Talk:George H. W. Bush/Archive 5

Edit request on 25 January 2012
In the 1980 presidential campaign section, please change the following section "The two men agreed to a debate in the state, organized by the Nashua Telegraph, but paid for by the Reagan campaign. Reagan invited the other four candidates as well, but Bush refused to debate them, and eventually they left.[21]" to "The two men agreed to a one on one debate in the state, organized by the Nashua Telegraph, but paid for by the Reagan campaign. At the last minute Reagan invited the other four candidates as well, and when the Nashua Telegraph refused to allow them to debate Bush stated that he had no opinion as to whether the other candidates should be included, that the decision should be made by the Telegraph, a response that seemed weak to many voters.

Bush did not refuse to debate the other four candidates. This is an error. In fact, the reference [21] cited by the original article does not state that Bush refused to debate. Contemporary reporting on this incident which refers to the error may be found at http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2209&dat=19800306&id=p58rAAAAIBAJ&sjid=PPwFAAAAIBAJ&pg=6653,968102

William h stevenson (talk) 02:01, 25 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the template. &mdash;  Abhishek   Talk 13:56, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Edit Suggestion RE: The Grocery Scanner Incident
Although the Grocery Scanner "Amazement" meme was arguably just as influential in the 1992 campaign as "John McCain doesn't know how many houses he owns" was in 2008, I'd rather see it disappear from this article entirely than have it be flatly denounced as a "falsehood". The citation for saying that the New York Times article was "false" leads to the corresponding debate on Snopes.com. There are two problems with this. First of all, Snopes puts a little "truth-o-meter" type evaluation at the top of every article and it's their OPINION of the matter. So why should we trust Snopes over the New York Times? Secondly, if you actually read the lengthy explanation on the Snopes page, it makes NO MENTION of any falsehood in the New York Times article about Bush and the Grocery Scanner. It actually just delves into the subjective realm and presents alternate viewpoints like "I don't think he really looked 'amazed' per se..." I think it's heavy-handed for wikipedia to accuse the New York Times of lying and I'm skeptical of casually using snopes.com as an authoritative source to verify everything as being either true or false. Perhaps we can soften the judgment on that, or if all else fails, remove it? Afterall, if it's really "false" then it doesn't belong in a Bio of living persons anyway, right? 98.203.17.49 (talk) 21:15, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 15 April 2012
As George H. W. Bush was not the 43rd vice president of the states, i'd like to correct this error to the 40th

Matthiaschan (talk) 09:57, 15 April 2012 (UTC)
 * ❌ See List of Vice Presidents of the United States; they went askew when George Clinton (vice president) became the 4th to Jefferson's 2nd term, and Bush was 43rd to Reagan's 40th. Dru of Id (talk) 13:46, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

Edit Requeset: wrong link
In the second paragraph of the Vice Presidency section, there is a link to the presidential order of succession, but is the generic article. I am pretty sure the intention is to link oto United States presidential line of succession. Can somebody make that fix? 214.13.69.132 (talk) 09:35, 16 May 2012 (UTC)
 * I see your point, but I'm not sure the link you provide is more correct because it lists the current line of succession, not the one that was in place 31 years ago when that event occurred. The slots are the same, of course, but the people in them are the current incumbents so I'm not sure that's an appropriate page to link to. Frank  &#124;  talk  12:20, 16 May 2012 (UTC)

43rd Vice President
On the right side of the article, underneath his picture, he is listed as the 40th Vice President. In the article itself, it correctly says that he was the 43rd, but there is nevertheless that error. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KingOfTheLiberal (talk • contribs) 20:05, 25 May 2012 (UTC)

Edit to the introduction.
There is a missing 'is' in the introduction:

George Herbert Walker Bush (born June 12, 1924) is an American politician who served as the 41st President of the United States (1989–93). He had previously served as the 43rd Vice President of the United States (1981–89), a congressman, an ambassador, a Director of Central Intelligence, and is currently the oldest surviving president.

Currently it reads as though he previously served as the oldest surviving president IMHO. --92.237.16.102 (talk) 23:19, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Edit Suggestion Health and Mobility Issues
The article mentions that he has "Parkinsonism" which has "weakened his legs/ It doesn't mention that he now basically cannot walk and uses a wheelchair or a scooter to get around. This has been true since 2011 apparently and is worth noting. http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/03/former-presidents-gather-for-tribute-to-george-hw-bush-volunteer-service/ http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/story/2012-01-28/obama-bush-visit/52828644/1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.34.239.125 (talk) 14:21, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Read my lips: no new taxes FAR
I have nominated Read my lips: no new taxes for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. -- Peter Talk page 17:37, 8 July 2012 (UTC)

Civil rights
I believe a Civil Rights in the Presidency section would be good for this article. Cmguy777 (talk) 19:31, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Bushed signed the Civil Rights Act of 1991. Cmguy777 (talk) 19:43, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Additional sources
WhisperToMe (talk) 16:22, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Staff. "Bush returns home to quiet life of citizen." Houston Chronicle. Wednesday January 20, 1993. A11.

Recent ill health
His recent ill health with bronchitis should be mentioned. He must be much more ill than has been reported by his doctors, since he was hospitalized on Nov. 23 and one of his aides had said he was expected to be out by Nov. 26th. He's still hospitalized today, though "improving". His son "Jeb' Bush has also admitted his father has advancing Parkinson's, and is unable to walk without a stick or preferably stays seated in a wheelchair. 74.69.11.229 (talk) 18:58, 10 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Wikipedia is, oddly enough, not a tabloid or a newspaper. We stick to what reliable sources report and which editors find of value to the reader.   The day-to-day health reports are not in this category.  BTW, "vascular parkinsonism" is not "Parkinson's".  It is found in elderly people who have had tiny strokes ("TIAs"). .  Rather common by the age of 88.  Collect (talk) 19:41, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

That's all well and good, but since his health is declining through mini-strokes and acute bronchitis, this is notable. It was reported within hours on his Wikipedia page, that Queen Elizabeth's husband had been hospitalized and undergone angioplasty and stenting. Since it was done on his page, so it should be on the former President's. And I am not a vascular surgeon, so FORGIVE me for my grevious error of fact. Good day. 74.69.11.229 (talk) 14:21, 12 December 2012 (UTC)


 * TIAs are not generally notable.  Many people get them and do not even realise it.   Nor is "acute bronchitis" in the same league as a stent and angioplasty. Collect (talk) 14:46, 12 December 2012 (UTC)

Actually you're wrong, bronchitis can be life-threatening at 88 and TIAs can be as well. Ariel Sharon had one, then a massive hemmorahage a few days later. He's now a vegetable. But if you can not be convinced, I won't try. 74.69.11.229 (talk) 20:26, 18 December 2012 (UTC)


 * As reliable sources do not echo what you think you know on the topic, I fear that the material will not be placed into this biography. Collect (talk) 00:59, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Well, being hospitalized for over a month is obviously no big deal as the Atlantic magazine has reported. And it should be removed on Harry Reid's page that he has had TIAs, since you as Arbiter of Fact don't find it notable. 74.69.11.229 (talk) 21:46, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I do not follow that page, and find quite enough "silly edits" to deal with on the 3K pages I do follow.  Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, and is not a newspaper.  If you wish to write about people being "vegetables", I think there are openings at the National Enquirer.  Collect (talk) 00:12, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

Two things. First of all sir or madam, I use that term as a colloquial expression. Do not mistake my casual use of language as a casual attitude toward accuracy and high-quality care; I take that very seriously. I have no interest in working at the Enquirer or any other convyer of tittle-tattle. Rather quite the opposite as I read a variety of reliable news sources: The New York Times, the Washington Post, The Naion, The Atlantic, the National Review, etc. My point this entire time has been that when an elderly person is hospitalized for an extended period of time and is now in the intensive-care unit, which by its own description on this page is for life-threatening conditions, the time has come to add it to their page. And I find interesting that the citation on the page is to Yahoo! News, which I find to be inaccurate and more tittle-tattle than serious news source. Interesting! I remain your most humble servant sir or madam. 74.69.11.229 (talk) 13:22, 27 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Don't worry, some people on Wikipedia think they are better than others. Just disregard these people. 72.220.176.102 (talk) 23:16, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

Boy do I know that! 74.69.11.229 (talk) 14:50, 28 December 2012 (UTC)


 * we realize wiki is not a scrolling chart for the health of leaders, but the clearly present bad health of Pres Geo HW Bush at the library dedication a few days ago (compared to also clear good health of Carter, and both ab same age) is a subject that needs covering esp with 'big jeb'

slated to run for prez in 2016 with health, his future health an issue. javier mermos zapata, 12th 68.195.88.82 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 13:38, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 28 December 2012
George H.W. Bush did not die on December 28, 2012. He is still alive.

Gjh1875203 (talk) 07:38, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
 * ✅ Edits reverted. -- Gogo Dodo (talk) 07:42, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

Herbert
As far as I can see, this is not in the article. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) George H. W. Bush has two middle names, "Walker" obviously comes from his mother's maiden name. But does anyone know (1) where does "Herbert" come from, and (2) why was "Herbert" dropped from his namesake son's name? (I can guess why it was dropped -- to distinguish their names -- but it would be nice to see a source.) Duoduoduo (talk) 18:53, 13 February 2013 (UTC)


 * i wrote book on the ancestors of the bush family and i can't answer either the reason for this herbert in bush 'sr' name except well known

1600's poet george herbert in UK or/ AND the fact that way way distant, this bush family has a la de da connection to aristocratic herbert family of wales... but that is so distant, as to normally not be mentioned... what else, who knows ? someone should ask the jorges, lil mayroane joanz ... !! 68.195.88.82 (talk) 13:33, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Bush's maternal grandfather was George Herbert Walker, and Bush was named for him. - J. Conti 108.20.74.240 (talk) 19:47, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

Bush-Overby ??
In he sentence "Bush started the Bush-Overby Oil Development company in 1951", the company name is misspelled.

It should be Bush-Overbey Oil Development company.

My source is myself. I am the son of John Overbey, Bush's first business partner.

Jwkoprp (talk) 20:53, 20 February 2013 (UTC)


 * This spelling Overbey is confirmed in our article Zapata Corporation. I'll make the change. Duoduoduo (talk) 21:47, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Expanded role during the second half of Regan's second term?
I occasionally hear/read that during the latter half of Regan's second term that there were signs that Regan may have been mentally declining somewhat and that H.W. was functionally, if not officially, President of the United States during this time. Does anyone have any information that can shed any light on this subject one way or the other? Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.215.56.3 (talk) 03:44, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 22 April 2013
Please change "so after graduating from Phillips Academy earlier in 1942" to "so after graduating from Phillips Academy early in 1942". Nothing else is mentioned in 1942 (at least in this section), so "earlier" doesn't make sense.

2001:18E8:2:1020:3417:C48:897D:BC25 (talk) 17:44, 22 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Yellow check.svg Partly done: I have instead removed that word completely as neither the existing text nor your proposal make much sense. &mdash; KuyaBriBri Talk 20:52, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

It would be good to add a section on Points of Light, the organization founded by President Bush and frequently mentioned in speeches during his presidency. This would be added in the section on his presidency. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wrightwaller (talk • contribs) 14:31, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Points of light was a theme frequently mentioned by President Bush during his presidency. He started the Point of Light Foundation and the Daily Point of Light Award during his presidency. It would be good to add a section on this under his presidency. I am new to this and appreciate any direction if I haven't done this perfectly. Thank you. Wrightwaller (talk) 14:35, 22 May 2013 (UTC)wrightwaller May 22,2013

Points of Light
President Bush devoted attention to voluntary service as a means of solving some of America’s most serious social problems. He often used the “thousand point of light” theme to describe the power of citizens to solve community problems. In his 1989 inaugural address, President Bush said, “I have spoken of a thousand points of light, of all the community organizations that are spread like stars throughout the Nation, doing good.”

Four years later in his report to the nation on The Points of Light Movement, President Bush said, “Points of Light are the soul of America. They are ordinary people who reach beyond themselves to touch the lives of those in need, bringing hope and opportunity, care and friendship. By giving so generously of themselves, these remarkable individuals show us not only what is best in our heritage but what all of us are called to become.”

In 1990, the Points of Light Foundation was created as a nonprofit organization in Washington to promote this spirit of volunteerism. In 2007, the Points of Light Foundation merged with the Hands On Network with the goal of strengthening volunteerism, streamlining costs and services and deepening impact. Points of Light, the organization created through this merger, has approximately 250 affiliates in 22 countries and partnerships with thousands of nonprofits and companies dedicated to volunteer service around the world. In 2012, Points of Light mobilized 4 million volunteers in 30 million hours of service worth $635 million.

President Bush created the Daily Point of Light Award in 1989 to honor individuals and volunteer groups around the country. On October 16, 2009, President Obama held a Presidential Forum on Service hosted by former President George H.W. Bush and Points of Light at the George Bush Presidential Library Center on the campus of Texas A&M University. The event celebrated the contributions of more than 4,500 Daily Point of Light award winners and honored President Bush’s legacy of service and civic engagement.

In 2011, Points of Light paid tribute to President George H.W. Bush and volunteer service at Washington’s Kennedy Center. President Bush was joined by Presidents Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush to highlight the role volunteer service plays in people's lives.

World War II criticism
The accounting of his WW II years seem to be missing a critical voice. According to a New York Times article a witness claimed that Bush left his crew mates for dead by parachuting out of an airplane before they were able to leave it. 89.160.136.8 (talk) 23:37, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

In What It Takes (1992), Richard Ben Cramer says that Bush waited to give the order to eject until he was able to move the plane out over water, so that the men would not be captured. White was a ship's gunner and was not normally a flier. Bush wondered if White knew how to access his parachute. It's fair to argue that Bush should have made sure of this with White before taking off. However, if there was smoke filling the cockpit as Bush claims, there is no way Bush could have attempted a water landing as the subject of the Times interview suggests. -J. Conti 108.20.74.240 (talk) 19:59, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

Edit request on 16 August 2013
For grammatical reasons, I would change "Americans give" to "Americans gave" under PUBLIC IMAGE

Amijane155 (talk) 04:05, 16 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Done - thanks! -- Scray (talk) 04:17, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

Lede too long
The introduction is six paragraphs long. It must be reduced to four per WP:LEAD. --George Ho (talk) 02:06, 7 December 2013 (UTC)

no longer traveling extensively?
He is not going to the funeral of Nelson Mandela in South Africa, although Jimmy Carter, also 89, is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.63.16.20 (talk) 20:36, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
 * As he has lately seemed to be in a wheelchair, and extensive air travel is not recommended for ill people, it is likely that a 12 hour plane trip would be excessive. IIRC, he had written an essay in contemplation of Mandela's death,  which has appeared on HuffPo. Collect (talk) 20:47, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 31 January 2014
Please add the citation for President Bush's Medal of Freedom, which appears in the "Later Activities" section of the article. Here is the suggested text:

On February 15, 2011, he was awarded the Medal of Freedom—the highest civilian honor in the United States—by President Barack Obama. The citation read: "From his time as a decorated Navy pilot to his years in the White House as the forty-first President of the United States, President George Herbert Walker Bush has led a life marked by a profound commitment to serving others. As President, he upheld the American value of liberty during a time of renewal and promise.  As a private citizen, he has united Americans in times of crisis, lending his tireless efforts to men and women whose lives have been upended by disaster.  Over the arc of his life, President Bush has served our nation as a tremendous force for good, and we proudly salute him for his unwavering devotion to our country and our world."

The text of the citation can be verified in this YouTube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_md8fSqF4s

Andrewwatters (talk) 12:49, 31 January 2014 (UTC)


 * This might help Kap 7 (talk) 09:45, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * I think all that is a bit too much for this article. There's really no factual content in those remarks that's not already present in the article, in encyclopedic language.  So I've changed the reference to one that provides the full transcript, and noted so in the reference. Adrian J. Hunter(talk•contribs) 07:20, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

broken citation
I am trying to access the link for note 101 to snopes regarding the grocery scanner incident. This link doesn't work anymore. I cannot find the article on snopes, either. If someone knows how to fix it, please do. I can't figure out where the article went...--75.174.116.212 (talk) 21:53, 14 February 2014 (UTC)
 * ✅, thanks. There was a typo in the archive url. Adrian J. Hunter(talk•contribs) 07:51, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Advertisement?
Is this article an advertisement for President Bush? It reads like it... While articles in an encyclopaedia ought to be encyclopaedic, does that also mean that they should downplay or soften an article subject's behavior and transgressions? I understand that George H. W. Bush is a living person and a former president but does that also mean that direct references to his attributable behavior that can be substantiated should be reworded to make them look amicable? This article is very clearly a press release, not an encyclopaedic account of a living former president... It should have an advertisement template posted. Stevenmitchell (talk) 13:27, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

Edit Request - WWII plane incident
I would like to suggest adding to the description of this incident Bush's statement that upon ejecting, he hit the tail stabilizer of his plane, injuring his head and tearing his parachute so that it only partially broke his fall. While on the life raft, the raft's reservoir which was supposed to contain fresh water had broken, so Bush had no water to drink during the hours he waited to be rescued. Source: Cramer, Richard Ben, What It Takes (New York, 1992), p.82. - J. Conti 108.20.74.240 (talk) 20:08, 7 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done for now: I am not so sure if it helps the article as a whole as it is quite detailed. I will leave this open in case someone else disagrees with me. DJAMP 4444  11:00, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 June 2014
18/06/2014

116.203.209.119 (talk) 10:50, 18 June 2014 (UTC)18/07/2014


 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. DJAMP 4444  10:55, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

I would like to add The George and Barbara Bush Center and the George and Barbara Distinguished Lecture Series to the 7.2 Later Activities section
Two items I would like to see added to this page regarding George H. W. Bush initiatives post presidency.

On October 3rd, 2008, George and Barbara Bush opened the George and Barbara Bush Center on the University of New England Biddeford Campus a few miles north of Walker's Point. The George and Barbara Bush Center lays the foundation for the heritage of George Bush in New England and houses The Bush Legacy Collection, material securing the Bush legacy in Maine, including memorabilia on loan from the George H. W. Bush Presidential Library at Texas A & M University. Particular attention is given to the family’s New England heritage and to George Bush’s love for Maine.

In 2010, in partnership with the University of New England, George and Barbara Bush established the George and Barbara Bush Distinguished Lecture Series, an annual event honoring the legacy of George and Barbara Bush as political and community leaders.

64.223.211.18 (talk) 13:45, 11 September 2014 (UTC)

Proposed merge with Vision thing
This "article" is only a few sentences long, only two of which aren't in Bush's article p  b  p  22:59, 29 September 2014 (UTC)

George Bush's airplane
The article says that George Bush's airplane is a Grumman TBM. The TBM was General Motors. Grumman was TBF. George Snively Phoenix, AQZ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.231.47.9 (talk) 20:36, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

Willie Horton
Awkward/unclear: "Moderator Bernard Shaw asked Dukakis if Dukakis would hypothetically support the death penalty if his wife, Kitty, were raped and murdered.[49] Dukakis's response of no, as well as a provocative ad about convicted felon Willie Horton, contributed toward Bush's characterization of Dukakis as "soft on crime".[12]"

I would edit it to make it more clear that the provocative ad was put out by republicans and not Dukakis because, in context, it seems to indicate Dukakis mentioned Willie Horton in the debate. I'd also probably link to the wiki page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolving_Door_%28advertisement%29

Page seems to be protected, so I'm leaving this note instead. - 24.110.50.184 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 05:12, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

Comment on the first sentence of the entry
"American retired politician" would be better worded as "retired American politician". And while I'm commenting on style, I will observe that describing GHWB as a politician is a bit harsh. Why not say "retired American Naval officer" or "decorated Naval officer". The word "politician" is not neutral. It has a negative connotation in the same way that "statesman" is positive. How about "retired American government official" or something equally bland (and neutral)? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pcervelli (talk • contribs) 03:01, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

Billy Graham
The influence of Billy Graham should be mentioned, impacting Bush's legacy profoundly. For example --> "his spirit overwhelmed me." .. "I met him, first of all, with my grandmother in Kennebunkport. He had came to visit my grandparents, my grandmother, of course, .. "Billy Graham helped me understand the redemptive power of a risen Lord." ... "he's had a big influence in my life" http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/on-the-record/transcript/george-w-bush-039gentle-soul039-billy-graham-changed-my-life — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.63.50.134 (talk) 15:40, 27 December 2014 (UTC)