Talk:George Beauchamp (sailor)

{{Did you know nominations/George Beauchamp (RMS Titanic) The George Beauchamp from Eling/Redbridge/Southampton died 1965. This was reported in the Southern Evening Echo at the time. He was on the Titanic but not the Lusitania. He never lived in Hull. This is a different George Beauchamp. George lived in with my family and I at the Woolpack inn, Redbridge. I knew him personally and was there when he died. George Beauchamp is the figure in the foreground not the one circled.

disambiguation links
The Redbridge and Millbrook wikilinks are going to disambiguation pages. I'd fix them but I'm not sure which (if any) are the correct pages for each. Schazjmd (talk) 22:29, 21 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you! Symbol confirmed.svg Done. --LLcentury (talk) 22:52, 21 May 2019 (UTC)
 * , no problem. Tip: go to your preferences > gadgets > appearance. There's an option to turn links orange if they point to disambiguation pages. Saves a lot of time. Schazjmd (talk) 23:06, 21 May 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for the advice! --LLcentury (talk) 23:25, 21 May 2019 (UTC)

Language spelling and corrections
Hello! as he was British, could anyone verify it's all written in British English and well-written? I'm not native, Best wishes! --LLcentury (talk) 14:39, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

Dates and ages
Opera House Players gives DOB as 1888. Then he was 24 on Titanic sinking, also indicated in his heading. Correct

Independent claims he was 42 (10 years older) when he applied to White Star. May have meant 10 years younger and was 22. Independent facts wrong et correct in every detail

Mayo and wrecksite.eu give DOD as 1965. But Independent refers to 75th anniversary of death, strongly supporting death in 1944. Independent gives age at death as 72, implying born in 1872 and supporting age 42 in 1912. But mother would have been only 14 at that time. DoD 1965 as reported southern evening echo, Southampton I would ignore 1965 and note that references do not agree on dates and ages. Jmar67 (talk) 23:08, 26 May 2019 (UTC)

Jmar67 And what we do friend? --LLcentury (talk) 00:25, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

Copyright violation
This comparison indicates that significant portions of this article were copied from Encyclopedia Titanica. The article will have to be rewritten in language that paraphrases the reference but does not copy it directly (unless you are quoting from the reference). I am not in a position to do this at the moment, but there may be other editors who could help you. I will check on this. Jmar67 (talk) 00:18, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Just read the comment above that ET and Sun are not reliable sources. That is a more serious problem. Jmar67 (talk) 00:23, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

, I've done my best, yet need help with citing a book, please help me with that last thing. I couldn't find more. --LLcentury (talk) 00:36, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I fixed the book ref, but I am still concerned that you are using too much directly from the sources, making an occasional wording change, rather than phrasing in your own words as WP requires. Also, the Opera source looks like a copy from ET and may not be much better as far as reliability is concerned. Jmar67 (talk) 05:04, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

, Hello! yes, I've changed some words, but can't surely write a sentence on my own, I'm afraid of destroying the English language haha. I thought the same about ET and Opera, but since Opera has been told to me to be reliable I thought it fit. Best wishes. --LLcentury (talk) 14:38, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed
Prior content in this draft duplicated one or more previously published sources. The material was copied from: https://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/titanic-survivor/george-william-beauchamp.html and https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/titanic-rms-lusitania-sailor-survivor-george-beauchamp-family-a8882561.html. Copied or closely paraphrased material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.)

For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or published material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use copyrighted publications as a source of information, and, if allowed under fair use, may copy sentences and phrases, provided they are included in quotation marks and referenced properly. The material may also be rewritten, providing it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Therefore, such paraphrased portions must provide their source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 13:43, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

- Perfectly understood, I ask for patience please, don't block me, I am overwhelmed by English language technical wording. I've done my best, I can't do more. If declined, don't worry, I'll take it as experience :) --LLcentury (talk) 14:16, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

Multiple issues tag
Hi!, nice to meet you, I humbly disagree with "disputed" and that some sources "may not be reliable", not with the other, I know more citations would be great. But as for disputed, books show his DOB and DOD as undisputed and the only "unreliable" source could be Opera, but on Kiwi Live Chat I was told it was "reliable", so I humbly ask admins to reach an agreement because one tells me white and another tells me black. Without being disrespectful, I wish you all the best and will continue searching for more citations. Kind regards. --LLcentury (talk) 19:59, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
 * The death date is not clear. See discussion above. Mayo is not more authoritative than the Independent. Jmar67 (talk) 00:04, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

Jmar67, Okay, I've added yet another source, if not, I couldn't find more. Thanks. Best wishes. --LLcentury (talk) 00:11, 28 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Yet added another book, but in Spanish, does it matter? --LLcentury (talk) 00:29, 28 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I still need time to study these new references. English ones would certainly be better in this case. I work with many articles with German refs but on German subjects. The Portuguese ref has a picture showing Beauchamp in the center (not the circled one we currently show). Jmar67 (talk) 09:40, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

Jmar67 Yes, it's a mess, I am temporarily abandoning editing on the article. It has "stressed" me. Thanks for your immense help. Besides, I found his death certificate in the National Archives of the UK but I cannot afford the payment to order the death certificate. --LLcentury (talk) 10:23, 28 May 2019 (UTC)w. Please may I add something? I knew George Beauchamp and Encyclopedia Titanica has all his details correct. He lived at the woolpack inn Redbridge Southampton with my family and I.  The hull George Beauchamp different birth and death dates was never on the titanic. Even my George Beauchamp was not on the Lusitania. He died at the woolpack inn(I was there) in 1965 as reported in the southern evening echo of Southampton. I dont know how to get in touch or or where to post this information. It gets deleted. I am 74 and just learning about the internet

Sorry and please undo DYK nomination
Justlettersandnumbers, Hi friend, I will not start further discussions anywhere else but here. I just humbly ask you to undo the DYK nomination since I can't really find any more sources. Best wishes to you and thanks for your really extreme patience. --LLcentury (talk) 13:51, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

References from FamilySearch
These are for his birth/Christening, military service and death.


 * "England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NVV3-6LD : 11 February 2018, George William Beauchamp, ); citing yr 1862-1893 p 159, index based upon data collected by the Genealogical Society of Utah, Salt Lake City; FHL microfilm 6,344,208.


 * "United Kingdom, Merchant Navy Seamen Records, 1835-1941," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KC7P-N45 : 5 December 2014), George William Beauchamp, ; From "Merchant Navy Seamen1835-1941," database and images, findmypast (www.findmypast.com : n.d.); citing BT 112-116, 119-120, series BT350, The National Archives of the UK, Kew, Surrey.


 * "England and Wales Death Registration Index 1837-2007," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVCV-FMW6 : 4 September 2014), George W Beauchamp, 1965; from "England & Wales Deaths, 1837-2006," database, findmypast (www.findmypast.com : 2012); citing Death, Southampton, Hampshire, England, General Register Office, Southport, England.

-- Auric   talk  19:46, 10 August 2019 (UTC)

Misidentification in lead image?
This edit caught my eye. It inserted the assertion, "The man circled is not George Beauchamp he is in the foreground.".

A bit of googling led me to this amd this. It appears that there is some doubt about the identification. That is as far as I was able to get. Image insertion as a source of unsupported insertions is a common source of unreliability in Wikipedia. Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 10:25, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Hoax tag removed
Howdy hello! I have removed the WP:HOAX tag on this article, as it is not a hoax in the Wikipedia sense. Hoaxes on Wikipedia are things that do not exist and were made up by the editor, with the intent to deceive our readers. This person seems to have coverage, and actual sources discuss him. While its possible that he wasn't actually on the Lusitania as well, he appears to have been a real person. Thus while its factual accuracy is disputed, it is not a Wikipedia hoax. I have removed the tag, as it was cluttering the hoax category and put the article in danger of deletion. CaptainEek Edits Ho Cap'n!⚓ 01:38, 22 January 2020 (UTC)

What is wrong with the 2019 articles
1. Do the articles even clearly state George Beauchamp was onboard the Lusitania? No. They say (as far as I have read - I did not go through all of them) he was "thought to have been" there. 2. Are the birth years in the article in The Independent even consistent? No. 3. Is any of the birth years implied in the article in The Independent compatible with the life story of George Beauchamp from the Titanic? No. 4. So maybe the place of birth is a match? No. 3. Did George Beauchamp have any children within marriage? No. 4. Was there a George Beauchamp onboard the Lusitania? Based on the list of passengers and crew... no.

There was a William Beauchamp, a British man who lived in the United States, onboard the Lusitania - a passenger, not a crew member.

Periwinklewrinkles (talk) 02:54, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

Doubtful: category - Royal Navy personnel of World War I
Anything to support that he was in the Royal Navy during WWI (except the unreliable articles from 2019 claiming he was on the Lusitania)? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Periwinklewrinkles (talk • contribs) 03:54, 30 July 2020 (UTC)


 * George Beauchanp lived with my grandparents for many years so was well known to my family he died in their public house in his 70’s. Due to one lady’s lies his memory has been tarnished as she claimed he was her father. The independent newspaper and many others published her lies without any fact checking will not respond to our pleas to removed articles from the internet 82.16.36.89 (talk) 19:15, 20 July 2024 (UTC)