Talk:Fremantle

earlier comments
Fremantle, Australia has been moved to Fremantle, because there is only one Fremantle(unless you count the guy it's named after). -- Tim Starling 08:57 Mar 6, 2003 (UTC)

Quite surprised that Fremantle has so little content. Are there any Perth editors who are Freo based that can contribute? There is a lot of history in Freo that can be told, and certainly you'd not be a true Perth person without spending part of your childhood in Freo or eating at Cicerello's at least.

I'm pretty sure the image http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Fremantle_tagged_gnangarra.jpg has the train station tagged incorrectly. To my knowledge, the train station is actually not visible in the photograph, being to the right of the harbour control building. -- G solon 19:03, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree. The green turret dome belongs to Barwil House which is about 4 blocks south-west of the train station on cliff street. The arch-looking structure (which probably caused the confusion) appears to be part of the modern innards of one of the buildings between Mouat and Henry streets.  MuJoCh 21:02, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree to the tagged bulding is on the west side of the park opposite TS which is on the north side inthe image under the first crane, I'll re tagged and place a new image there shortly Gnangarra 10:00, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Pronunciation
Are we sure that "Frem A ntle" is universally pronounced as "Fr EE mantle"? I've been here for over 40 years, and the only people I ever heard use "Fr EE mantle" have been po English migrants -- and only a few at that. Gordon | Talk, 05 November 2006 @05:35 UTC
 * I lived around there for 25+ years, and I think the pronunciation section of the article is pretty accurate. And I'm not a pommy English migrant either ;) - Gobeirne 08:35, 5 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Born here > 50 years ago.  But I suspect an "old money" class preference for "Frem A ntle". Callophylla 04:41, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

I live way over on the other side :p - I always thought it was exactly the opposite to what it appears to be saying in the article. An untutored reader (such as myself) would pronounce it with the first syllable enunciated as FREE, whereas a local would shorten that up to sound like FRUH. So there you go.
 * Either way, can we move it to somewhere other than the leading paragraph. It seems as if it plopped there after some pub brawl on the issue. I also gave it over to WP:WA, Stirling's camp be damned!  -  Fredmantle
 * I agree that it shouldn't be in the first paragraph. I was born and raised in Freo so I will put have to some work into this article. I mean come on, the [Hamersley, Western Australia|Hamersley] article has 75 references, and this one has a whole four... Also (because I can't resist having my $0.02) I have always pronounced it FREEmantle, and East FREEmantle. If it weren't pronounced like that, it wouldn't be shortened to FREE-oh! Many people, both locals and non-locals, do say it the other way, but that doesn't make it right ;-) +203.161.90.233 16:49, 14 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Um, that was me; thought I was logged in, obviously not. +Bass hound 16:55, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

FREE-mantle
I have put the pronunciation guide to freo as a footnote. There did not seem to be anywhere else to put it yet. I added a tiny bit and another reference. Fred 17:13, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Carmen Lawrence
The article as it stood mentioned that Carmen Lawrence was a "significant political figure" which Fremantle had "produced". It then went on to say that she was the first female Australian Premier etc. I have removed it to this talk page for discussion because it did not have a citation. It does not seem right to me. Sure, she's a significant (and controversial) political figure, but I am not convinced that Fremantle has had much to do with this at all. Her article says she was born in Northam, went to various schools elsewhere in Perth and WA, taught in Melbourne, and she was first elected to the WA parliament as the member for Subiaco, and then after a redistribution, got re-elected twice as member for Glendalough, once while she was Premier. The only time that Fremantle seems to even come into her biography was when she stood for it, a safe Labor seat. To claim that Fremantle somehow nurtured her into her success ignores that she was already high-profile, significant and controversial well before she had anything to do with Fremantle. - Mark 11:09, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Fremantle was a seat of convenience(safe labor) when she moved across to Federal Politics, while she may be a significant figure in Fremantle, she isnt the product of Fremantle. From memory she had resigned/lost the state election as premier before moving to federal politics. Gnangarra 12:03, 20 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Gnangarra's memory is pretty acurate, when she lost the State Election in February, 1993, she remained as leader of the opposition until early 1994. She was the member for Subiaco (then Glendalough) until that time - then when John Dawkins resigned from Federal politics in 1994 she was 'parachuted' into the safe (labour) federal seat of Fremantle - only after her pre-selection did she purchase a townhouse in North Fremantle, which given her federal duties didn't reside there for signficant periods. She remained as the member for Fremantle until the 2007 elections. During that time it is fairly safe to say she didn't do much for her local electorate. Not to disimilar to the current encumbant, Melissa Parke, who grew up in the south-west and was a UN lawyer, before being 'parachuted' into the safe seat - only moving into the area after her preselection. Once again, though earlier days, she hasn't done much for her electorate either. Dan arndt (talk) 01:20, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Freo newspaper clipping database
There is a new and growing database of newspaper articles relating to Fremantle: http://fremantle.archives.org.au/data/newspaper_clippings (in case anyone's interested). 203.190.192.130 (talk) 03:39, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Translation into Chinese Wikipedia
The 04:24, 26 November 2008 124.169.95.182 version of this article is translated into Chinese Wikipedia.--Wing (talk) 10:04, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks Wing. I added the inter-language link 费利曼图 to this page.  It appears there's an editing restriction on, so could you add Fremantle, Western Australia to the article there please.  –Moondyne 14:19, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Fremantle a city?
Does Freemantle count as a city? I've lived in Perth my whole life and have only ever heard/thought of it as a suburb, whilst it is one of the most famous and major suburb, Perth would still be the city no?
 * Yes it is a city; it is one of the 17 metropolitan cities in the Perth metro area. It is also spelt with only one 'e': Fremantle. —Sam Wilson 02:03, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
 * It's slightly confusing, as the City of Fremantle is a city (extending to the cemetery and south past South Beach), Fremantle (this article) relates to a declared city under royal charter (1929) which preceded the entire system of local government as we now know it (which was legislated in 1960 and came into effect in 1961), and is a handy place to place stuff about culture and stuff which normally goes with cities, and Fremantle (suburb) is its central suburb. And of course Fremantle is entirely within the Perth metropolitan area. This problem comes up time and again on Australian articles as we're practically the only country which delineates suburbs in all metropolitan areas rather than simply the outskirts, and one of the very few that distinguishes LGAs and historic cities. When people talk about "Fremantle" in Perth they usually mean the suburb. Orderinchaos 13:10, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Potential copyvio
To be safe, I have removed the following content"The Whadjuk identify six seasons which guided their movement across the land. For instance during Djeran (cool weather April to May) families moved back along the Swan River away from the coast. When Makuru (cold and wet June to July) came the Whadjuk moved further inland to their winter camps. By the time of Kambarang (warm and rain decreasing October to November) the Whadjuk had started to move back to the coast as the weather warmed up." which was apparently pasted from here. Cheers, Bjenks (talk) 04:13, 31 October 2012 (UTC)

Proposing title change for 'prehistory'
The title ' prehistory' should be amended to 'Aboriginal (pre-European settlement)' or something similar which acknowledges that there was a civilization with its own history prior to European settlement. The term 'prehistory' is dismissive of the Aboriginal civilization suggesting there was nothing significant prior and the 'history of Australia' only happened once Europeans settled in Australia. What does everybody else think? COF6160 (talk) 01:59, 7 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Do you dispute the titles of these pages? - HappyWaldo (talk) 05:03, 7 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Hmm, yes, I agreed with you when I first read your comment COF6160, but it seems that 'prehistory' just means "the span of time before recorded history or the invention of writing systems". Probably an argument to be made re the written record, but still, this heading is probably reasonably correct, in these terms, and should stay. Sam Wilson 05:16, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

Going through the prehistory page it seems there already is already a debate about what constitutes 'written history' as paintings and designs may also fall into 'written history' if they could be interpreted as a form of language [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Prehistory#Not_quite_correct. see here] and here.. This is a whole separate debate which I'll let the experts battle it out. However, it still doesn't sound right to me to call everything prior to European settlement as prehistory especially considering the Aboriginal people/culture/traditions etc still exists to this day. They recorded their history through their tradition of oral stories and paintings so it seems dismissive to ignore how they passed on their history in favour of the European tradition. Even if it is implied with 'prehistory', I still think we should emphasize with a pre-European settlement heading. COF6160 (talk) 04:41, 9 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Pre-history I think achieves an acceptable WP:NPOV title in relation to the period before settlement, and that the enduring Aboriginal cultural aspectss should be recognised as such within the other sections section, including politics Gnangarra 06:26, 9 November 2012 (UTC)


 * This is, if you would excuse me for saying so, not releveant here - it should be at WP:AWNB - as it has relevance across the whole Australian project - not one location, otherwise there is, I suspect a serious issue arising from WP:UNDUE SatuSuro 05:01, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Why dont we just remove the prehistory title, history starts at the beginning and then highlights major shifts. It covers aboriginal settlement, exploration etc, then the first subsection is settlement and so on. Gnangarra 13:35, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

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Climate
I was sure that articles like this have climate down the other end - it seems far too high above other information which by practice should come earlier in the article - anyone with any thoughts on this ?? JarrahTree 12:37, 7 June 2017 (UTC)

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External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110217233418/http://www.fremantleprison.com.au/Cultural_Heritage/heritagesignificance/worldheritagelist/Pages/default.aspx to http://www.fremantleprison.com.au/Cultural_Heritage/heritagesignificance/worldheritagelist/Pages/default.aspx
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130302071031/http://www.fremantle.wa.gov.au/festivals/Fremantle_Festival to http://www.fremantle.wa.gov.au/festivals/Fremantle_Festival
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130213204805/http://www.fremantle.wa.gov.au/festivals/Heritage_Festival to http://www.fremantle.wa.gov.au/festivals/Heritage_Festival
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