Talk:George Michael/Archive 2

Britishisms in the drugs section
need some help on the words shunted ?) and traffic bollard(?) Thanks.Kitten b (talk) 04:16, 10 January 2008 (UTC) kitten b


 * "to shunt" is to slowly push something (usually a fairly heavy thing, and usually for a short time or in short bursts). A shunt in a car (automobile) is a slow-speed collision with an other slow-moving or stationary object. In this case the stationary object was a traffic bollard. Now, I have lived in the US but I genuinely cannot recall ever hearing a US word for this. It is an internally illuminated post, usually square in cross section, a couple of feet in diameter and about a yard high, which may serve to divide two lanes or to indicate the boundary of a pedestrian refuge. The wikipedia page indicates that they are rare in the US but are called traffic bollards there too.


 * Just looked up "shunt" on the OED and it says:
 * verb 1 slowly push or pull (a railway vehicle or vehicles) so as to make up or remove from a train. 2 push or shove. 3 direct or divert to a less important place or position.
 * noun 1 an act of shunting. 2 Brit. informal a motor accident, especially a collision of vehicles travelling one close behind the other. 3 an electrical conductor joining two points of a circuit.
 * Rachel Pearce (talk) 12:43, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Sales figures
I just want to know what is going on with the sales figures for George Michael's albums?? someone is messing with the numbers constantly, for example the Discography chapter listed that the album Older sold 12 Millions, and that was a month ago, now the number is down to 10!!! same thing with the rest of the albums... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hoppaluppa (talk • contribs) 21:13, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

Too much like publicist hype
IMHO this article looks like it could have been written by Mr. Michael's publicists. With all due respect to Mr. Michael's skills and accomplishments an article that says...

''Whether half of the duo Wham! or a solo artist, Michael has enjoyed massive global success with his unique brand of soul-influenced pop.''

...does not seem encyclopedic in nature. Filmteknik (talk) 17:45, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

We call those Peacock Terms. I make a motion so strike... &mdash;  X   S   G   20:59, 2 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I do not think of the article of a marketing project. They even mention that Harper and Row are proud of being in a deal to publish his memoirs. Harper and Row do have a page where they list their authors, and I am still trying to find George Michael. --82.134.28.194 (talk) 06:10, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Eli Stone
Shouldn't more be made of his prominent role in the TV series?71.63.15.156 (talk) 06:43, 12 April 2008 (UTC)


 * He appeared in several episodes and each episode was named after a George Michael tune. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.59.203.174 (talk) 21:03, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Press articles in violation of WP:NOTNEWS
The following links were languishing in the External Links section under the subtitle "Press articles". This is in direct violation of WP:NOTNEWS and if truely relevent to the main article would be better used as source material and added as references (WP:RS). I have removed them from the article but preserved them here for potential reuse or comment.

Press articles —Teahot (talk) 22:28, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Interview with George Michael from London Independent, in which he discusses his childhood, depression, sexuality, and friendship with Diana
 * "George Michael faces $10m lawsuit" – BBC News article, dated Tuesday, 14 September 1999
 * "George Michael video case dismissed" – BBC News article, by Peter Bowes, dated Thursday, 17 February 2000
 * "Officer allowed to sue Michael" – BBC News article, dated Wednesday, 4 December 2002
 * There was so much death, 9 December 2005 – Interview with The Guardian
 * Singer Michael says cannabis keeps him sane, 21 October 2006 – Reuters
 * George Michael: a few words from George before he go-gos The Daily Telegraph online 21/08/2008 (Interview quotes by Michael from different points of his career)

Cypriot
Is he pure Greek Cypriot? Or half British? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.225.209.234 (talk) 20:13, 28 April 2009 (UTC)


 * As stated in the Early Life section, he is a mixture of Greek Cypriot, Anglo-Saxon, and Jewish DNA. - 02:11, 15 December 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Eligius (talk • contribs)

Request for consensus on inclusion of Greek name
George Michael's Greek name (Γεώργιος Κυριάκος Παναγιώτου) has been added and reverted several times. Perhaps we can reach consensus here before applying WP:3RR? Please discuss here so that we can agree a policy for future edits.—Teahot (talk) 13:00, 11 May 2009 (UTC)

Freddie, Michael, Elton
Could it be a possibility that Michael's tribute album for Freddie Mercury was influenced by the fact that both of them were gays? Elton John was also in that tribute album. Maybe this is rainbow club connection needs to be explored and included in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.101.152.12 (talk) 20:02, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Later gay sex flap in London
I notice the conspicuous omission of the 2006 incident in London concerning GM having gay sex with a singularly unattractive man in a park (apparently a popular gay cruising area) not far from GM's London home. This was particularly notable for the notorious GM quote, "Are you gay? No? Then f*** off! This is my culture!" One URL covering this, unfortunately with a significantly negative spin, is http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2006/07/this-is-my-culture.html Dick Kimball (talk) 14:03, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

Gay or bisexual?
According to Michael's bio, he had at least one straight relationship before coming out of the closet.--70.254.47.126 (talk) 08:37, 15 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Who hasn't done that? If he hasn't dated any women since deciding he's gay then he's gay. Bisexuals actively date, or intend to date in the future, both sexes.209.152.56.29 (talk) 23:34, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Not simultaneously -- they don't.  Sequentially, yes. Chesspride 66.19.84.2 (talk) 07:05, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

Lead
I've changed the lead. If you have any thoughts put it here DavidGilmours.solo (talk) 21:58, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Looks a fair bit better to me. Off2riorob (talk) 22:02, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for editing. I like it better now. But I think that we should have one paragraph about Wham! and one about his solo career. not mixed like now. DavidGilmours.solo (talk) 23:38, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, feel free to work it a bit more and i'll cast an eye over it tomorrow as im going ofline now, best regards. Off2riorob (talk) 23:42, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Okay just tell me your opinion tomorrow. Thanks again brother. DavidGilmours.solo (talk) 00:23, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I add careless whisper in the lead because I think it should be mentioned, specially beacause it is his first solo single. 62.61.164.162 (talk) 13:41, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

It should be mentioned in the Twenty-Five section that there was also a new song called "A Moment With You"

Should his private concert in Russia which he was payed an exhoribitant amount be mentioned?

Should his relationship with Kathy Jeung be mentioned, as she starred in the video for "I Want Your Sex"?

Can we update the article to include information about "December Song" and "Jingle"?

Can his writing relationship with Johnny Douglas be mentioned?

Should there be a note about the instruments he plays and the fact that he plays all the instruments on a number of his songs? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.59.203.174 (talk) 21:08, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Place of birth
✅ Should be Finchley, as per photograph of the birth certificate of Georgios Kyriacos Panayiotou contained in the biography 'George Michael:The Making Of A Superstar' Bruce Dessau, Sidgwick & Jackson, London 198982.23.55.41 (talk) 12:46, 6 February 2010 (UTC)C Noble 06 Feb 2010
 * Is there a citation to support this? Off2riorob (talk) 13:03, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I found a cite for north london and changed to that, thanks for pointing it out, perhaps it was finchley, I will look for a cite to support that, perhaps the book would do? Has anyone got a support for this? Off2riorob (talk) 13:23, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Changed to east finchley, t appears to have been vandaled out, thanks for pointing it out. Off2riorob (talk) 13:30, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

HIV
Is George Michael HIV-positive? The article mentions that he started a relationship in 1991 with a guy who subsequently died of AIDS in 1993. Stonemason89 (talk) 21:10, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
 * This is not really the correct place to speculate about that, better to first find a citation. Off2riorob (talk) 21:44, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, here's a citation indicating Michael himself doesn't even know....apparently, he has refused to take an HIV test because he is afraid it might be positive. He also says that he "doesn't believe in" tests. I suppose we could put that in the article. Stonemason89 (talk) 02:55, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't think so, the first para of the cite says the bbc cut the interview coz george complained it was too personal, blp and all that, there is nothing valuable adding, george does not know as he has not had a test, the vast majority of people have not had a test either, so ..no test no addition.Off2riorob (talk) 12:20, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Criminality
GM has been arrested, charged and convicted with drugs, driving and sexual offences. How about listing these in a section entitled "criminality"? New Thought (talk) 16:36, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

The citation from Stonemason89 doesn't work. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.129.89.93 (talk) 11:39, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

Only if you do so for every celebrity and public figure article on Wiki. Otherwise, it is a cheap shot on this particular topic. Chesspride 66.19.84.2 (talk) 07:07, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

George Michael Bluth
This character from Arrested Development is popular enough to have a tiny dab sentence for it. Correct me if I'm wrong... providing valid reasons, of course (not just the words "not notable"). Hearfourmewesique (talk) 01:40, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Amitriptyline
Can someone please explain to me why adding to the article that George Michael had been on the prescription medication, Amitriptyline, pointing out the side effects, include dizziness, hallucinating, drowsiness, with a link to the side effects of Amitriptyline as described by MEDLINE (not me) is not valid for inclusion?

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/meds/a682388.html#side-effects

I see I even get a level1 warning, whatever that is? It's as if you want people to think it was the cannabis that caused George Michael to drive into that shop window.

Is Wikipedia sponsored by Big Pharma by any chance? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Christopherbrian (talk • contribs) 01:15, 11 October 2010 (UTC)


 * You need to cite a reliable source for sensitive information on a biography of a living person. Did it appear in the newspaper, or did you read it online? What is your source for this information? Any experienced user will help you add your citation. Thanks. -- Diannaa  (Talk) 01:18, 11 October 2010 (UTC)


 * http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3138060/George-Michael-jailed-for-cannabis-crash.html
 * The musician admitted smoking a "small quantity" of cannabis about 10pm the previous evening and said he also took the anti-depressant Amitriptyline to help him sleep.


 * http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23877664-george-michael-faces-jail-over-drug-driving-crash.do
 * His lawyer, Mukul Chawla QC, said the star had taken a sleeping pill, amitriptyline, which he had been prescribed eight days earlier.


 * just two examples, it was widely reported in the press he had taken amitriptyline, if I read you right, I can put it back in if I put a link to those articles, or will I get another warning or banned? I think it's quite relevant that he had been taking this drug, I have cited the effects from MEDLINE, which is the most authoritative OFFICIAL medical website on this planet. Christopherbrian (talk) 01:33, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I am pretty sure if we re-add it with the citations it will stay. Let's use them both. But if people want more information about the drug, they can follow the link; the article is already very long. I have gone ahead and posted the material along with correctly formatted citations. You know Wikipedia just has to be sure everything is properly sourced so as to avoid lawsuits. Happy editing. -- Diannaa (Talk) 01:52, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
 * oh it looks like I changed it while you were already changing it back with my citations, I think it's the same, but please check. I've used wiki for many years, but fairly new to the editing process, to be fair what you said makes sense, thank you for your consideration. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Christopherbrian (talk • contribs) 02:01, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Multi-instrumentalist
While a great category, Multi-instrumentalist/Multiple instruments in the bio box is very uninformative. What instruments, please? 71.234.215.133 (talk) 17:51, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

"A Different Story"
Now, I know very well that WP is full of speculations and rumors, so I'd rather refrain from immediately putting in everything which I think is logical: The documentary's title, A Different Story, lets me think of an allusion to Michael's 1985 solo hit "A Different Corner". That plausible ? -andy 217.50.56.37 (talk) 11:26, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Prisoner cats
I believe these should be included on every bio of those who have been prisoners or detainees. Wikipedia doesn't do many 'former' or 'current' cats. If an actor stops acting and becomes a politician, we don't remove the actor acts because he's no longer an actor. We keep child actor cats on people who are now old, they are not removed because the subject is no longer a child. Where does it say, in BLP or elesewhere, that prisoner cats should be any different? Jim Michael (talk) 13:35, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Its just part of or BLP guidelines to be respectful in our reporting and classification of living people - not everyone who has committed a crime should be labeled as a criminal and it is quite common practice to remove living people from the prisoner cat when they are no longer a prisoner - please remember that Michael is a notable singer and not a notable criminal. Off2riorob (talk) 13:41, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

Article expansion
There is a recent edit, added by an IP, that I think is well-worth including in the article, but that I reverted due to BLP concerns. Please have a look through and add the things that are already referenced. If you can find references for the other statements, I think they should go in too. I think the style of using years in the section headings should be adopted also. Does anyone have any concerns about adopting it? All the best. — Mr. Stradivarius  ( drop me a line ) 14:01, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi, its difficult to see which bits of that edit would be beneficial, parts of it look ok but I would suggest picking them out and adding them one by one. As for the dates - it seems reasonable to me, are other major stars arranged in such a way? This section needs work and the title is confusing George_Michael - does it mean after the album 25 or the age 25? Off2riorob (talk) 15:05, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi, first I want to thank Mr. Stradivarius for appreciating my edits in the article. About the edits I made, it not something new really. Most of my edits were in-fact in Wikipedia and I just organized them and made it look new and attractive for the readers. However, I'll try to get references ASAP and provide them here. About the section Life_after_Twenty_Five, I think it talks about the life of George Michael after the album Twenty Five. 188.135.88.134 (talk) 15:43, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I provided references for statements in the Musical career section ,except the sub-section of Life after Twenty Five 188.66.145.55 (talk) 18:20, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

George Michael has announced a concert tour for the fall which I feel is relevant to the post. I wrote up the following on this for inclusion in the '2006–present: 25 Live and beyond' section: On May 11, 2011, George Michael announced he would be embarking on a European tour starting with the August 22 date in Prague. Michael will be accompanied on the tour by a backing orchestra, and he will be performing rearranged versions of his songs. The tour is slated to visit 40 cities throughtout Europe. Michael anticipates a second leg of the tour will launch in March 2012 in Paris.

Jewish maternal grandmother
It seems that other Wikipedia users want to hide the fact that George Michael is Jewish according to Jewish law. http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/la-et-georgemichael14-2008jun14,1,217446.story 184.59.7.32 (talk)
 * Many Wikipedia biographies mention the subject's ancestry back to grandparents, great-grandparents and occasionally even further. This is relevant enough to warrant a brief mention in the Early life section. Jim Michael (talk) 15:32, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

It's just the Gentiles trying to white-wash History again...I have added this truth back into the main article. Thanks.GrandmaHebrew (talk) 04:30, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

Hey GrandmaHebrew ^ If anyone white-washes's history, over and over and over and over again, it's you people! (120.149.121.133 (talk) 03:40, 20 May 2013 (UTC))


 * The article mentions that his maternal grandmother was Jewish because we have a reliable source for that fact. It does not say that he is Jewish because we do not have a reliable source for that. - Sum mer PhD  (talk) 02:00, 10 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure why George Michael believes this (if he does), but his maternal grandmother was not Jewish. Her name was Daisy Angold Young, and she was the daughter of Edward Reuben Young and Sarah Susannah Angold (Sarah's lineage is documented here). Perhaps Michael (incorrectly) believes the surname "Angold" to be indicative of Jewish ancestry, but it isn't (his great-great-grandfather Henry Angold's line is traced here). George Michael's last matrilineal ancestor that I can find was his great-great-grandmother, Catharine Clarke, who was born in Hackney, Middlesex, England, in 1828, the daughter of Elizabeth and Thomas Clarke. Since she almost certainly wasn't Jewish, Michael isn't halachically Jewish (and doesn't appear to have any Jewish ancestry anyway). Michael's claim is disputed here, as well. So, I am going to remove this from the article, because I think it's pointless to go around spreading an incorrect piece of genealogical information. All Hallow&#39;s Wraith (talk) 01:04, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

To ^ you... I'm pretty sure the only person who knows if George Michael's maternal grandmother is Jewish or not is George Michael HIMSELF! (idiot!)(120.149.119.252 (talk) 10:27, 11 January 2013 (UTC))

English or British Cypriot?
The article states "an English musician", yet his father is of Greek Cypriot decent. Should it be changed to British Cypriot? WWETrishMickiefan (talk) 12:16, 30 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Perhaps Michael's father, Kyriacos Panayiotou (who moved to England years before Michael was born and changed his name to Jack Panos) should be described as British Cypriot. As far as I can tell, Michael is English born and raised. We're not talking about breeding dogs here. / edg ☺ ☭ 12:09, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

Missing Duets
IDK how to edit that section. However, a duet with Jody Watley is missing from the Duets list "Learn to Say No."

He also collaborated with Dion Estes (sp?) for "Heaven Help Me." Dion was the bass player for Wham. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amyanda2000 (talk • contribs) 01:10, 11 August 2012 (UTC)

Health troubles
Several sources reported that George Michael was hospitalised in May 2014, although this is not currently mentioned in the section on his health. A spokesperson for Michael issued a statement that read: "In response to newspaper reports…we can confirm George was admitted to hospital on May 22. He was discharged last weekend and is well and resting...He is very much looking forward to the release of his new single in July. Given the personal nature of this matter there will be no further comment"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2643376/George-Michaels-mystery-illness-Singer-recovering-home-spending-days-hospital-following-collapse.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05/29/george-michael-hopsital-london_n_5408467.html

http://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/george-michael-rushed-hospital-after-3619703

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/entertainment/news/george-michael-rushed-to-hospital-30314404.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by Isaaczohar (talk • contribs) 09:41, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 3 one external links on George Michael. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20100409010146/http://www.georgemichael-tribute.com:80/USMagazine.html to http://www.georgemichael-tribute.com/USMagazine.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20130915062553/http://www.hiponline.com/artist/music/m/michael_george/index.html to http://www.hiponline.com/artist/music/m/michael_george/index.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20080531071913/http://music.aol.ca:80/article/George-Michael-interview/554/ to http://music.aol.ca/article/George-Michael-interview/554/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers. —cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 06:06, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 December 2016
Cited his death using BBC News as a source. 92.24.114.143 (talk) 23:13, 25 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Pictogram voting wait.svg Already done KGirlTrucker81huh? what I've been doing 23:22, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 December 2016
George Micheal. Death at his home in Goring, Oxfordshire, England on the 25th December 2016 82.27.192.103 (talk) 23:16, 25 December 2016 (UTC)
 * U2713.svg Already done. JudgeRM   (talk to me)  23:24, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Privacy issue?
The article currently states (name redacted by me):


 * On 23 July 2006, Michael was again accused of engaging in anonymous public sex, this time at London's Hampstead Heath. The anonymous partner was stated (wrongly, as it turned out) to be 58-year-old [name deleted], an unemployed van driver. Despite saying that he intended to sue both the News of the World tabloid who supposedly photographed the incident and [name deleted] for slander, Michael stated that he cruised for anonymous sex and that this was not an issue in his relationship with partner Kenny Goss.

Why is the 58-year-old man identified in the article if he didn't have sex with George Michael? Did the man in fact claim to News of the World that he had had sex with Michael, when in fact he hadn't? And the paragraph goes on to say that Michael said he was going to sue the newspaper and the 58-year-old man, but leaves it unclear as to whether he actually did so (and this incident was 10 years ago, so if the lawsuit was ever filed it should have been concluded a long time ago). --Metropolitan90 (talk) 03:54, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Elephant in the room? (AIDS/HIV Related Death)
It's obvious. Is someone going to add him to Category:AIDS-related deaths in the United Kingdom? 68.32.97.56 (talk) 01:27, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. - Fuzheado &#124; Talk 02:03, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * http://www.smobserved.com/story/2016/12/25/news/singer-george-michael-succumbs-to-hivaids-at-53-in-london/2421.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.252.110.114 (talk) 02:28, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * This does not seem to be a reliable source considering this is the only so far. WP:RS for this claim should be something like LA Times or BBC (IMO). -  Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 02:34, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Here's some background on the publisher of the Santa Monica Observer. This paper also speculated that Prince died of AIDS although it is now known that he died of a drug overdose. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  02:58, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I also reviewed this source (Santa Monica Observer) and there are a few sources claiming his death was HIV related. It appears to be speculation, but hey, the speculation may be accurate.  People don't normally die of Pneumonia and viral infections at age 53,  and these types of health issues have been repeatedly reported for the subject of this bio.  I do not know for certain if these sources are just guessing or if they have a lead from sources close to the subject of the bio.  Give it a few days to see if some more reputable sources come forward with reliable reports to verify this.  Right now it appears to be original research. Octoberwoodland (talk) 05:19, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Generally, claims of AIDS-related deaths should be viewed with a healthy dose of skepticism; modern antiretroviral treatment (HAART) has made progression to AIDS increasingly rare. TompaDompa (talk) 05:31, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Based on the public sources of the conduct of the subject of this bio (and very well described in the article itself), its clear he has a long history of alcohol and drug abuse, both of which can cause severe, life threatening health issues, so you may have a point. And yes, modern science is close to not only suppressing the disease HIV in people infected with it, but coming closer and closer to curing it from research published.  Octoberwoodland (talk) 05:36, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * His publicist claims he died of a heart attack, and went peacefully. -- Problem I have with this is that I have survived a heart attack, and there is nothing peaceful about it when you have one -- cardiac victims often bite off their tongue the pain is so incredible.  I think folks just need to sit back and wait and see what other reports surface.  Oddly the Santa Monica Observer claims the source of the HIV related claims was from his publicist.  This one is a wait and see... Octoberwoodland (talk) 05:49, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Totally agree with, the article is not going anywhere. Mlpearc Phone  ( open channel ) 05:52, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * The publicist didn't say anything about a heart attack (that is, a myocardial infarction). He said he died of heart failure, which is not the same thing. TompaDompa (talk) 05:57, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * When your heart starts to shut down, it's agonizing, no matter how hard you try to breathe, you feel like you are being smothered inside a bubble of pain -- it's anything but peaceful and serene. A heart attack is a form of heart failure, and they are a very unpleasant experience.  If severe enough, you just fall down dead -- and its not peaceful.  That's where I have a problem with reports of "went peacefully due to heart failure".  Not buying it.  Octoberwoodland (talk) 06:07, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Speculation about the circumstances of this death are of no value, since we are obligated to summarize what high quality reliable sources say about this death, and nothing more. It matters not at all what any individual editor imagines to be the truth. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  06:20, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * You are so right -- wait and see what sources show up. Right now its all just OR. Octoberwoodland (talk) 06:22, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

source for disposition of emotional distress claims in the suit filed by officer Marcelo Rodriguez against George Michael
The article has a subsection entitled Anonymous sex that includes the statement that
 * Michael made a video for his single "Outside", which satirised the public toilet incident and featured men dressed as policemen kissing. Rodríguez claimed that this video "mocked" him, and that Michael had slandered him in interviews. In 1999, he brought a US$10 million court case in California against the singer. The court dismissed the case, but an appellate court reinstated the case on 3 December 2002.[136] The court then ruled Rodríguez, as a public official, could not legally recover damages for emotional distress.[137]

Citation 137 is to some _Sunday Star_, which does not have an URL.

Citation 136, does have a link, and is to the actual opinion of the court of appeal.

However, the statement that "Rodríguez, as a public official, could not legally recover damages for emotional distress" seems to come from the dissent, not the majority opinion, which remanded the case to the lower court for further proceedings.

So:
 * 1) Am i reading the opinion correctly?  (Could somebody please check?)
 * 2) What happened in the lower court subsequent to the appeal?  (Did the parties settle?  Were the terms public?)

The opinion was written about 14 years ago, so it seems like there should have been time.

(And RIP GM.)

Son of eugene (talk) 06:43, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request
Infobox needs this line to avoid a parsing error:


 * death_date         = December 25, 2016

67.172.124.92 (talk) 23:13, 25 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Somebody got it. Thanks. 67.172.124.92 (talk) 23:15, 25 December 2016 (UTC)

Wham had 4 members george, andrew, pepsi and shirley, their first 2 songs were young guns and bad boys Agapehealthy (talk) 07:55, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Fact correction
Wham had 4 original members george, andrew, pepsi and shirley, their first 2 songs were young guns and bad boys Agapehealthy (talk) 07:57, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but you are incorrect, .  Backup dancers were not full members of the group,  and Pepsi DeMacque did not start performing with Wham! until a year after the group began performing. Cullen328   Let's discuss it  08:26, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

The "anonymous sex" section
Wouldn't it be better renamed to something like "sex scandals" or "anonymous public sex"? The section is mostly about Michael's breaking the law, yet the title doesn't reflect that.--Adûnâi (talk) 16:29, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Tend to agree. So I've changed it to "Illegal activity". Doesn't exactly cover the Hampstead Heath episode, so open to any further suggestions. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:36, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Rehab in 2015
Why is there no mention of him being in rehab last year? http://www.express.co.uk/celebrity-news/589386/Chubby-George-Michael-unrecognisable-steps-out-Swiss-rehab-celebrate-52nd-birthday (KDandridge (talk) 18:12, 26 December 2016 (UTC))

Comic Relief
I'm completely aware of where I'm in regards to 3RR, so I'm starting this discussion. My views on this subject can be seen in my summaries IMO this is un-encyclopedic and trivial. Looking for consensus. - Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 17:44, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * If he had been a guest host on Saturday Night Live, then that might be summarized. However, the former superstar had been on hundreds of television shows; why single out one show? Did he receive any formal award or formal recognition of his performance on that show? I am not convinced for keeping. 176.11.146.26 (talk) 19:28, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Change section to "Legal sanctions" or "Illegal activity resulting in fines and community service"
The section title "Illegal activity" implies crimes from jaywalking and up to and including manslaughter and deliberate murder. What about "Community service sentence and being fined" as a (sub-) section title. "Legal sanctions" might be an appropriate section title. 176.11.146.26 (talk) 19:21, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * Actually, "illegal activity" could include something like a breach of contract.--Jack Upland (talk) 19:32, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

What area of Cyprus that Michael's father is from
In wikipedia articles about celebrities, it is common to say which region of a country that one (or both) of the parents come from. I believe that it is common knowledge that his father came from Limassol or the vicinity. What should the article say? 176.11.146.26 (talk) 17:55, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * If a reliable source can be found then please add it. Spiderone  19:34, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

The Older EP at AfD
There is an ongoing discussion about the notability of The Older EP. All are invited to participate in the discussion or help improve the article. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 00:16, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

Autopsy Ordered
The speculation should be over soon since an autopsy has been ordered to determine the cause of death. We should know something in a few days. ''Police officials, who had announced that Mr. Michael died in “unexplained but not suspicious” circumstances at his home in Goring-on-Thames, England, could not be reached for further details on Monday because of Boxing Day. The singer’s manager, Michael Lippman, on Monday declined to elaborate on his statement that Mr. Michael had died of heart failure, “in bed, lying peacefully.” Forensic experts said an autopsy report could be ready in a couple of days.''Octoberwoodland (talk) 01:12, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

Garbled text
The article states that, "Despite saying that he intended to sue both the News of the World tabloid who supposedly photographed the incident for libel, Michael stated that he cruised for anonymous sex". At least the first half of that sentence is not only ungrammatical but so garbled and confused that I am not even sure what it means. Unfortunately, the source the sentence is based upon does not appear to be available, so my preferred option would be to simply remove the confused text. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 21:28, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * See above on this page under Privacy issue?. The article had previously said that Michael said he planned to sue both the News of the World and a certain identified person, but the other person's name was removed from the sentence since my earlier post. And the text has since been revised further. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 03:06, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

Heart failure
Medical note: Heart failure means that the heart is incapable of pumping enough blood to meet the body's requirements. It does not mean that the heart stopped beating altogether (that would be cardiac arrest). It is also not the same thing as a heart attack (myocardial infarction).

With that in mind, the manager's claim that he died of heart failure is conjecture; he simply could not know. Considering laypeople often do not know the precise meanings of medical terms, it is likely the manager meant something different. The circumstances (age 53, unexpected death, died peacefully) also point towards a cause of death other than heart failure.

Don't get me wrong, it is possible that George Michael had in fact been diagnosed with heart failure previously, that the manager was aware of this, that the manager inferred that the heart failure was the cause of death, and that this inference was correct. However, this would still only be a guess that turned out to be correct. TompaDompa (talk) 06:20, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Im sure his publicist is an expert forensic doctor who has completed an autopsy. Heart not beating is the worse failure it can have.--Simon19801 (talk) 00:13, 28 December 2016 (UTC)


 * I'm an EMT, and I fully understand the differences you are trying to express. But the quote is accurate and I don't see a problem including it so long as it is properly attributed (as it was). Brianga (talk) 06:29, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * , I'm with on this one. I don't particularly care whether that tidbit is in, but if it's clearly stated that this is in the manager's voice, I have no problem with it. — ATS  &#128406;  talk  06:36, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * The problem I see is that it is misleading (per the WP:Editing policy, "on Wikipedia a lack of content is better than misleading or false content"); the average person reading the article would expect the manager's words to be authoritative on the subject, which they are not. It could be rephrased to make the conjectural aspect more clear, however. TompaDompa (talk) 06:38, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * The "average person" knows that heart failure is not a conclusive medical finding and that it will take some time to get something more formal. However, that is the best description we now have for the cause of death, and is certainly better than what fake news sites are spouting. Once more authoritative sources are available,  they can be incorporated into the article. Cullen328   Let's discuss it  07:04, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I'm not so sure they know that. If they don't know the precise meaning of heart failure (which I put it to you that they probably do not), I would not expect them to know how long it would take to confirm or rule it out as the cause of death. I further disagree that it is the best description we have at the moment; the best description is that the cause of death is as of yet unknown. I do agree that the manager's speculation is better than the media's, but I think no speculation at all would be far better still. TompaDompa (talk) 09:32, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Heart failure is a known cause of death and the person who has that, family and close friends would be aware of it, I have it and the age if death is consistent. The fact the manager has made the statement is irrefutable and is part of widespread reliable media reports globally. Pennine rambler (talk) 07:15, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * Fatal Myocarditis leading to heart failure can occur if the immune system is compromised due to HIV, or the use of medications which suppress white blood cell production, such as Clozapine. A blood test is used to measure the level of Troponin in the bloodstream in such cases which indicates heart damage.  For an autopsy, an endomyocardial biopsy specimen will show specific damage and the presence of Eosinophils in endocardium and myocardium. Octoberwoodland (talk) 07:26, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

A follow up re medical note at top of discussion, the most common cause of death in heart failure is Sudden Cardiac Death, the heart literally stops, http://www.leicestershospitals.nhs.uk/professionals/gp-video-based-education/series-1-videos-1-15/sudden-cardiac-death/ Pennine rambler (talk) 07:27, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

Regarding some attempts in conversation here to associate heart failure to HIV treatment, there is not to my knowledge any link, opportunistic infections and skin cancers would also have caused the singer problems if that was the cause of death and given the medical treatment now for HIV the likely hood of that is remote, I happen to have a close friend who has HIV so am well aware of both conditions,  Pennine rambler (talk) 07:38, 26 December 2016 (UTC)
 * , to the best of my knowledge, there is zero evidence in reliable sources at this time that Michael was HIV positive. Lacking such evidence, your detailed,  wikilinked speculation about HIV/AIDS causing his death is contrary to policy and completely out of line. It contributes nothing to improving this biography. Please desist,  unless reliable sources (not fake news sites) report that he was HIV positive. Cullen<sup style="color:#707">328   Let's discuss it  08:41, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * Well, I have been monitoring the press and so far there are no reliable sources stating he died of HIV complications. Also, more facts are emerging, including the fact that George Michael's boyfriend Fadi Fawaz found him already dead in bed at his home which totally contradicts the statements by his publicist that he died peacefully in his sleep since no one was apparently present at the moment of his death, ergo the publicists statements cannot be taken as accurate.  I have located three separate articles speculating he died of HIV related illness, but all of it is just speculation.  One of them is the Daily Mail in the UK.  Octoberwoodland (talk) 00:48, 27 December 2016 (UTC)


 * I totally agree with you Cullen328 who ever is adding speculation about his HIV status to this article should stop.--Pennine rambler (talk) 14:09, 26 December 2016 (UTC)

I had no idea he had HIV. But if that's a hoax, it isn't funny. Sob.RoobayKC (talk) 10:12, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * In spite of the pressure being exerted by one of the commenters here to label Mr Michael's death as HIV-related, I agree with TompaDompa. His manager is speculating, of course, even if he believes or hopes what he said is true. There are quite a few conditions that can lead to a quick, unattended death, including a stroke (embolism or aneurysm), a thoracic or abdominal aneurysm, pulmonary embolism, a head injury (they don't need to leave external marks to be devastating), and the already-mentioned sudden cardiac death.


 * However, one thing that hasn't been mentioned is Michaels had a long struggle with depression. The holidays can be a very difficult time for those suffering from depression and results in a spike of suicides. Also, a sudden piece of bad news can increase depression. (And, yes - depression causes great suffering.) A person can intentionally give oneself a toxic substance or an overdose of a narcotic to seek relief from the suffering. In the case of a narcotic overdose, he could have tidied away the evidence before going to bed to await the end.


 * My point is that, in the absence of evidence, there are plenty of possibilities for which we have no conclusion. If it were up to me, I'd leave out the manager's speculation and leave in that an autopsy is underway. If the responding EMTs (or whatever they are called in England) or the hospital he was transported to, make an official statement, then include a quote. There's no need to prematurely push for an HIV-related death. As for AIDS, people just do not die of it in secret - it is a long process that causes great suffering and very obvious signs in the patient's appearance. Whatever the cause of Mr Michael's death, I do hope it was peaceful. Thank you, Wordreader (talk) 23:03, 26 December 2016 (UTC)


 * In the UK a doctor is required to certify a death, and one would have been called on suspecting something was seriously wrong with Michael. The doctor would have told the person(s) present, e.g., Michael's family, friends, what he/she suspected was the cause of death. The family or friends would have informed Michael's manager.


 * Thus "heart failure" would have been a medically-qualified person's diagnosis of the cause of death, not the manager's opinion. The actual cause would have to await a post mortem, which is carried out in all cases of sudden and unexpected death in England and Wales.


 * FWIW, he probably died peacefully in his sleep some time during the night. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.145.115.127 (talk) 10:37, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 December 2016
Add Pp-semi template.

--186.145.98.162 (talk) 15:11, 28 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done - Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 16:56, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

Yog?
Ridgeley just paid tribute to him as "my beloved Yog". Huh?

Google reveals some others using the name as well. One fan site claims it's for "Yours Only, George". Hmmm. That sounds like it was kludged onto the name after the fact.

Another links it to the Greek pronunciation of his name. This sounds way more likely to me. Is Yog an established nickname for (other) Georgioses? Or was this a one-off for him specifically?

Was he commonly known by this? Ridgeley's tweet is the first I've EVER heard him called this! 209.172.23.106 (talk) 08:14, 27 December 2016 (UTC)


 * There was a clip of George himself yesterday, played by Paddy O'Connell in the tribute programme on the BBC Radio 2 Ken Bruce show. It clarified that it was simply the family nickname used for George at home, heard by a 12-year old Andrew Ridgeley, and reported to their classmates the next day. So it was essentially a familial contraction as heard through Ridgeley's Hertfordshire ears. (It seems that, in Greek the final s on Georgios denotes the formal nominative case). He said that he was quite protective over the use of the nickname and it was meant to be used only by those close friends who had originally known him by that name. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:54, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

The Greek name "Georgios" is habitually contracted to "Yorgas" and further to "Yorg" or "Yog" by Greeks all around the world - note here the similarity in Russian "Yuriy" being the derivative of "Georgiy" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.122.43.186 (talk) 16:03, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

According to George, Andrew Ridgeley used to call him 'yogurt' at school as a joke! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.189.17.243 (talk) 18:20, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

Choice of professional name
This hasn't jumped out at me so it may be mentioned somewhere in the text already, but a sentence or two about how he came to choose his professional name could be worth including if that information is available. This is Paul (talk) 16:34, 28 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I've seen some reports, on pop/fan sites that it may have been after an uncle Michael. But reliable sources seem to be wholly lacking. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:39, 29 December 2016 (UTC)

Link leads to Wrong Article
Hi. Near the top of this article where it says he is known for songs such as, the link for "faith" directs to the article about the album and not the song Geekgirl1990 (talk) 19:44, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
 * You seem to have misread that. As of my writing this, the sentence reads "He was best known for his work in the 1980s and 1990s, including hit singles such as "Last Christmas" and "Wake Me Up Before You Go-Go", and albums such as Faith (1987) and Listen Without Prejudice Vol. 1 (1990)." That is, the sentence refers to the album and not the song, which the link reflects. TompaDompa (talk) 20:09, 29 December 2016 (UTC)
 * The single "Faith" would be almost equally notable, as it was 1988's best-selling single in the United States. It made No.1 in the US, but only No.2 in the UK. The lead can't mention everything and I think it's fair that the album be considered the greater and thus more notable work. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:46, 29 December 2016 (UTC)

West Country accent
I've been trying to trim out the worst trivia and fancruft from the article. Is the factoid about the accent really worth recording, User:PaleCloudedWhite? Interested to see what others think too. --John (talk) 16:44, 27 December 2016 (UTC)
 * As I stated in my edit summary when I restored the info, this is an indication of a damaged brain (or rather, it can result from one) and, if it persists, is a recognised rare condition. Why do you think this is trivial? Do you think he did it for a laugh? It's only one sentence in the article, not a whole paragraph. PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 16:58, 27 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes, I saw your edit summary. Is there any evidence that it did persist? Did anyone other than Michael comment on it? Depending on the answers to those questions, I reserve the right to continue to think of it as trivia. --John (talk) 17:05, 27 December 2016 (UTC)
 * The article supporting that info uses the accent fact as its headline, and places it higher up the page than information that Michael lost 5 weeks of his memory. If it's good enough for the Daily Telegraph, I don't see why it isn't good enough for here. It's not as if we're making it into a headline - it's only one sentence in the article. PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 17:23, 27 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I agree that it is unusual enough to be notable. I don't see why it should be described as "fancruft". I'd even be tempted to add Michael's own theory about becoming obsessed with BBC sitcom Nighty Night. But then I quite like factoids. Martinevans123 (talk) 17:33, 27 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I respect your opinions, obviously, but I am still not hearing answers to my questions. I assume the answers are "no" and "no". --John (talk) 10:07, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * You are free to consider the information trivial if you wish - that is your opinion. However, questions can be framed in many ways, and different questions produce different answers. The information that you object to is reliably sourced from an article headlined specifically on this topic, and from that we have one sentence in our article. So a different question to ask is, why are you so focussed on it as something to be removed? PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 10:35, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Because I think it is trivial. Because Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information. Because not everything ever reported about a famous person needs to be in their Wikipedia article. --John (talk) 10:45, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * If Michael himself commented, it suggests it was significant to him. I'd think a speech disorder must be quite disturbing for an internationally famous vocal artist. As PCW has pointed out, the article devotes a mere 22 words to this topic. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:48, 30 December 2016 (UTC)

Color Photo for Lead Section
Do we have a good color photo on commons for George Michael instead of the B/W photo we are currently using? Does anyone have a preference for which photo we use. The current photo of him shirtless and B/W isn't that good. Comments? Octoberwoodland (talk) 17:52, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * The others at Commons, all colour, and just not as good a quality as this one. And it does show him performing, in 1988, at the height of his fame. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:07, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Maybe someone could ping Fadi Fawaz and ask him to upload and release a better photo an give WP permission to use it. Octoberwoodland (talk) 18:25, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Haven't exactly got him on saved contacts. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:29, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I tried to ping him once but he said that I wasn't his type... PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 18:35, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * He has a twitter account I'll send him a ping and see if he can release a better photo for us to use. Octoberwoodland (talk) 18:59, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * If you make such a request now, please word it carefully; the man will be in grief. It might be more sensitive to wait a while. PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 19:07, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * I'd suggest not wording anything. Making a request to someone grieving is not exactly respectful is it? Regards the colour, black and white is fine (see Ali, Michael Jackson, Lady Gaga etc.). Also it's a very good representation of George Michael in his prime.GaryGill (talk) 19:24, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok. Let's leave the photo the way it is. Octoberwoodland (talk) 19:50, 30 December 2016 (UTC)

Birth name is NOT Panos
His birth name should be "Georgios Kyriacos Panayiotou", not Panos. He was identified by his full name in the Beverly Hills police statement after his 1998 arrest and Georgios Kyriacos Panayiotou name was used when the police officer filed suit against him. Panayiotou is aloso the name used to register his music with the United States copyright office. All sources below show his full, legal name as "Georgios Kyriacos Panayiotou".

ETA: He also used Panayiotou as his surname when HE sued Sony Music back in 1992, evidenced by Wikipedia's own article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panayiotou_v_Sony_Music_Entertainment_(UK)_Ltd

http://www.morelaw.com/verdicts/case.asp?s=CA&d=22007

http://cocatalog.loc.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?Search_Arg=+Panayiotou&Search_Code=NALL&PID=178dIUUHwOfpT5yM3ONJEQ5H2_3WD&SEQ=20161231012216&CNT=25&HIST=1

https://www.findadeath.com/Deceased/m/George%20Michael/george_michael.htm — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.185.208.185 (talk) 06:36, 31 December 2016 (UTC)

Police Probing Drug Overdose Theory after Autopsy
''Cops to question George Michael's boyfriend over drug fears. GEORGE Michael’s boyfriend will be quizzed by detectives probing the singer’s death. ... “There’s a strong suspicion that this was drug related, so officers will be keen to ascertain who may have been supplying any drugs to George.” '' See  Octoberwoodland (talk) 03:07, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * I'm not inclined to take much notice of that particular source, although I would imagine it's pretty standard for them to investigate such things when someone has died at home alone and unexpectedly. This is Paul (talk) 14:42, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * The police will naturally want to explore all possibilities now that the post-mortem was inconclusive. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:57, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

Protected edit request on 1 January 2017
Insert hyphen here in Death Section "to long term stardom." Wlmg (talk) 14:11, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Personally no objection to making punctuation corrections in quotes, where something is obviously wrong. But a hyphen (assume you may mean a dash?) is not used in the BBC source. So I suggest we just stick with the text like what they wrote it. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:30, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * No I did mean Hyphen and my suggested correction would be proper for American English regarding hyphenate adjectives. However, as you said it is a BBC quote and they use the Queen's English (I think?). I've run into this sort of thing before with articles written in the Queen's English. I do agree with you to leave it as it is.Wlmg (talk) 19:26, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * It just looks like standard BBC to me, and perfectly proper as written. Michael was British, so I'm not sure why we wouldn't want the entire article to be written in British English. I don't think the Queen herself intervened personally in the writing of that piece, but then she is suffering from a heavy cold at the moment, so we probably need to be patient. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 19:36, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * HA! It's like the old joke attributed to Winston Churchill, "We are one people separated by a common language".Wlmg (talk) 20:07, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

Fadi Fawaz Twitter Account Hacked/Fake News Stories
Some reports that George Michael attempted suicide were tweeted from Fadi Fawaz's twitter account. Fadi claims the account was hacked and fake tweets were posted and he subsequently deleted the account and the tweets. See Octoberwoodland (talk) 20:40, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

A source quoted in the Mirror says that the singer committed suicide due to the loss of singing ability
See these 2 articles - if you only choose one to quote from, the first has much more information about this subject, but the 2nd has other information:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/george-michael-feared-hed-never-9543573

http://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/george-michael-killed-himself-christmas-9545132

For the citations:

108.30.214.13 (talk) 21:45, 1 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Are you proposing any change to the article content? Otherwise this looks like WP:FORUM which should be deleted. Tabloid sources are not suitable for WP:BLP. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:06, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Fadi Fawaz has already stated that his twitter account was hacked and that these are fake news stories. Octoberwoodland (talk) 22:18, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

Rehab before death
Is it true he spent two years in rehab from 2014 to 2016? (2A00:23C4:638C:4500:6051:389F:3949:8E32 (talk) 17:54, 2 January 2017 (UTC))
 * Surely we all secretly aspire to tears before bedtime? Martinevans123 (talk) 18:00, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

Instruments should include "keyboards"
Instruments should include "keyboards" as well, not only "vocals". He played keyboards on most Wham! songs and played almost entirely the "Faith" album, for instance.Outerspace813 (talk) 12:00, 3 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Difficult to know what was played by him and what was played by Chris Cameron on that album. Did he ever play keyboards at live shows? And most of his career was after Wham? Martinevans123 (talk) 12:05, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

Jewish grandmother?
"His maternal grandmother was Jewish and hid her faith from her own children to keep them safe during World War II."

Is this really germane? And what the hell does the bold bit mean? --John (talk) 10:09, 30 December 2016 (UTC)
 * His maternal grandmother, born Daisy Angold Young, was the daughter of Edward Reuben Young and Sarah Susannah Angold, and was not Jewish at all. Perhaps Michael thought "Angold" was a Jewish surname, although it almost always, as it is in this case, not of Jewish origin. See also this. All Hallow&#39;s Wraith (talk) 11:52, 30 December 2016 (UTC)


 * It's pure WP:OR to remove it, since it's recorded in reliable sources (LA Times). Avaya1 (talk) 22:17, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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Fadi Fawaz Reports Rehab Stint with George Michael
''Fawaz, who was the one who discovered the body, has now opened up about his partner’s battle with depression. Michael spent two months at a £37,700-per week clinic in Byron Bay in 2013 to tackle anxiety issues. Fawaz is said to have stayed been with Michael during his stint in Australia, and he has admitted the stretch was “tough” for the singer. See   Fadi said they played snooker every night to comfort George as he stayed at a £30,000 clinic in 2013 for treatment over “emotional anxiety and other issues” George sought treatment for “emotional anxiety and other issues” from February 2013, and Fadi accompanied him at the £30,000-per-week sanctuary while visiting family in Queensland. Describing the period as “two months I will remember forever”, Fadi says he and George played snooker every night at the facility to comfort George as he battled his demons. Posting on Twitter, Fadi said: “Even though were tough 2 months but I cherish them.” Fadi confided in his close friend – hairdresser Kevin Vella – who said: “ I remember you being with GM in Byron bay, we spoke everyday coz it was a bit of a rough patch.” '' See  Octoberwoodland (talk) 00:09, 16 January 2017 (UTC)
 * We can't use unconfirmed gossip from tabloid newspapers, I'm afraid. Karst (talk) 23:13, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

Jewish
Was he really Jewish? I thought that was just a myth. (2A00:23C4:638F:5000:1CA1:57EC:6ACB:EC24 (talk) 21:25, 28 February 2017 (UTC))
 * As the article says, his maternal grandmother was Jewish. Michael himself was raised in the Greek Orthodox faith. Karst (talk) 21:33, 28 February 2017 (UTC)
 * I thought that had been debunked after his death. Michael had assumed she was Jewish because of her name. (2A00:23C4:638F:5000:1CA1:57EC:6ACB:EC24 (talk) 21:43, 28 February 2017 (UTC))
 * At the moment it is adequately sourced (as discussed previously). If there are recent sources that call it into doubt, it will be good to discuss them. Karst (talk) 23:17, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

editing
i changed a few words on his page about his obituary...

i actually had to make a new paragraph before that as soon as "fatty tissue" was put at the end of cause of death,it carried on as in its obituary from the bbc,no paragraph no cap letter,that was bad in itself,ive contributed by payment to wiki to save it/help it run,,but what do i get harrasment and bullying from several users!!

I made a new paragraph and also put a capital letter instread of a small undercase one.who ever had edited this before was not a very good editor.I then get picked up by saying the it should read .....In its obituary the bbc.....i changed this to the in the bbcs obituary..which i think is correct ive been harrassed by a person who speaks in vulcan ,not a real language but tv series who lives in america,,im from the United Kingdom so know more about british ways of how a british person speaks and writes...george micheal was british,he would have understood im sure

the british and the americans speak totally in different ways i see..here in uk we say ie 22nd march 1997...in america they say march 22 97 which alot of english people disagree with..which is spreading across europe now..its now even appearing on out tv screens with that type of dating when new films are advertised..ot movies as americans say,I for one want to keep our britishness.

Sorry i digress

But i find being spoken to by a vulcan and intimidating me i find this unnacceptable! Im being watched and followed by certain people who as soon as i change a word they pounce at my edit and change it..this is stalking! not acceptable at all.

Also other editors of G Ms page

Very blunt .very agreesssive and very alarming

I have had heart disease since age of 23..im now 50,ive had 10 heart attacks two triple bypasses.10 pacemakers and a mini stroke,,i find it very stessful when editors erc tell me off like school child!

thank ypu for reading,please add if you agree?

it was signed with Drew270 13th March 2017 at 01.17am..but this was deleted by wiki str8 away

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Drew270 (talk • contribs) 01:16, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Funeral
One matter-of-fact sentence can be added using this BBC link. Karst (talk) 05:14, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

CBE source?
What is the source for the CBE claim? I have found no sources that he was so honoured while alive. There are several petitions requesting he be awarded posthumously; however, a rejected petition titled "Give George Michael a posthumous Award from Queen for contribution to Music." states that people cannot be so honoured posthumously. This petition is on UK parliament's official petitions website, and is numbered "176282". Additionally, he is not listed on the Queen's New Year's Honours List 2017, nor the Queen's Birthday Honours List 2017.

Petrichorpnw (talk) 00:55, 22 June 2017 (UTC)


 * I have removed it along with the category. The burden is on those who want to add it to provide reliable source for the information.  ~ GB fan 22:13, 23 June 2017 (UTC)


 * I only became involved here because I observed a user edit warring(which one cannot do even if they are 100% correct); that said, upon doing a search, I could not find anything to support this claim(even the BBC entry for him that comes up is just a copy of the Wikipedia article). 331dot (talk) 22:18, 23 June 2017 (UTC)

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Michael Parkinson December 1998 interview on the BBC
I'm surprised there is no mention of George's long and in-depth interview with Michael Parkinson in December 1998, on the BBC. It was the first tv interview in which he talked in depth about his sexuality and arrest. Much is made of Oprah's interview in 2004: this one was much earlier and more probing. 109.150.91.128 (talk) 16:52, 6 August 2017 (UTC)

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Lesley Angold (née Harrison; 1937–1997), was an English dancer of Jewish descent. NO SHE WASN'T!
Lesley Angold (née Harrison; 1937–1997), was an English dancer of Jewish descent. NO SHE WASN'T! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.167.39.149 (talk) 13:02, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

"Native name"
The infobox has an entry for Native name, which the Info template defines as "The artist's name in their own language." So what exactly was Michael's "own language"? He may well have spoken Greek while growing up at home. But the article currently doesn't mention this and certainly doesn't claim that Greek was his "native language". Martinevans123 (talk) 14:58, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

Gerorge Michael is not Jewish through his mother! so please correct this!
www.interfaithfamily.com/arts_and_entertainment/popular_culture/The_Jews_Who_Wrote_Christmas_Songs_2012.shtml

George Michael is not Jewish. There is a story on the internet that his mother is Jewish. This story is in error. Available biographical records conclusively show that Michael does not have a Jewish mother (or father). Last year (2011), a person responded to this same sentence by leaving a comment that noted that Michael has, at least once, said his mother is Jewish.

It is true. Michael has said his mother is Jewish. But it isn't true that his mother is Jewish.

I will just add this: without being bogged down in links to detailed ancestry charts, all of these charts show, on his mother's side, English, non-Jewish ancestry stretching back centuries. For whatever "weird" reason, Michael is making a fanciful claim of a Jewish mother. I don't know the reason Michael said what he did. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 101.167.39.149 (talk) 05:39, 19 October 2017 (UTC)


 * You do realise he is dead, don't you? Martinevans123 (talk) 17:14, 27 October 2017 (UTC)

Just substitute IS with WAS or is that to hard for you?^


 * Evidently. The article doesn't claim that Michael's mother was Jewish, but that she was "of Jewish doesn't". There is currently one source, the JTA article, from 26 December 2016. It says this:
 * "In a June 2008 interview, Michael told the Los Angeles Times that his maternal grandmother was Jewish, but she married a non-Jewish man and raised her children with no knowledge of their Jewish background due to her fear during World War II.
 * “She thought if they didn’t know that their mother was Jewish, they wouldn’t be at risk,” Michael told the newspaper. His mother attended convent school, losing any shred of memory of her mother’s Jewishness.
 * That all seems pretty clear. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:46, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Genealogical research shows that George Michael had no Jewish ancestry. It is unclear why he pretended his grandmother was of Jewish descent. (81.159.7.254 (talk) 07:10, 3 November 2017 (UTC))
 * Can you provide a source here for this "Genealogical research"? Michael's claim about his maternal grandmother has been published by many reliable sources. Perhaps a direct quote should be added to the article? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:18, 3 November 2017 (UTC)

Corrected wrong info re 'Fast Love', the song does have a chorus

I won't bore you with the details baby I don't even wanna waste your time Let's just say that maybe You could help to ease my mind Baby, I ain't Mr. Right

But if you're looking for fastlove If that's love in your eyes It's more than enough Had some bad love Some fastlove is all that I've got on my mind

Though he's listed as 7 no.1s Top of the Pops included his Wham! no.1s as well putting his total at 10 and 11 from when Jesus to a Child and Fast Love hit no.1. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:1CFA:8100:2421:C71E:5F24:744C (talk) 05:27, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

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Casey Kasem
Contrary to the article's assertion, Casey Kasem did mention the title a number of times on American Top 40, for example, on the 19 September 1987 edition.107.185.97.165 (talk) 00:13, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. The statement about Kasem is sourced, though I'm not sure how reliable a source it is - a doubt that's amplified upon reading the line, "Casey Kasem suddenly started acting like an old geyser". Saucy! One would have thought that a professional journalist might know the difference between geyser and geezer. lol. PaleCloudedWhite (talk) 07:19, 26 September 2018 (UTC)
 * "'ere Paley, me ol' china, I 'ad that Björk in the back of me Iceland taxi the uvver nite...." Martinevans123 (talk) 07:40, 26 September 2018 (UTC)

He was NOT Jewish!
George was NOT Jewish! Stop whitewashing history! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.224.198.189 (talk) 02:23, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 December 2018
Please change the following: "Michael performed a concert at Three Mills Studios, London, for MTV Unplugged.[76] It was his first long performance in years, and in the audience was Michael's mother. She died of cancer the following year.[77]"

To: "Michael performed a concert at Three Mills Studios, London, for MTV Unplugged.[76] It was his first long performance in years, and in the audience was Michael's mother, who died of cancer the following year.[77]"

The original reads as though the long concert was the cause of George Michael's mother's cancer. Possible, but highly unlikely! 86.4.113.59 (talk) 18:04, 17 December 2018 (UTC)
 * ✅. <u style="font:1.1em/1em Arial Black"><u style="color:#7f2ed1">Flooded <u style="color:#bfa6d8"> with them <u style="color:#7f2ed1">hundreds 18:06, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Number of Number Ones with different artistes
Should this article point out that George Michael was the first pop singer to have had four different Number Ones with four different artistes - on his own, with the band Wham!, with Band Aid and with Aretha Franklin?Vorbee (talk) 19:09, 26 January 2019 (UTC)


 * As long as there is a reliable source to support that statement, sure. SunCrow (talk) 00:00, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

Yog (singer) listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Yog (singer). Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. signed,Rosguill talk 23:40, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 December 2019
Article refers to his older sisters but one was younger. Word “older” needs removing. Quirky1 (talk) 22:44, 27 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 21:45, 30 December 2019 (UTC)

Older sister?
"His older sisters are Yioda (born 1962) and Melanie (1964-2019)."

If George Michael was born in 1963 and his sister Melanie in 1964, then Melanie is a younger sister, not an older sister. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.131.99.98 (talk) 00:41, 29 December 2019 (UTC)
 * ✅. Yes, "older" is obviously wrong to describe both sisters, as the sources give dates/ages for each, so I have removed that word. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:00, 30 December 2019 (UTC)

Important adding to article
It's remarkable that the G.Micheal sister died not in '2019' but exactly 3 years later.

''The family confirmed in a statement that Melanie "passed away suddenly" over Christmas.

Her brother, pop icon George Michael, died on Christmas Day 2016 at his home in Goring-on-Thames, Oxfordshire.

Andrew Ridgeley, George's former Wham! bandmate, described Melanie's death as "utterly tragic" and said his thoughts were with her family.

Melanie and George - whose mother Lesley died in 1997 - are survived by their father Kyriacos, known as Jack, and their oldest sister Yioda.

In a statement, released through lawyer John Reid, Melanie's fam''

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-50928067

His sister, btw, was an active supporter of G.M. AFAIK helping him in his career, i even read she care about GM hairstyle. So definitively she deserve a much bigger part in this article.

Another thing that is important: i don't understand why there is a photo of GM who is singing in 2012 London Olimpics but no mention in the article, even if there was in one of the many previous versions, when there was not the photo! It's really absurd!

For the records: he sang Freedom and white light, in the closing ceremony.

About Mandela day: he sang not one, but 3 covers: sexual healing was only the last one. The complete list was: Village Ghettoland, If You Were My Woman, Sexual Healing

I think that an article on G.M. should account better for his sister and for two of his key media activities (Mandela Day and 2012 London). I am not registered and i don't want to mess with edit wars, but the fact are available, it's only a question of will to write them. 62.11.3.98 (talk) 16:47, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 21:11, 26 March 2020 (UTC)
 * George Michael Wax.jpg

Semi-protected edit request on 20 October 2020
2001:56A:71FD:B500:19C1:7641:5B04:6B1B (talk) 03:11, 20 October 2020 (UTC) He actually existis.
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate.  -ink&amp;fables     «talk»   03:14, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Not Jewish
Extensive research has confirmed that George Michael did not have Jewish ancestry: https://18doors.org/the_jews_who_wrote_christmas_songs_2010/ (Westerhaley (talk) 14:13, 2 May 2021 (UTC))

Well done...
Well done my friend (im whispering) but wikipedia will never accept the truth. They refuse and believe to deny it for some GOD awful reason! FUCKING FUCKWITS! I BELIEVE YOU! But wikipeida has some kind of agenda. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:8003:d95f:3301:6c7c:d782:16f4:d7e6 (talk) 13:57, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

Legally Changing his name
The article is incorrect. His name was never legally changed to George Michael.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panayiotou_v._Sony_Music_Entertainment_(UK)_Ltd.

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-11299938

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/1994/06/22/singer-george-michael-stuck-with-sony-british-court-rules/d3177787-9be0-44fe-96ee-aa84ef8a5ba6/

"A Scotland Yard spokesman said: "On 21 December Georgious Panayiotou, a musician, 43, from Highgate was charged with being unfit to drive. He will appear on bail at Brent Magistrates court on January 11."

https://www.standard.co.uk/hp/front/george-michael-to-face-court-after-being-charged-by-police-for-being-unfit-to-drive-7181185.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.253.16.103 (talk) 05:35, 8 July 2021 (UTC)

The nickname "Yog"
There is no mention of the nickname Yog for Mr Michael. I was hoping to find some info about where it came from and how long it'd been used as a nickname. Would that be relevant to the article? If I can find information about it elsewhere, would it be a worthwhile addition?

70.26.129.233 (talk) 19:48, 16 September 2021 (UTC)


 * Do you have any reliable sources? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:56, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Edits
Made a bunch of edits. Did not give edit summaries for most of them--my fault. They were reverted (see https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=George_Michael&diff=1046961959&oldid=1046940303). I'd like to reinstate. Reasons for edits: Article is too long and detailed; there are some sources that aren't good; there is some repetition. 74.67.6.88 (talk) 00:40, 29 September 2021 (UTC)
 * No discussion, so I reinstated. 74.67.6.88 (talk) 21:48, 30 September 2021 (UTC)
 * You gave 45 hours? It's rather unfortunate that your changes, which have removed over 5Kbytes, are without any explanation, apart from "Article is too long and detailed; there are some sources that aren't good; there is some repetition." Doing them each one by one, with an edit summary, at least allows some discussion and partial revert, if necessary. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:48, 30 September 2021 (UTC)
 * You can’t just make “a bunch of edits” (removing over 5k worth) without any consensus. Having looked at the material in question there is a great deal of worthwhile information that is also reliably sourced, thus no justification to remove. PT Canavan (talk) 00:05, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
 * I tend to agree. I think the text should be restored and those aspects which may be directly covered by policy guidelines addressed first. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:07, 1 October 2021 (UTC)
 * OK. With the exception of some trivia about an unemployed van driver, I just restored all sources that were removed in my series of edits & the text that went with them. I reinstated my removal of unsourced material and my copyedits. Is everyone OK w/that? I wasn't trying to start trouble--just thought the article was way too long & unwieldy. 74.67.6.88 (talk) 01:22, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

Iraq War
Current text: "in particular the relationship between Tony Blair and George W. Bush, with their involvement in the Iraq War"

The Iraq War did not start until 2003, whereas "Shoot the Dog" was released in July 2002. This should therefore probably say something like "... and Bush, with their sabre-rattling in the direction of Iraq" (which was indeed going on in the summer of 2002), but I'm not sure how to word that. STeamTraen (talk) 17:20, 1 January 2022 (UTC)

The answer to the Yog question…
The nickname Yog came from Andrew Ridgeley’s inability to pronounce George’s real name Georgious, Which when pronounced in Greek by his family members sounds like it starts with an English Y sound eg: Yorgious, which Ridgeley stated sounded like yogurt thus the nickname Yog was invented. At the height of whams fame (or just before) some of George’s best friends clubbed together to buy him a gold wedding-type ring which had the name YOG inscribed on it in bold letters. 2A02:C7D:89A6:7100:D583:30E7:7ED5:9BCB (talk) 20:55, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Birthtime of George Michael and his deathtime
George Michael was born at 6:00 AM (05:00 GMT) on Tuesday, 25 June 1963, and died at 13:42 GMT on Sunday, a Christmas Day of 2016. Birthtimes and deathtimes are important because the difference of timezones. The standard timezone of Wikipedia is GMT, not including DST. 177.138.16.179 (talk) 10:24, 31 May 2022 (UTC)


 * We don't usually note times of birth or death. We generally just use the day for the time zone of birth? He was born and also died in England. What possible confusion could arise? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:13, 31 May 2022 (UTC)


 * WP:TIMEZONE indicates that we date events using the timezone where it took place. In the profoundly rare situation where someone had reason to calculate the date somewhere else in the world, they can research it elsewhere; that's not what Wikipedia is here for. Jason A. Quest (talk) 19:29, 31 May 2022 (UTC)

China
The first rock group to visit China was not Wham! It was the Moody Blues in 1972. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Braggbrat (talk • contribs) 14:18, 22 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Hi Braggbrat. I wonder do you have a source for that, as it does not appear at The Moody Blues? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:18, 22 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Note that this 2012 Q&A session with Justin Hayward says this:
 * "Can you give us the final definitive word on what happened re: the gig to have been played in China in 1974? (there have been a few conflicting stories)
 * "As I remember (and there will be different memories from each of the band members), the promoters just didn’t come up with a contract or a guarantee of work visas. Both of which were essential. It wasn’t our idea to go, we were invited to play there. It was a project that we all got excited about – it just didn’t happen."
 * Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:10, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

Picture
Hi fellow wikipedia enjoyers,

I 'm not entirely sure of the process of this, but I see that the main picture for this article has been updated to a more recent one, instead of the Michael onstage during The Faith Tour in 1988 one that was there for a long time. I much prefer the old picture as I think it shows him in his heyday, and I would vouch for that one to come back instead of this newer picture. Is there any sort of voting that goes on or official way I could express this?

Thanks a lot,

Romeowth (talk) 16:37, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

I agree. The old picture captured him in his prime. That’s how I want to remember George Michael. Kylemanzo (talk) 23:05, 15 August 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 May 2023
George Michael achieved 12 number-one songs on the UK Singles Chart(five with Wham!) and 10 number-one songs on the US Billboard Hot 100(two with Wham!) 109.242.72.147 (talk) 20:48, 15 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. M.Bitton (talk) 21:03, 15 May 2023 (UTC)

TL DR

 * https://web.archive.org/web/20180310093712/https://www.gminfopage.com/gmv/bare.htm
 * .... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 06:52, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

Hair
Bleached, straightened, permed:
 * File:Wham! circa 1984-1985.jpg
 * .... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 01:35, 10 July 2023 (UTC)