Talk:Franz Josef Glacier/Archive 1

Retreat Illustration
If anyone goes to Franz Josef there is a sign on one of the observation points with a diagram illustrating the retreat of the glacier. It shows a diagram of the valley with the glacier's extent at various points marked on it. The sign dramatically illustrates this retreat and growth cycle and, I think, would really contribute to the article. --Chr1sday87 01:01, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Something like this? Mrfebruary (talk) 10:47, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

File:Franz josef Glacier LC0250.jpg to appear as POTD
Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that File:Franz josef Glacier LC0250.jpg will be appearing as picture of the day on June 11, 2013. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2013-06-11. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page. Thanks! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:24, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

Waiho moraine loop
Added info and links to sources. However, I am not sure linking directly to a satellite image of the structure is allowed. The first link contains a regular picture. I think it's fascinating that the terminal moraine shows up so clearly, due to being the only place not cleared for farming. Makes me wonder if the Fox glacier terminus was actually cleared in the past.

So, anyone here smart enough to make an image that would be allowed to be used?Fxmastermind (talk) 15:39, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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Global warming
It is highly contentious and unscientific to suggest that "As is the case for most other New Zealand glaciers which are mainly found on the eastern side of the southern alps, the shrinking process is attributed to global warming".

Global warming is unlikely to have any effect on the glacier. As with Fox, the glaciers advance and retreat relates directly to snowfall in the snowfield above, which in turn is directly associated with rainfall. Global warming has been going on since the last Ice Age, possibly accelerating this century. Although Franz Josef has been shrinking since the Ice Age, it had been growing recently - due to increased rainfall.

One of the effects of global warming is increased West Coast rainfall, which should over time mean that the glaciers grow (or at least that their rate of shrinking will be reduced). The Ministry for the Environment confirmed that "The West Coast is expected to become wetter, particularly in winter and spring"- http://mfe.govt.nz/issues/climate/about/climate-change-affect-regions/west-coast.html.Royalcourtier (talk) 23:11, 24 January 2015 (UTC)


 * The content, as written, is supported by a New Zealand Herald article from 2007. It is likely that a more recent reliable source could be found. --Walter Siegmund (talk) 03:02, 3 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Just backing that up: numerous reliable sources on the glaciers, including scientific publications by glaciologists, make it clear that they are rapidly retreating, will shrink by kilometres, and that recent human-indiced climate change is the cause. I've started citing some of them, and shifting the tone of the article away from the idea that the glacier is fluctuating to a clear statement that it is in retreat. —Giantflightlessbirds (talk) 22:56, 11 October 2020 (UTC)

Speed of glacier
I've temporarily removed the following text "and at times advanced at the phenomenal (by glacial standards) rate of 70 centimetres (28 in) a day. The flow rate is about 10 times that of typical glaciers." which comes from a list of facts on a hotel website, not really a top-notch source. Plus a couple of NZ Geographic articles talk about a much greater speed, of 7 m a day. Just back-of-the-envelope, ice moving 11 km in five years (11000 / (5 x 365)) is about 6 m per day. I'm trying to find a better estimate and better source for the speed. —Giantflightlessbirds (talk) 10:28, 12 October 2020 (UTC)

Requested move 15 September 2021

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 

The result of the move request was: moved. per discussion consensus and WP:NCNZ. There may be an ongoing discussion about changing that convention, but for now, the current guideline is how we adjudicate and close discussions. When/if that guideline changes to not support dual names here, this can be revisited. (closed by non-admin page mover) — Shibboleth ink  (♔ ♕) 12:56, 26 September 2021 (UTC)

Franz Josef Glacier → Franz Josef Glacier / Kā Roimata o Hine Hukatere – official name since 1998, it's time to move along now and update this. Gryffindor (talk) 07:55, 15 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Oppose per WP:CONCISE and WP:COMMONNAME. — HTGS (talk) 07:57, 19 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Oppose The guidelines are very clear that the official name of a place is not sufficient to change the title of a Wikipedia article. As per WP:NCGN, WP:RECENTISM, and WP:COMMONNAME, there is not sufficient evidence to show that the requested name is commonly used to the point were an article name change is required. Spekkios (talk) 09:44, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment Also see WP:CONCISE, WP:UCRN, and here Spekkios (talk) 06:27, 24 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Support as per NZ naming conventions. Would move towards consistency/standardization between NZ articles and the dual name is used in places besides officially required sources (esp. academic articles) as per WP:WIAN and NZ naming conventions for dual names. EmeraldRange (talk) 20:35, 22 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Support. As EmeraldRange has demonstrated, "there are sources that indicate that a dual name has usage beyond mandatory official usage", from the NZ naming conventions, so in line with other comparable articles such as Mayor Island / Tuhua, Aoraki / Mount Cook and Matiu / Somes Island, the article should be moved. See a similar discussion at Talk:Aoraki / Mount Cook back in 2007, which led to the creation of the naming conventions. —Giantflightlessbirds (talk) 21:11, 22 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Naming conventions (New Zealand), the relevant and official wikipedia naming convention, reads in part Dual names. If there are sources that indicate that a dual name has usage beyond mandatory official usage, put the article at the dual name, with redirects from each of the component names... If sources do not support use of the dual name, the English name will almost certainly be the one in common usage. Andrewa (talk) 08:50, 23 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Support. As above users have stated, WP:NZNC requires that places names that have a dual name which has usage "beyond mandatory official usage" be located at the dual place name, with redirects from either component. Other users have clearly demonstrated that the dual name of Franz Josef Glacier / Kā Roimata o Hine Hukatere is in use outside of sources required to use it. As such, the page should be moved to the dual name. Turnagra (talk) 03:11, 24 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Support as per dual / bi lingual use in New Zealand English. Stuartyeates (talk) 02:39, 25 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Support as per NZ naming conventions. There is usage beyond mandatory official usage therefore it should be moved. ShakyIsles (talk) 04:31, 25 September 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment: It might be worth noting these ongoing discussions:
 * Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (New Zealand)
 * Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (New Zealand)
 * There may be some question of whether the relevant aspect of NZ naming conventions actually reflect[s] the consensus of the community. While these discussions are ongoing, I decline to present my own opinion on this proposed move. BilledMammal (talk) 07:16, 25 September 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
 * Comment. There is a current RfC proposal draft on the guidelines for dual names. Spekkios (talk) 23:51, 25 September 2021 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Fox Glacier / Te Moeka o Tuawe which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 01:47, 2 November 2021 (UTC)