being the largest 'Chinatown' in NYC or United States? Also Flushing Chinatown is not just Flushing. Many Chinese living in Whitestone, Bayside, College Point and other surrounding areas also consider themselves part of the Flushing Chinatown community. Oh yea, Flushing also serves the Long Island residents.
 * "youve showed a worthless stat listing the breakdown of the 5 boros of new york" If you mention Chinatown and you think of Manhattan, then when Flushing is mentioned, you need to think of Queens so that stat is perfectly valid.  Read a Chinese news paper, check out where business are located.  Maybe you'll get an idea how big Flushing Chinatown really is.
 * Chinatown is for tourists. Flushing is for the Chinese.

Flushing HS and dispute
There's nothing to be disputed. It's designated as a historic site by NYC. It even says so on one of the facades of the Northern Blvd. entrances. Obviously, someone here doesn't live in Flushing.

General
I don't like the way this article comes together. Statements like "This is due to the necessary clean up of several impoverished areas in the neighborhood", "There are also Hispanic American, African American, Southeast Asian and Filipino American communities in the surrounding buildings and public housing establishments around the downtown Flushing area.", and "This violence mostly occurs in the public housing projects (Bland Houses) or in section 8 housing throughout the neighborhood" seem a bit prejudicial and could be reworded or condensed to get the same point across, which I think can be summarized by the word "diversity". Similarly, the sentence "It's also called Little China/Korea/India/Philippines by residents in south Flushing (after the Long Island Expressway/Horace Harding Expressway to Main Street and Queens Boulevard" seems out-of-place and unnecessary. This part here "Downtown Flushing is affectionately called "Blade Runner meets Charles Dickens" due to the dense crowding and neon lights around Main Street and Roosevelt Avenue" is ridiculous.. I've never heard that and while I'm sure it's spoken, it seems like an "insider" type of comment and unnecessary in this context.

Agreed.

Parks and memorials
It would be nice to see a listing of parks and memorials. --evrik 21:09, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Local Politicians
For some reason, people put two current local politicans under the "people of note" who live in Flushing section. I took issue with that and revised the page to exclude them. Minor politicans who may or may not have any lasting impact on the town should be left off. I have a feeling partisans and/or the politicians staff are the ones responsible for putting those names in.

Claims of violence?
''There has been some street violence in the area recently, including several gang-related stabbings, as well as shootings in the Downtown Flushing area. This violence mostly occurs in the public housing projects (Bland Houses) or in section 8 housing[citation needed] throughout the neighborhood as well as areas near by. In 2000, five workers were shot to death after closing in a Wendy's restaurant on Main Street.''

I recall the Wendy's incident, but what of the other claims? It's funny to read when you consider this sentence comes after it:

The crime rate in Flushing has dropped significantly since the 1990's, mirroring the city-wide decrease in crime.

And the next sentence:

''Immigrants from El Salvador have found homes and apartments along Northern Boulevard from 147st on the east to 153rd st on the west. They have found work mostly in Construction. The gang known as Ms13 is also a big problem in the community, rivaling with other gangs such as the Zulu Nation, Bloods, Crips, Folk nation, Latin kings and other street gangs in the area.''

I can agree with the rise of immigrants, but where's the indication that most of them are Honduran? What about the gang-crime claims? If unverified information is posted on Wikipedia, shouldn't it be taken down before it can?

wtf
see underline --Voidvector 14:27, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Flushing is a major transportation hub with major air, rail and bus links within a half-mile of downtown _____________? The Q 48 on roosevelt avenue takes you to La Guardia airport. Maybe someone can rephrase or make this unobscure.

Flushing's nicknames
Im from Flushing and I refer to Flushing either as Flushing, Flushing City, Flushtown or where I live Flushing Heights, but I have never heard anyone say Forbidden city. Can any one verify "Forbidden City?

Reply:
never heard of that, i've been living in flushing my whole life. We call it Flush Town, or FLu-Shang

OFC! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.72.4.71 (talk) 06:34, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Building projects in Flushing
Building projects in Flushing:
 * Flushing Commons:
 * RKO Plaza:

My Changes
I have made a number major changes to this article within the past month. If any of you see any of above changes as unfit, feel free to voice your concerns. --Voidvector 22:03, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Sort bullets in History section into sentences
 * Split crime part of the History section into its own section
 * Divide history section into 3 major periods/subsections
 * Merge some of the Interesting Facts into History sections
 * Split the intro paragraph and created the Demographics section from it.

Boundaries
Flushing is bounded by willets point boulevard on the north jewel avenue to the south francis lewis boulevard to the east and shea stadium to the west.

Population
"while the total population has increased to 54,488". If the boundaries above are correct then flushing population has to be well above 100,000 if not 150,000. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.202.106.183 (talk • contribs)


 * I wrote that whole paragraph based on this research paper, no clue what its boundaries are. --Voidvector 21:42, 29 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Like the four other original townships of Queens County, Town of Flushing contained a village of the same name. As in the case of Hempstead, Jamaica etc, population figures are meaningless if you don't know whether they refer to the village, the township, or some more modern designated territory.  Jim.henderson 10:11, 30 July 2007 (UTC)


 * If you downloaded the research paper, you can find the numbers in Table 1 on page 6 of the PDF (page 63 of the journal). It says in the footnote, "Source: Census of Population and Housing: Census Tracts, 1970, 1980, 1990." Census Tracts is a geographic unit used by the US Census, in Queens they each contain about a few thousand residents. The paper failed to mention the selection of tracts used. Here is author's bio page, if you want to email him and ask. --Voidvector 17:46, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Wendy's massacre
Since the crime section has been removed, I have reinstated Wendy's massacre in the history. There has been some concern over its noteworthiness, so I am going to bring it up here. It is something that stands out from most other crimes that happened in Flushing. It received national media coverage that day. Lots of TV news vans came to Flushing lined up alone Main St. If this is not mentioned, I believe the sentence about British Pavilion bomb at World's Fair should also be removed. --Voidvector 09:14, 3 September 2007 (UTC)


 * If you can write it up in a way that emphasizes that it was unusual for Flushing (with references), that's fine with me.--Gilabrand 09:18, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Residents
Regarding edits by Gilabrand, It says "Notable current and former residents", not someone who was born in Flushing. Example: Lewis Latimer lived in Flushing. Note sure about all the other ones you removed, but this one I know off my head. Also Flushing is not called a "city" since it is part of "New York City". --Voidvector 11:45, 3 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I grew up in Flushing, and I know that it's a city. You can check it on any official Flushing site. It was incorporated as a village in 1877 and declared a city in 1964. So yes, it's a city in New York City! Before removing these names from the list of Flushing residents, I checked their bios. If you have no source to show they live in Flushing, they don't belong on the list. This list is inflated way beyond acceptable proportions, and hence aroused my suspicion. It is highly unlikely that many of the people who are still on the list actually lived there. I left a few who had some connection with Queens - but Queens is not necessarily Flushing. Anyway, this is an encyclopedia - so if you can prove it, OK. Otherwise, it will be deleted. --Gilabrand 12:40, 3 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Not sure what official site you talking about that refers to flushing as "city". --Voidvector 02:11, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Have a look at the website of the Flushing City Council http://www.flushingcity.com/City_Council.html--Gilabrand 04:39, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
 * That's Flushing, Michigan, not the neighborhood in Queens. Alansohn 04:56, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry about that. I guess I didn't look closely enough. My Enyclopedia Britannica (1977), vol. IV, p. 200, has an entry on Flushing that reads: Flushing, zoned city, northern section of the borough of Queens, New York City. When I lived in Flushing from 1960-1971, it was always referred to as the "city of Flushing," and my father was on the city council. Maybe things have changed. I guess it's been a while.--Gilabrand 06:29, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Violence
WENDYS MASSACRE IS NOT GANG RELATED. It was a boched robbery. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.23.241.208 (talk) 20:51, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

1970's - present
When did flushing become a major urban area for Queens? What race / ethnicity lived there and just any modern history anyone can add? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.202.86.91 (talk) 22:35, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Cultural whitewashing efforts?

 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Flushing%2C_Queens&diff=223005750&oldid=222199937
 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Flushing%2C_Queens&diff=212981734&oldid=212658060 --Voidvector (talk) 10:41, 2 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Looks like they were flushed down the drain. Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? 11:10, 2 July 2008 (UTC)


 * More cultural whitewashing --Voidvector (talk) 22:12, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

70's 80's 90's
Flushings history stops in after the worlds fair? NOTHING is said from the 70's to the present day? Nice job. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.23.223.101 (talk) 21:57, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Main picture
The best picture for this article for this article would been a view of the Flushing Skyline while traveling northbound on the van wyck (or south maybe just as good if not better). Getting a picture of the Carlye skyline towers to northern boulevard. FlushinQwnzNyc (talk) 03:28, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

"Stinky"
I deleted this word from the description of the South Asian community market, because 1) whether or not it stinks is a matter of persepective, not fact, and 2) the adjective carries a negative and stereotypical racial connotation that does not fall within Wikipedia's neutrality guidelines. Davidecurtis335 (talk) 02:37, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Demography
Amen to last revision, immediately above.Dogru144 (talk) 02:40, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Here is a very good source for Queens, NY, demography:

http://www.queenslibrary.org/pub/cns2000_slct_branch.asp

Dogru144 (talk) 02:40, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Low income housing
So im guessing that there isnt any low income public housing? OR someone is trying to make Flushing look more affluent and not include it by deleting it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.202.104.175 (talk) 16:18, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Demography
Yea ummmmm Asian American, Asian American, Asian American, Asian American. There are OTHER people who live in 'Flushing mind you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.202.104.175 (talk) 16:41, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Flushing - one of the best neighborhoods in NYC
Flushing is one of the best neighborhoods in New York City. This article is a general article about this our neighborhhod. If you want to write about low-income housing, gang violence or chinatowns in the United States, start an article in this encyclopedia regarding those topics. Those topics DO NOT DEFINE FLUSHING and the writers who obsesively write about these subjects clearly have a warped view of Flushing and the lifestyle that the homeowners and residents of Flushing enjoy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by WalterBowne (talk • contribs) 04:25, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Demographics
Can we have a comprehensive and standard demographic section. White, black, non white hispanic, asian, native american and other? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.72.6.2 (talk) 22:03, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

What about the efforts made by locals to kick out illegal immigrants from China? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C5:E08D:8A00:8C60:F418:3DAD:9FA3 (talk) 08:01, 22 February 2020 (UTC)

20th century and worlds fair
Information about the 20th century ends at .......1964. This article between demographics and 20th century needs a complete re-write. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.120.26.217 (talk) 03:59, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Demographics
This paragraph is misleading and misinforming in that.


 * Mentions Queens as a whole rather than informing about Flushing
 * Is extremely informing of Asian Americans in Queens County rather than Flushing
 * Compares Queens Asian Americans to Brooklyns.
 * Uses the 5th congressional district of New York (which includes a whole lot of more neighborhodos than just flushing.
 * Says nothing about any other race besides Asian American.

"The 2000 United States Census Bureau ranked Queens County as the ninth most populous county in the United States with over 2.2 million residents. According to the Census Bureau, Queens County experienced over a 14% increase in population since the 1990 census.

The 2000 Census also reflected the growth of the Asian American population in Queens County with over 391,500 people identifying themselves as Asian Americans, it has garnered the nickname "Little Korea". That number was the largest in New York City, more than twice the number of people identifying themselves as Asian-American in Brooklyn. The 2000 Census revealed that the 5th Congressional District had almost 655,000 residents. Approximately 364,200 residents or 55% of the District identified themselves as white. A total of 160,896 residents or 25% of the District identified themselves as Asian Americans and 153,721 or 24% identified themselves as Hispanic."

151.202.104.132 (talk) 22:36, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Can someone repost demographic data from the US Census - the percentages add up to way over 100%. —Preceding unsigned comment added by FreedomFodder (talk • contribs) 00:17, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

English speakers call "Vlissingen" "Flushing"?
I've added a dubious tag to this statement. I have never heard any modern day English speaker refer to "Vlissingen" as "Flushing". I think this statement is simply false. "Flushing" was perhaps an historical appellation, but that usage has apparently died out. Googling confirms this. The town of Vlissingen confirms that they have no policy of using "Flushing" in English. Wikipedia is one of the few places where this connection is still made. "Flushing" not the same as "The Hague", which is still in modern use in English. It seems to me that a few history buffs are promoting the usage of "Flushing" as an English name for nostalgiac or romantic reasons, even though the usage has almost completely died out and surives only in the names of Flushing in Cornwall and New York. Schildewaert (talk) 07:25, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Navigation maps in England call it Flushing. They speak English in England.

Many towns are changed in English; Livorno=Leghorn, Firenze=Florence, Moskva=Moscow. Why argue? 2A00:23C5:E08D:8A00:8C60:F418:3DAD:9FA3 (talk) 07:59, 22 February 2020 (UTC)

Deletion of Sports section
Even though the Mets are always listed as playing in Flushing, they are not located in the actual neighborhood itself. They play in a different zip code (Corona, not Flushing). The same applies to the US Tennis Center. Therefore I deleted the Sports section, since the brief mention in the Flushing Meadows Park section should be sufficient. Richiekim (talk) 13:40, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Joking?
168% thats amazing.... This article needs a serious revision or a complete rewrite. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.202.98.103 (talk) 00:50, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Religious diversity of Flushing a bunch of malarky
There is literally a church on every other block in Flushing. And they're all Asian ironically. I can count 75 from 190th-160th street no exaggeration (and the streets skip from 179th to 170th because of Utopia blvd). If you take a 10 minute drive down 35th starting from Francis Lewis going twords Main Street, you will see exactly what I'm talking about.

I think all they do is build these fake churches so they don't have to pay taxes on the property. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.72.4.168 (talk) 05:41, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

Well, well. If properly sourced, this could add to the article. If true, how’d this scam get started, and why here? 2A00:23C5:E08D:8A00:8C60:F418:3DAD:9FA3 (talk) 08:25, 22 February 2020 (UTC)

Religion in Flushing
I do not see anything in the article about the various Jewish and Christian groups within the area.Presario2200 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 15:20, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

Numbers for Demographics?
Any numbers to back up the demographics? I'd like to know how it's changed historically. Anyone know a good source? caz | speak 18:29, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Town of Flushing Vs. Village of Flushing
This article should be split into 2 articles, one for the Town and the other for the Village. Either that or clarification needs to be made in every instance. Many of the statements made in the article apply to one or the other or are misstated because of the common confusion between the two. For example CB7 is not the only CB that covers the area of the town of Flushing. Queens College is in the Town of Flushing though not in the village. --69.86.207.199 (talk) 02:17, 22 May 2012 (UTC)