Talk:Francis Doud

Unreliable sources
, could you please identify which sources are considered unreliable sources? This clarification would be beneficial for understanding the context. Greg Henderson (talk) 04:36, 21 August 2023 (UTC)


 * After the discussion at User_talk:Greghenderson2006, do you really have to ask? It's aggravating that you're asking this. Graywalls (talk) 04:38, 21 August 2023 (UTC)


 * I just spent 40 minutes cleaning up the tone and puffery. Haven't yet started checking the sourcing other than one in the lead - where I found and corrected an inaccuracy. Netherzone (talk) 03:30, 24 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Removed two unreliable sources to Family Search. This is user-submitted content. Netherzone (talk) 16:15, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
 * A cleanup of the Francis Doud article has been done via Request Edits. I believe the article now has a WP:POV and based on WP:RS for the following reasons:
 * Depth of coverage
 * Primary and secondary sources
 * Biography information
 * Historic Doud House coverage and citations
 * Military career citations and biography information
 * Historic Doud Ranch (Garrapata State Park) coverage and citations
 * Once the request edits have been implemented, please remove the WP:POV and WP:RS tags. Thanks! Greg Henderson (talk) 17:21, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit A

 * Please update the following for answers to editors questions:
 * Better source needed: Remove citation for for sentence, "Doud died in his home on Van Buren Street on December 3, 1910, in Monterey, California, at the age of 90." Replace "Family" citation with
 * According to who: Please replace the setence in question with the following: "Among the contents are two letters of correspondence addressed to Doud, one letter directed to Francis Doud, Jr. concerning his father's death; two letters concerning property matters in Monterey, California (according to the The Society of California Pioneers), without explicitly stating Doud's role; an excerpt from a Berlin newspaper detailing the 1906 San Francisco earthquake; and a letter discussing an unidentified wounded soldier from the Mexican War. Greg Henderson (talk) 21:40, 24 August 2023 (UTC)

1st request is done as part of completing request B. The second request, I will leave it open. Graywalls (talk) 19:31, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Deactivating request as it has been pending for more than a month with nobody willing to implement it. * Pppery * it has begun... 23:07, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit B

 * Please update the following for answers to editors questions:
 * Under "Death and Legacy" please add the following citation for died at home:
 * Replace the bogus citation: with this one: Greg Henderson (talk) 16:57, 25 August 2023 (UTC)


 * ✅ Graywalls (talk) 19:29, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit C
Greg Henderson (talk) 21:50, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Please add the following image to the Francis Doud infobox.
 * File:Francis Doud.jpg with the caption: Francis Doud (1820-1910)
 * ✅ * Pppery * it has begun... 23:07, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit D

 * 1) Under Military career, please add an extra source citation after the setence: Doud was the custodian of government property at the Presidio of Monterey. This source talks about his grandfather Francis Doud being station at the Presidio.
 * 2) In the same section, for 1st verification failed message, please remove the "DPR 523" source and replace with the "ref name="Barrows" citation.
 * 3) Under Early life, please add under citation needed for James Cooper Doud, a real-estate developer the following supportive source citations: Greg Henderson (talk) 16:59, 26 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Deactivating request as it has been pending for more than a month with nobody willing to implement it. * Pppery * it has begun... 23:07, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit E

 * 1) Under "Military career" section, for 2nd verification failed message, after "They arrived in San Francisco on July 8, 1849 and then moved to Monterey, California," and remove "DPR 523" and "Ann Doud" citations and replace with: "They sailed from New York for California in the ship Orpheus, and arrived in San Francisco on July 8, 1849. They moved to Monterey, California in 1850.
 * 2) Under "Military career" section, last paragraph, for "sergeant-at-arms and messenger during the Constitutional Convention" claim, remove the "Cotton Hall" "DPR 523" citations, and replace with this citation: Greg Henderson (talk) 18:01, 31 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Deactivating request as it has been pending for more than a month with nobody willing to implement it. * Pppery * it has begun... 23:07, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit F
Under section for "Rancho San José y Sur Chiquito", please add the following text and citations: Under "Doud House" section: Greg Henderson (talk) 22:55, 31 August 2023 (UTC) Not going to implement this request because citations are not reliable. Greg Henderson (talk) 01:05, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * "Doud supplied beef to Monterey's Presidio, receiving one of California's initial 100 brands, and lending his name to the Doud Creek that runs south of Garrapata State Park."
 * Replace the "DPR 523" citation with the following online citation for the Doud House 177 Van Buren DPR Historic Documents, which is a PDF that covers the Doud House and its specifications.

Proposed merge of Doud House into Francis Doud
Some overlap and duplicate. Once all the fluff, puff and commercialism are completely cut out, the two together would be perfectly comfortable reading length. Graywalls (talk) 02:59, 1 September 2023 (UTC)


 * Against - the Doud House is a historic building rather than a person. Much like other historic buildings, it should remain as an article because of the following reasons:
 * The Doud House stands as a distinct architectural entity within the catalog of the Monterey State Historic Park
 * The structure is recognized as an important building in Monterey's downtown historic properties
 * The building's historical significance stands as Monterey's earliest examples of wood frame vernacular architecture
 * The Doud House Archives are specifically tied to the structure itself rather than any individual associated with it
 * It ranks among the oldest buildings in the state of California
 * Greg Henderson (talk) 15:43, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit G
Greg Henderson (talk) 16:41, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Under "Early life" section, since FamilySearch, Ancestry, FindAGrave is not allowed.
 * Please add the following citation for Doud's parents.
 * For his children, please add the following citation.
 * What reliable source made the connection that these are the appropriate records? Graywalls (talk) 16:52, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * US government census records and migration records by the state are reliable because they were done by state officials. They are generally considerd reliable for historical purposes. Do you have a better source for such records? Greg Henderson (talk) 16:58, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * No, I mean, who made the interpretation that this is the right record for this Francis Doud? Graywalls (talk) 22:19, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * In Francis Doud's case, he came from Ireland. I made the interpretation that the U.S. census and migration records for Doud were reliable records to list his parents and children. Greg Henderson (talk) 23:03, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * ❌ Per Graywalls. * Pppery * it has begun... 23:07, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Request Edit H
Greg Henderson (talk) 21:10, 1 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Add requested citation under under early life for the sentence: "They had six children: Frank, Nellie, Mary, Thomas, Martin and Edward"


 * ✅ 94rain  Talk  09:05, 6 December 2023 (UTC)