Talk:Force majeure

Reminder
This post is to remind myself that I'm going to add to this page because I also have to deliver a presentation on force majeure to my legal class. Yes, don't forget, self. --Psients 04:25, 14 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Pronunciation
Does anyone know how to pronounce this term correctly? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.197.216.5 (talk) 06:39, 2005 December 21 (UTC)


 * Majeure is normally pronounced Mahj-yer in England. --Legis (talk - contributions) 21:40, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

English translation
I have a question about the English logic of that locution. I just wondered why isn't "force majeure" translated normally in English. I mean, it could easily be translated as "exceptional force", "major unexpected events", "major force" (simply) or others. So, why isn't it translated ? Louis-Philippe
 * It has since been translated. -- Beland (talk) 17:33, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Oh, I guess you meant in general use, not just the article. That happens with a lot of legal terms; it's just legal jargon that makes the speaker sound smarter, and if you ask me, snootier. -- Beland (talk) 18:22, 22 February 2015 (UTC)

Merge with Act of God
Aren't these two terms legally the same? --DDG 20:14, 12 January 2006 (UTC)


 * No, as war isn't an act of God, for example. David 20:41, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

No, it should not be merged, as they can mean two different things and I would not necessarily mix religion and natural events, as it could offend certain people that do not believe in God. Louis-Philippe

Do we need these references to a deity? What about just saying forces of nature? Wikipedia is supposed to be neutral. --Kadakas 18:41, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I think we're tied into historical precedent.. I'm not a lawyer but I think "Act of God" has a specific legal meaning. —Cliffb 23:56, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

fuerza mayor —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.112.84.138 (talk) 21:30, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

Examples?
Are there any appropriate historical examples to add here? That would be a good thing to add for those knowledgeable about the subject. Tito xd (?!? - help us) 04:40, 10 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Yes, perhaps any relevant cases that the layperson would be familiar with. JD79 13:43, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Unless anyone disagrees I'll edit the example to use 'act of god' rather than 'act of nature' on the basis that I've never seen a single actual contract that uses 'act of nature'. Wiki fini (talk) 20:10, 20 February 2009 (UTC)
 * That is OK by me. Bearian (talk) 20:33, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Article inside out
Currently, the article starts with describing the secondary and adapted meaning of an excusing clause, while parenthetically mentioning the core meaning of a greater force, uncontrollable circumstances, whathaveyou. The resulting awkwardness and lack of logic is demonstrated by the section on the military term, which is perfectly logical and consistent within an article that begins with a description of the core meaning.

Force majeure is, notably, a term in reasonably common English and international use, wrt this core meaning. The "legalese" version is, in my subjective impression, noticeably rarer (outside, obviously, some specific contexts like contract law and insurance policies).

Correspondingly, I strongly recommend that the article is re-written to first discuss the core meaning, its implications, what can be considered (not considered) force majeure in various contexts, and then move on to describing special cases and derived meanings.

Note that this does not prevent the legal concept from dominating the article as a whole, should this be appropriate. 94.220.240.140 (talk) 21:50, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

French Use
Actually we tend to use "Cas de Force Majeur" instead of "Cas fortuit" wich is a specific term for insurance company process. Beside it's not exactly the same as "fortuit" mean unpredictable and kind of random and "Force Majeur" carry more like an overwhelming sense. like when everything was done according to law and regulation and YET something happend anyway. GorkamWorka (talk) 07:18, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

In Greek: ανώτερα βία — Preceding unsigned comment added by 123.211.211.153 (talk) 10:36, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Cas fortuit and vis major
Actually they don't mean the same thing. Cas fortuit means something unpredictable, thus unavoidable (but only because of its lack of prediction). On the other hand, vis major means something unavoidable, even if correctly predicted (e.g.: a cyclone). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.85.122.142 (talk) 21:18, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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Unexplained claim in France section
It currently says "Force majeure and cas fortuit are distinct notions in French Law.", but doesn't at all explain what the difference is, and in fact the term "cas fortuit" doesn't appear anywhere else in the article.--108.86.123.85 (talk) 07:44, 13 March 2021 (UTC)