Talk:General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization

Canada
Canadian press is reporting that speculation is that GM Canada is actually profitable, and is why the wholly owned subsidiary was not filing for bankruptcy at the same time as the parent company. 70.29.208.129 (talk) 14:11, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Speculation would be the description. Not one foreign subsidiary was included in the bankruptcy filings. As such, the valuable international operations and assets may be transferred without delay to the new GM entity, Vehicle Acquisition Holdings LLC, or any other willing buyer, without further delay, as complete entities. This prevents any local sovereign interference, operating under diverse local receivership laws and courts from slowing down a corporate reorganization of the holding company, General Motors. -- Yellowdesk (talk) 02:12, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Pontiac
This article should mention the Pontiac closure in the pre-bankruptcy section.

Is there any interest in selling/buying Pontiac? 70.29.212.226 (talk) 00:49, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Which plants with how many workers have been abandoned?
I mean, which facilities have been left in the Motors Liquidation Company to be closed? --L.Willms (talk) 00:05, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

EST?
Why does it say 8:00am EST when June 1 would have been EDT in New York? 216.221.64.101 (talk) 14:48, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Expansion of Table ... Board Compensation and Investor Loss
Would be nice to see what the 'fruits' of this bankruptcy resulted to the 'affected' parties in valuation (So to be specific: Board compensation packages for one and estimated investor 'losses'). Probably pocket change wrt the big picture of the whole proceeding, but still a valid reference to articulate on this subject (in what I perceive to be NPOV 'update'). In short: see how much the little guy (investors) 'lost' and how much the big guys 'made'.

Expansion of Table ... Board Compensation and Investor Loss
Would be nice to see what the 'fruits' of this bankruptcy resulted to the 'affected' parties in valuation (So to be specific: Board compensation packages for one and estimated investor 'losses'). Probably pocket change wrt the big picture of the whole proceeding, but still a valid reference to articulate on this subject (in what I perceive to be NPOV 'update'). In short: see how much the little guy (investors) 'lost' and how much the big guys 'made'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.233.84.28 (talk) 03:38, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

Oldsmobile
Where's Oldsmobile?68.229.201.104 (talk) 23:43, 7 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Oldsmobile was phased out between 2000-2004, long before the Chapter 11 reorganization. --Vossanova o&lt; 18:44, 9 February 2016 (UTC)

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Merger proposal
Motors Liquidation Company and this article largely overlap (bankruptcy proceedings, sales of Saturn, Hummer etc) and it's quite confusing to have two separate articles, Motors Liquidation Company and General Motors, that cover essentially the same company (notwithstanding the change of legal entity). It's unclear where and how the history of GM should be split, between the two articles above (as this discussion shows), therefore it's much better to just get rid of the former by merging it to where it belongs: here. --Deeday-UK (talk) 09:37, 16 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Support. I think this makes the most sense. LMC was a short lived entity that was just the leftovers of the bankruptcy process.  Given its tied to the larger bankruptcy story it makes sense to merge into the easier to find term/article about the GM bankruptcy.  Non bankruptcy material about either old or new GM should be in the General Motors Company article as it was originally the GM Corporation article and is the common name article. Springee (talk) 13:47, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Oppose Oppose merger. Oppose deletion of article Motors Liquidation Company. The Motors Liquidation Company is very clearly generally notable as documented by the generous reliable sources in article Motors Liquidation Company. The Motors Liquidation Company is one of many independently notable actors in the story of the General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization; others include the General Motors Corporation, the General Motors Company, the federal bankruptcy court, the US Treasury, the Bush administration, the Obama administration, and others. All of these must be represented in Wikipedia according to their representation in reliable sources. One of the most notable aspects of General Motors is that it would not exist without the intervention of the federal government and the Motors Liquidation Company played a key role. The bankruptcy, bail-out, and reorganization no matter how unpleasant must be given due weight. Though related, the General Motors Corporation is not the same thing as the General Motors Company and so Wikipedia cannot say or imply that they are.  Duplication of content and sources between articles is required by policy; policy specifies that article General Motors summarizes General Motors Corporation, Motors Liquidation Company, General Motors Company, and others. 35.165.116.166 (talk) 21:12, 22 January 2017 (UTC) — 35.165.116.166 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * No one is proposing removing the content. The content is clearly WP:NOTE.  However, the proposal here is to merge that information into the General Motors Bankruptcy article rather than have it in two locations.  The discussion of GM Company vs GM Corp is irrelivent to this discussion as "Liquidation Motors Corp" "Motors Liquidation Comp" was never a car manufacture.  By the time the company had that name it was only a holding company.  Springee (talk) 01:46, 23 January 2017 (UTC)
 * You the Chapter 11 bankruptcy section from article General Motors without prior discussion. Your deletion removed numerous reliable sources from the article, including The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Reuters, and USA Today. You reduced the coverage of the bankruptcy, bail-out, and restructuring in article General Motors to one, unreferenced sentence, "GM filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in June 2009." Due weight of content in Wikipedia is proportional to coverage in reliable sources. Please do not merge without clear, wide support. 13.112.55.43 (talk) 17:38, 24 January 2017 (UTC) — 13.112.55.43 (talk) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * Springee, when you wrote "Liquidation Motors Corp", I'll assume that you were referring to Motors Liquidation Company, which is written and spelled correctly earlier in this paragraph. Is that assumption correct? Stockst (talk) 23:27, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Yes, you are correct. I did a strike through above.  Springee (talk) 05:40, 30 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Oppose merger. First, Motors Liquidation Company is an article about a company, whereas General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization is about an event. Merging an article about a company with an article about an event does not make sense. Second, Motors Liquidation Company has a history dating back to 1908 which is not directly relevant to the discussion of the General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization. Third, as noted above, Motors Liquidation Company is very clearly generally notable as documented by the generous reliable sources in the article Motors Liquidation Company. Fourth, although General Motors Company is related to Motors Liquidation Company, it's a different entity. Stockst (talk) 23:23, 29 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Remember that Wikipedia articles can group material as editors deem logical, not just based on legal classifications. A RFC in 2009 was unanimous in support of keeping GM Corp and GM Comp in a single article thus the history of pre-bankruptcy GM and post bankruptcy GM are already settled and included in the current General Motors Company article (itself a rename of the pre-bankruptcy GM Corp article).  Any history of the corp that became MLC prior to the bankruptcy is really the history of General Motors Corporation and is already part of the GM Company article.  Thus all that a MLC article can cover (per previous consensus) is the bankruptcy specific material.  That material fits just as well in the GM bankruptcy article.  Since the objective here is to make a readable article/encyclopedia, why split the related content into two articles?  We are not obliged to have a MLC article simply because the material is WP:NOTE.  If agreed by consensus the MLC material can be merged in the article about the bankruptcy.  Consider which search term is more likely, "Motors Liquidation Company" or "GM bankruptcy"?  I would suggest that a RfC might be the best way to get a consensus on this issue. (While I support a merge I won't post a RfC unless I have the time to do the merge as well) Springee (talk) 05:40, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

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