Talk:G. B. Jones

Untitled
G. B. Jones is strongly associated with LGBT culture in Canada, specifically with the queercore movement, and is regularly listed on weblists of notable LGBT people. Would the anon user who keeps removing LGBT-related categories from this article care to explain why? Bearcat 23:49, 18 September 2005 (UTC)
 * Also, a person cannot be filed simultaneously in both Category:Canadian punk musicians and Category:Canadian musicians; the punk musicians category is already a subcategory of the general one. Wikipedia has strict rules that an article cannot be redundantly filed in that manner. Bearcat 23:59, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

Dear Bearcat, I removed those categories in the interest of being factual, not for any insidious reasons. If you read the recent essay I added to the links of Queercore, called "Queercore: the distinct identities of subculture", perhaps that will offer an explanation of why members of the queercore subculture may not wish to be affiliated with the gay and lesbian community. As well, if you read the interview with Ms. Jones in "Dangerous Drawings", you'll find she doesn't identify herself as gay/lesbian. In removing these categories I have acceded to her wishes. I hope this offers some explanation.
 * You yourself added the "bisexual artists" category to the article. LGBT does not mean "gay or lesbian"; it means gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgendered. So how exactly can she be bisexual but not LGBT? Bearcat 09:51, 14 November 2005 (UTC)

From "Queer"; ..."Because of the context in which it was reclaimed, queer has sociopolitical connotations, and is often preferred ...by those who strongly reject distinct sexual identities such as gay, lesbian...In this context, "queer" is not a synonym for LGBT..."
 * You do realize you're preaching to the choir here, don't you? I frequently identify as queer myself; the problem is that Wikipedia is an WP:NPOV encyclopedia, not a political soapbox. We cannot impose radical alternative interpretations of sexual and gender identity terms, such as the idea that queerness and LGBT-ness are mutually exclusive identities even in a person who publicly identifies as having same-gender sexual and romantic relationships. We have to work within common understanding, and use terms and ideas that the average reader can comprehend. As much as I wish we could sometimes, we can't let sex radicalism override neutrality and clarity on Wikipedia. We can and do talk about the fact that queer exists as an identity label, but we can't use it to the exclusion of more readily understood terms. Bearcat 07:52, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Name
Don't change the name of this person from 'G.B.' to something else. In all the articles I've read, in all the books mentioned here, in everyone of the links from this page, both internal and external, the name of this artist is consistently G.B. Jones. Intheshadows 23:54, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
 * The title certainly shouldn't be changed under any circumstances, but it is both permissible and encyclopedic to provide alternate names in the body of an encyclopedia article. Bearcat 00:18, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Sources to investigate
The Queen of 'Zine. Authors:	Block, Adam Source:	Advocate; 11/20/90 Issue 564, p75, 1p, 2bw Abstract:	Profiles artist and drummer of the band Fifth Column, G.B. Jones. Career history; Albums released by the group; Creative style; Major exhibitions. ISSN:	0001-8996

Year of birth?!
Even in the stubbiest stub articles, the year of birth is stated. How old is this person? When was she born? Could be 1975 or 1935 as far as I know. --85.178.101.61 (talk) 09:54, 10 April 2010 (UTC)


 * The policy for biographies (BLP) is strict. Per WP:DOB, a year or date of birth cannot be included unless it is attributed to a "reliable published source" or a "source linked to the subject" (i.e. the individual has made it public). Read WP:VERIFY and WP:BLPSOURCES. (I'm sorry that a response to your question was not provided way sooner. But at least other readers and editors will now know the reason for why it is absent from the article.) Pyxis Solitary   (yak) . L not Q. 11:27, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

External links modified
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Year of birth (again)
Year of birth is still missing after years of being around and most sentences don't have proper citations. There is a TON of stuff about Bruce La Bruce works with Jones that need filling in. Mansheimer (talk) 23:23, 20 June 2018 (UTC)


 * Please see my above response to IP editor 85.178.101.61. Pyxis Solitary   (yak) . L not Q. 11:34, 12 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The date of birth is available, please see https://coopercolegallery.com/artist/g-b-jones/. The problem is that it's a primary source. That may or may not be acceptable to other editors. Mansheimer (talk) 05:55, 8 November 2020 (UTC)

Filmography
The filmography section was a mess, mixing works by the subject with works by completely different people, not even clear what they are about and how they relate to the subject. I've kept the filmmakers own works in that list. The full list is below, so these should be sorted out and whatever relation to the subject, they should be used as inline citations, otherwise to the reader its confusing and makes no sense:


 * Queercore: How to Punk a Revolution, directed by Yony Leyser (2017)
 * Dark End of the Street, video for The Hidden Cameras, directed by G.B. Jones (2016)
 * Hot Dogs, directed by G.B. Jones (2013)
 * She Said Boom: The Story of Fifth Column, directed by Kevin Hegge (2012)
 * The Lollipop Generation, directed by G. B. Jones (2008)
 * Winning, directed by Ross McLaren (2005)
 * I Believe in the Good of Life, video for The Hidden Cameras, directed by Joel Gibb (2005)
 * She's Real, directed by Lucy Thane (1997)
 * Airplane on the Highway, video for Bob Wiseman, directed by Caroline Azar (1994)
 * The Yo-Yo Gang, directed by G. B. Jones (1992)
 * No Skin Off My Ass, directed by Bruce LaBruce (1991)
 * Like This, video for Fifth Column, directed by Bruce LaBruce and Fifth Column (1990)
 * The Troublemakers, directed by G. B. Jones (1990)
 * Cross Your Heart, directed by Suzy Richter (1989)
 * Bruce and Pepper Wayne Gacy's Home Movies, directed by Bruce LaBruce and Candy Parker (1988)
 * Boy, Girl, directed by Bruce LaBruce (1987)
 * No Guff, Egri, directed by Bruce LaBruce and Anne McLean (1985)
 * Fifth Column at the Funnel, directed by John Porter (1982)

Mansheimer (talk) 02:32, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Exhibitions
Added a couple sources for Paul Petro (entire mention of this gallery apparently missing entirely!) and La Centrale, but the others listed still have no sources so those should definitely be added otherwise if not verifiable, has to be removed. Mansheimer (talk) 02:53, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Proposed merge
Lack of sources and insufficient content issue should necessitate merging this article with G. B. Jones. Mansheimer (talk) 06:41, 8 November 2020 (UTC)

COI
Based on edit history, I suspect User:Intheshadows is connected to the subject or is the subject themselves. Many, if not most of their edits on this and other article do not use sources and suggest first-hand knowledge. Mansheimer (talk) 09:17, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * The IPs editing here recently are obviously User:Intheshadows.Mansheimer (talk) 15:13, 28 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Considering your edits are in bad faith, I'd be happy to have a moderator intervene.216.154.9.114 (talk) 05:44, 29 November 2020 (UTC)


 * How is that? You are adding unsourced text with a promotional slant. Mansheimer (talk) 06:18, 29 November 2020 (UTC)


 * I am restoring information that's already verified and referenced in the references sections, which you deleted, and on pages such as the Polaris Prize. They are hardly promotional, since the information is about a band that existed 40 years ago. The information is obviously important, otherwise the band woudn't have been nominated by their peers for a national heritage prize.216.154.9.114 (talk) 06:30, 29 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Please review WP:RS and WP:V. You need to provide actual references in the form of inline citations. None of the text you keep adding have any inline references. This is extremely important, most especially with WP:BLP articles. Mansheimer (talk) 06:39, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Also note that this isn't the article for the band Fifth Column. Only anything directly pertaining to the subject of the article, G. B. Jones, should be added, with inline references. Mansheimer (talk) 06:42, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Sexual orientation
Jones is listed as lesbian in the categories but I can't find any reliable (non-blog) sources actually identifying her as such. Surely there must be at least one interview or bio out there that does provide this detail and conforms to WP:RS, WP:V? Mansheimer (talk) 11:54, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

I assume there is also a source for her being a resident of Toronto? Mansheimer (talk) 12:02, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

Note: re Polaris Prize
Although the subject of the article is credited as a musician, and her bands are listed right at the top of the article, several editors (see above) have insisted that the fact that her band, Fifth Column was nominated for a Polaris Prize for their album To Sir With Hate under the Heritage section for three consecutive years: 2016; 2017; and 2018, is not notable These editors insist this should not be mentioned. The nomination is listed quite clearly on the Polaris Prize page for each year, and since the list is still visible, obviously it has cleared Wikipedia's criteria, and yet these editors still refuse to include it.The editor Mansheiner insists "Only anything directly pertaining to the subject of the article should be added", as if awards for albums this musician wrote and played on do not directly pertain to her. The logic behind Wikipedia's editing escapes me, as I imagine it will others, so I'll just leave this note here and give up on trying to improve this article. 216.154.9.114 (talk)
 * Yeah, the Polaris noms are already mentioned on Fifth Column (band) (still unsourced there, like the rest of that article), so stop misrepresenting the efforts of Wikipedia editors and please again review WP:RS, WP:V, WP:BLP, and WP:COI. Mansheimer (talk) 02:05, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Queer Comics
— Assignment last updated by Aqueenamary (talk) 17:13, 5 December 2022 (UTC)

recent removal of templates
I noticed someone removed templates. Looking it over, I don't find it's been resolved and I have reverted the template removal. , since you touched on this concern earlier as well, would you mind looking over if the article in current state is ready for template removal? Graywalls (talk) 00:49, 6 December 2022 (UTC)
 * No, I don't agree with their removal at all. All of the original issues are still unresolved. Proper sources are still a problem, as is overuse of primary sources. The editor should carefully review WP:RS, WP:NPOV, and WP:BURL. Mansheimer (talk) 07:09, 6 December 2022 (UTC)