Talk:Garnacha tintorera

What is the relation to Grenache?
I thought Garnacha tintorera was a synonym. Is this a different variety? AgneCheese/Wine 16:28, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I've always just assumed that Garnacha is Spanish for Grenache (but I'm not sure - I'll check)
 * 'Garnacha' is a 'normal' red grape in that the skin is red and the pulp is white (like 99% of red grapes). 'Garnacha tintorera' is different in that it has red pulp also. I believe that there are very few of these types of grape. There's an italian wine called Fragolino which is made with a red-pulp red grape.
 * I'm pretty sure that garnacha and garnacha tintoera must both be close genetically, but I don't have the hard facts or sources. I'm going to expand the article soon (the Spanish wiki has some info and sources). --BodegasAmbite (talk) 21:11, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

more thoughts
Hi Agne, I've done a bit of research and what I've come up with is this:
 * Garnacha is Spanish for Grenache
 * Garnacha tintorera is a different variety from Garnacha (as I thought). It has red pulp (tintorier in French)
 * I think the confusion comes from the fact that Garnacha tintorera is also known as 'Alicante'.
 * 'Alicante Bouschet' is yet another variety and is a hybrid of 'Petit Bouschet' and 'Garnacha' (and Petit Bouschet is itself a hybrid of Aramon and Cher tintorier)

It would appear that the wiki articles are wrong! as they assume that Garnacha tintorera and Alicante Bouschet are just different names for the same grape! Should I get a list of reliable sources? correct/update the articles? or do you want to do it? --BodegasAmbite (talk) 13:37, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Nice research. Feel free to add your sources and correct the articles. AgneCheese/Wine 16:16, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

even more thoughts
I've been doing a bit more research on this issue (I wasn't 100% convinced!). I've found that there's a conflict of opinion between apparently reliable sources. Some say that Garnacha Tintorera and Alicante Bouschet are one and the same, while others say they are different. I'm at a loss as to what to do. Who is right? Who is the authoritative source? Will we have to check the grapevine genome data?!! Looks like I've opened another can of works, oh woe! --BodegasAmbite (talk) 10:31, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Vitis International Variety Catalogue (VIVC) has only one hit for Garnacha Tintorera when I do a search; as a synonym for the variety Alicante Henri Bouschet. In this respect, it should be authoritative unless very recent new information has come to light. It couldn't just be that different sources prefer different primary names for Alicante H. Bouschet? Tomas e (talk) 15:08, 27 March 2010 (UTC)