Talk:Gerald Ford/Archive 1

Vandalism to the file?
It would appear that some vandalism has been done on the Ford file. Forms of the vulgarism "wank" occur in several places and in a manner that suggests something deliberate and not a simple typo. Ron G./Lamar, Texas.

Pictures
For pics go to http://www.ford.utexas.edu/avproj/media-photo-kit.asp --LuisLJ403 05:53, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

someone please change the picture with the five presidents so it says reagan in the title not reagen.

Remember Ford prematurely liberating Eastern Europe and the famous New York Daily News headline ''Ford to City - Drop Dead"?

Umm Hello?
No mention of 1980 Veep consideration. What's up with that? --WinOne4TheGipper 22:21, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Gerald Ford and George Bush Sr. are 7th Cousins
For my fellow genealogy buffs. President Gerald Rudolph Ford and George Herbert Walker Bush "Sr." are 7th cousins. Their common ancestors are Hendrick “Henry” Vanderburgh b.1685/86 and Maria Magdalena Knight. Their families resided in the Dutchess County, New York area. Lori Brill McKee lbrill@kdsi.net


 * Please provide link/source. Thanks 198.151.12.8 16:25, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

November 11, 2006
This article says Gerald Ford is the second oldest President. Is anyone sure of this?? We can't know whether he will be the oldest or the second oldest until an upcoming day in U.S. history. Do you know what this day is?? (Check to make sure it is correct.) 66.245.80.45 17:09, 18 Sep 2004 (UTC)


 * Yes. Ford is the second-longest lived president, surpassing both John Adams and Herbert Hoover. Reagan lived 120 days after turning 93. If Ford lives until November 12, 2006, he'll become the longest-lived president. However, there have been speculations about his health, because he's in quite frail health and doesn't travel extensively. -- SNIyer12 20:05, 28 May 2005 (UTC)


 * Ford might pass Reagan as the longest lived president (if he stay alive), however he'll probably won't pass John N.Garner as the longest lived vice president, Garner came within 15 days of his 99th birthday. 24 October 2005


 * The day Ford would have to be alive then is June 30, 2012. Georgia guy 15:54, 29 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Article says "On November 11, 2006, Ford will become the longest-lived President of all time." Of course, Ford might DIE before that date.

Milk
Having added a source for the bit about Gerald Ford promising to milk people's cows if elected - and isn't that technically a bribe? - I will forever lament that I didn't write, in the edit summary, "Added source attesting to Gerald Ford's milk production" - Ashley Pomeroy 13:28, 28 Nov 2004 (UTC)


 * Don't think you can be arrested for promising to milk cows ; ). Funnyhat 23:33, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Thought
Is Gerald Ford the shortest-serving President who did not actually die in office? -Litefantastic 03:50, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Yes. -- SNIyer12 20:03, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

You forgot Poland
No mention of the Poland thing?


 * It's mentioned in the 1976 election bid section: "Additionally, Ford made a major gaffe during the second presidential election debate when he insisted that Eastern Europe was not dominated by the Soviet Union. Carter replied that he would like to see Ford convince Czech-Americans and Polish-Americans that their countries did not live under Soviet domination." There are further details on the U.S. presidential election, 1976 article. --NormanEinstein 18:53, Jun 25, 2005 (UTC)

Adoption
The early life section says that Ford was not formally adopted and then says that he was one of two presidents who were adopted. Could someone (who is better at writing) please fix that. CDA 18:12, 7 August 2005 (UTC)

Trivia question
Decry or confirm: does Ford have the shortest standing term in office for a President who didn't die in office? -Litefantastic 23:25, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

and I have a VP trivia for you: the longest served Vice-President of the USA are, Daniel Tompkins, Thomas Marshall, Richard Nixon, George H.W.Bush and Albert A.Gore. Almost made it: John Adams (his term began April 21st not March 4th, though that argumentive) George Clinton (died late in second term), John C.Calhoun (resigned late in second term), John N.Garner (thanks to 20th Amendment. First term was not quite 4 years- Mar.4 ,1933-Jan.20 ,1937). 25 October 2005 Is it true that Gerald Ford is 95?
 * Yes, Ford is correct. The second shortest is Millard Fillmore.

Scholarship
Scholarship is not in the eye of the beholder. The article Scholarly method explains how scholarship works. Wiki has rules that the standards of a discipline must apply and in this case that's history. History has very wellestablished procedures for telling scholarly books, and hundreds of journals that review these books. Rjensen
 * Please stop this edit war. Both you and Markles have violated the 3RR today, and could be reported and blocked.  --JW1805 (Talk) 21:36, 20 January 2006 (UTC)
 * OK. Sorry to be such a pain. &mdash;Mark Adler (markles)  21:38, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Removed edit
I removed  from right the 1976 header that a concerned newly minted editor had put there. I explained things on the editors talk page.-- Dakota ~   °  01:54, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Vice Presidency
"Ford said little, his position compromised by his position." Huh? We also seem to jump from him being VP to acting President without actually mentioning it. Most bizarre. --kingboyk 15:01, 25 March 2006 (UTC)


 * That's been fixed. Jtmichcock 15:11, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Looks like you were working on it at the same time as I commented. I didn't fix it myself, since I came to the page as an uninformed reader :) --kingboyk 11:20, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

i dont think there is anyhting wrong with this page at all.

Only president never elected president or VP?
Wasn't washington also never elected?69.9.28.147 01:18, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
 * No, he was elected. By white men with property, but elected nonetheless.  Jtmichcock 01:20, 1 May 2006 (UTC)


 * Quite the contrary - Washington was the only person ever unanimously elected by the electoral college. Raul654 03:52, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

The big problem with this is how it's worded: Ford is the only person in American History never to be elected to the position of President or Vice President

Ford is NOT the only person in American History never to be elected to those positions. After all, I was never elected to those positions either. Perhaps this should be "Ford is the only person in American History never to be elected to the position of President or Vice President, despite serving in both offices" or similar language.

Fair use images
Is it really neccessary to use as many fair use images on this page? I counted 6 and most of them didn't include fair use rationales. I hope someone can fix this before this page goes live on the main page. Pepsidrinka 04:33, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
 * There are rationales posted for each of the photos used. A few are federal government production, some have a historic photo tag and during the extensive peer review and FAC there were no questions raised.  Jtmichcock 09:35, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, the fact of the matter is, failure for someone to mention something on a peer review or a FAC does not entitle this article to have images that have copyright issues. There are images on this article that are fair use and do not have fair use rationales. Let me list them for you:
 * Image:H51-2b.jpg - it has two fair use templates yet no specific rationale for use in this article.
 * Image:Vietnamescape.jpg - I'm not quite sure how fair use can even be invoked on this picture. Nonetheless, there still is no rationale for using on this article.
 * Image:A2092-3A.jpg - Image has a PD template and a fair use template. Please fix this.
 * Image:Frommeassassinationattempt.jpg - Fair use template with no specific rationale.
 * Image:Repub8a.jpg - Fair use template with no specific rationale.
 * Image:Carterford.jpg - Fair use template with no specific rationale.


 * From WP:FAIR
 * Remember there is no "general rule" about fair use, each fair use must be explained and a rationale must be established for that specific use (in other words every page that uses the image will have a distinct rationale for using the image on that page even though fair use is claimed on the image page).
 * Please fix these issues. Thanks. Pepsidrinka 21:13, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

I have vetted these items past an attorney (me) and find that they meet the fair use rationale set forth in Kelly v. Arriba Soft Corporation, 280 F.3d 934 (9th Cir. 2002). Images can have more than one fair use rationale. Macmillan Co. v. King, 223 F. 862 (D.C. Mass 1914). Each of the photos involved accompanies textual materials that discusses the materials described qualifying these for protection under 17 USC § 107. If you would like to edit in rationales within the images themselves in order to tie them into the textual contact, you are free to do so. Beyond that, I'm not certain what you intend to accomplish. Jtmichcock 22:13, 3 May 2006 (UTC)


 * That is perfectly fine that they are all legit uses on this page. But for the average user (me), it isn't obvious just by looking at the image page. I was, and am still trying to accomplish the ambiguity that revolves around the image uses on this page. If you could be so kind and edit the image pages and add that bit of info that pertains to each image, it would be perfect. As far as Wikipedia guidlelines goes, which I quoted above, each image should have a specific rationale for each article it appears on. This is what I'm trying to accomplish. Pepsidrinka 22:44, 3 May 2006 (UTC)


 * I have added a source, where the image did not have one already, as well as a fair use rationale for each of the images listed above. Thanks! Flcelloguy (A note? ) 23:32, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Posting Personal Information Into Edit Summary

 * Alkivar phone number vandal uses Sympatico, everyone contact 1-877-877-2426, [abuse@sympatico.ca]
 * Algee12 00:47, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Uh, how did you determine his provider out of curiosity? No offense, but it seems kind of suspicious that a user with 3 edits appears and announces the way to report the vandal. Cowman109Talk 00:49, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
 * peaze? S.morton 01:15, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

See Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents... this id may well be accurate. HOWEVER I don't think here is the place to discuss it, nor should EVERYONE call up Sympatico by any means. Hope that helps.  + + Lar: t/c 01:39, 6 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Well everyone calling Sympatico should make them notice... ;) --Rory096 09:04, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Dynasty Apperance
While I'm not fan of the show I do remember that Gerald Ford made a guest apperance Dynasty (1981 TV series) in one episode but there is no mention of this in the article. The Fading Light 01:33, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Gum
What? Nothing about Johnson's claim that Ford couldn't walk and chew gum at the same time?!! It's what defined his presidency. 81.107.34.65 01:41, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Pet boxer?
The photo caption for the young Ford under the Early Life section says that he is pictured with his pet Boxer, but the dog in the image appears to be a Boston Terrier. Any sources on the Boxer statement? -- Tyler 04:43, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

The descriptor is from the library and museum website. I'm looking at Boxer (dog) and the one dog pictured in front looks just like the one in this article. Jtmichcock 09:41, 6 May 2006 (UTC)


 * The two breeds do look quite similar. The page from which the picture came claims it is a boston terrier. PrometheusX303 14:27, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Lead Sentence
I believe that the lead should be just that--the lead. That Ford was VP is important, but not so important that it should be mentioned before mentioning his presidency. Look at other articles. Nixon, LBJ, George H.W. Bush--none of these mention in the lead sentence the fact that the man was VP.

In Ford's case his vice-presidency was unique, having been the first appointed to the position under the terms of the 25th Amendment. That, however, is still not as significant as the fact that he did serve as President. Unschool 05:57, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Whoever added the vice-presidency to the lead sentence this time at least did not list it before the presidency, as it had been three months ago. Nonetheless, I wish to state more clearly that the lead sentence should tell us the single-most important thing about this person, which in Ford's case is the fact that he was a US president. Is his Vice-presidency notable? Of course--in fact, more than most, for reasons listed later in the same paragraph. But if we are going to include his VPship in the lead sentence, then why not also include all of his other notable positions? Why not write:


 * "Gerald Rudolph Ford, Jr. (born 14 July 1913) was the 38th (1974–1977) President of the United States and the 40th (1973–1974) Vice President and the 67th Minority Leader in the House of Representatives (1965-1973) and the 18th Representative from the 5th District of Michigan (1949-1973) and the 2nd chairman of the G7 (1976) and the 28th starting center for the Michigan Wolverines (1932-1933)"?

I mean, these all have their place in the article. But not in the lead sentence. Unschool 01:06, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Nice Job
Nice work on this article. I had remembered Ford as ineffectual and intellectually weak president in the usual republican mold. Looking back, that seems a little unfair. With the democratic majority in congress, there may have been little more he could do besides going around promoting WIN buttons..

In any case, he seems to have earned broad and sincere respect from both parties. Undoubtedly quite a decent fellow.. A lot's been said here about President Ford's age. But whatever age he eventually reaches (I wish him long life), it's clear he belongs to another era.

--Philopedia 22:41, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Betty Ford's name
Betty Ford's full maiden name was Elizabeth Ann Bloomer, and Warren was added after her later divorced marriage to William G. Warren, so I have a right to change the info in the President cell. If there's any question, please discuss it here. --65.73.0.137

Her name was simply Bloomer. To state that her "name" was Warren falls into the same trap as stating that her name was "Ford" and so your logic doesn't hold. If she was not Betty "Ford" then equally she was not Betty Warren. She was Betty Bloomer. --User:wjhonson
 * Hmm, in checking a few other presidents infoboxes, see LBJ, Nixon, Ike, it looks like the wife's name is listed as First OnePreviousLastName MarriedLastName. I'd leave it as Betty Ford, as that is what she is commonly known as.  In her article the info about names/marriages is covered.  Plus, I'm thinking the whole what is a woman's correct name discussion is more appropriate for article titles, not in-article references.  2c  -- MrDolomite | Talk 17:51, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Actually, according to contemporary newspaper articles re their marriage, she was Elizabeth Bloomer Warren; she apparently had not resumed her maiden name upon her divorce (though if she did, somebody please cite it). In any case (if you want some trivia to go with your morning coffee), as per standards of the day, upon her divorce, she would have been formally known as Mrs. Bloomer Warren post-divorce, which was long standard ID for a divorced woman in the United States, ie combining her maiden and former married surnames (without hyphen). Also, the Gerald R. Ford Museum & Library website identifies a photographer of her at her wedding rehearsal dinner as "Betty Bloomer Warren" Mowens35 17:13, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Any reason for "Current" tag?
Is there any reason the tag is still on this article? I'm not seeing any coverage of current events here. ---DrLeebot 12:46, 16 August 2006 (UTC)
 * He went in the hospital last night, as noted in the article. wikipediatrix 12:49, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Funeral plans
Before the trivia section there is the following unsourced statement: "Ford, the oldest of the living ex-presidents, has requested a state funeral and plans to be buried at his Presidential Library honoring him in his former hometown of Grand Rapids, Michigan called the Gerald R. Ford Library"

However, the Ford library is in Ann Arbor; the Ford Museum is in Grand Rapids so something is wrong here. Does anyone know what's correct? Does anyone have a citation ? 71.71.126.86 13:56, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

According to the New York Post... "Both Ford and the elder Bush have said they want to be buried at their presidential libraries — Bush in College Station, Texas, and Ford in Grand Rapids, Mich." The GRF Library is definitely in Ann Arbor, so the New York Post article got it wrong. Unfortunately, incorrect news travels as fast as correct news, so other articles also have the same incorrect story. I've been to the libary. It's a small place on the campus of U of M and is primarily for researchers. The museum is much bigger, much more oriented towards the general public, so my guess is that is where he plans to be buried. Guessing is not a valid way to write an article, so until someone can find a better source, I have trimmed this section. User101010 22:09, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Trivia: Ford, an only child ?
Ford has younger paternal half-siblings (the Kings) & younger maternal half-siblings (the Fords). He should be listed as the only US President to have no full siblings. GoodDay 20:05, 30 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Two words- Bill Clinton. No full siblings there either.
 * Yes, that's correct. It should be Ford & Clinton. GoodDay 14:52, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Also there are 19th and 18 Century Presidents who may not have had full sibling either.

Military Service
I fleshed out Ford's military service based on material posted on the U.S. Naval Historical Center web site. I also checked the sources used in that FAQ and spoke to the author, Ms. Kathy Lloyd, Chief of the Navy Operational Archives. The text is all public domain. Johnfmh 13:32, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

Pardon of Nixon
was fords pardon of nixon to early? or should it not have happened at all? 64.8.188.133 18:23, 14 September 2006 (UTC)


 * The question is irrelevant. Wikipedia is about collecting and dissemination information about things that are, and things that have happened…notn about things that should have happened. I'm sure there's a political or historical message board somewhere where you can discuss your question.--RattBoy 22:20, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Disenchantment
Hello everyone. It seems there is only one tiny paragraph about Fordy's two earth-shattering falls. SO, I suggest the article be expanded with an obstensive section for Ford's fall-down-ed-ness and also maybe add this line to the opening paragraphs: ".....as well as being the United State's most clumsy and most wanted to be assasinated president." I think the benefits of theses changes are obvious. Cheers! -- I don't know how to make the signature0 <Time-date][code- —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.51.176.208 (talk • contribs) 23:36, 20 September 2006
 * Just add four tildes at the end of your "contribution," such as it is.--RattBoy 10:07, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Warren Commission
Arlen Specter was also on the Warren Commission —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.52.129.58 (talk • contribs) 01:44, 23 October 2006
 * No, he wasn't. According to the Warren Commission article, Specter "worked as a staff attorney for the commission." Ford is the last surviving member of the Commission.--RattBoy 10:10, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

The business about Ford "moving the wound" in Kennedy's back is a conspiracy factoid, and is sourced to an unreliable conspiracy web site.

Ford did suggest the change in wording. But he had not seen (and none of the Commissioners had seen) the photos of Kennedy's back which put the wound at C7-T1 (which is quite properly described as "at the base of the neck"). All he had seen was a drawing by a Naval Corpsman that did put the wound in the neck. In reality, the wound "at the base of the neck" was quite consistent with the Single Bullet theory. 134.48.30.18 18:44, 27 December 2006 (UTC)John McAdams

Longest-lived President
I duplicated the statement that Ford was the longest lived president, by placing a copy of the sentence in the first paragraph into the trivia. I did that because I came here looking for that item, and checked trivia first since I did not think it worthy of mention anywhere else. I have seen this duplication in a number of Wiki articles. Nwbeeson 13:32, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

My Excel shows that Reagan lived 34088 days. On 11/11/2006, Ford has also lived 34088 days. I don't know how to determine the time of birth of the two ex-prezzes; nor do I know the time of Reagan's death. For FWIW, I think it's appropriate to say that he will break the record on Nov. 12.--RattBoy 15:36, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Perhaps more accurately, he surpassed Reagan during November 11. Hey, this day is even more special -Today is Remembrance Day, Ford's a WWII veteran. GoodDay 16:33, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Does anyone know how good/bad his health is? Will Ford be the first POTUS to reach 100? PMA 18:18, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm guessing not... - Minkus 05:07, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
 * No, he will not. It should mention, though, that he was the longest living president in the article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.149.236.86 (talk) 05:18, 27 December 2006 (UTC).

Reagan lived 93y,3m,11days, Ford lived 93y,5m,13d; so Ford is the longest lived however you measure it.Sumoeagle179 17:17, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

^^^Reagan lived from 2-6-11 - 6-5-04, more like 93y, 3m, 29 days. Sir Rhosis 01:15, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Early Life
Can someone please verify if the quote box containing "I'm a Ford, not a Lincoln. —Gerald R. Ford, December 1973[6]" is overlaping the text, I'm looking at it in Firefox and it appears so. 65.8.142.34 20:30, 9 December 2006 (UTC) Paul

I guess not right...:(
 * It does not overlap. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Brian25 (talk • contribs) 18:20, 27 December 2006 (UTC).

Verification on death
Just my opinion but..it's almost a little to new to find good sources on his death. It was confirmed like..10 minutes ago, so. I think we should give it a little more time before we put up the "verification needed" signs. Just saying, because I can't really find anything..maybe someone else can. Oreo

Death
Here's an article (the only complete one I could find) about Ford's death--someone should add a link to it in the "Death" section. http://cbs4.com/topstories/topstories_story_227195601.html

Gah, see! I'm horrible at finding things..good job. Oreo

- http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/O/OBIT_FORD?SITE=WDUN&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT Should Help. Make sure to include. "My family joins me in sharing the difficult news that Gerald Ford, our beloved husband, father, grandfather and great grandfather has passed away at 93 years of age," Mrs. Ford said in a brief statement issued from her husband's office in Rancho Mirage. "His life was filled with love of God, his family and his country." --Luislj403 05:19, 27 December 2006 (UTC) -

STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT - http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/12/20061227.html

Laura and I are greatly saddened by the passing of former President Gerald R. Ford.

President Ford was a great American who gave many years of dedicated service to our country. On August 9, 1974, after a long career in the House of Representatives and service as Vice President, he assumed the Presidency in an hour of national turmoil and division. With his quiet integrity, common sense, and kind instincts, President Ford helped heal our land and restore public confidence in the Presidency.

The American people will always admire Gerald Ford's devotion to duty, his personal character, and the honorable conduct of his administration. We mourn the loss of such a leader, and our 38th President will always have a special place in our Nation's memory. On behalf of all Americans, Laura and I offer our deepest sympathies to Betty Ford and all of President Ford's family. Our thoughts and prayers will be with them in the hours and days ahead. --Luislj403 05:24, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

-

In The Media
FoxNews has been broadcasting live ever since the news broke, without commercial breaks. ABC, CBS, and NBC cut off for late night shows. MSNBC and CNN did??? anyone know? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Luislj403 (talk • contribs) 08:11, 27 December 2006 (UTC).

Please do use the tildes. %c2%a1 %c2%bf %7e%7e%7e%7e
< http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Gerald_Ford&diff=96680482&oldid=96658992 >:

It's just past 21:00, here in Coachella Valley.

So, I guess that it had been prior to 18:00?

Thank You.

&#91;&#91; hopiakuta &#124; &#91;&#91; &#91;&#91;%c2%a1]] &#91;&#91;%c2%bf]] &#91;&#91; %7e%7e%7e%7e ]] -]] 05:15, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

38th to be born, 38th to serve, 38th to die
should this also be noted under the "Trivia" section, as he has now passed away?Nitrous231 05:16, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
 * If the factoid can be referenced using reliable sources, then yes, it can. -Fsotrain09 05:20, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
 * yeah... it can't be referenced because it's wrong information =/ I got Nixon and Reagan confused, but I don't know how.Nitrous231 05:23, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Lol. Go and check some internet sources. BTW, will there be a state funeral for Ford? I haven't heard of anything yet atm. Ter e nce Ong 05:26, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Newsmax.com states that all presidents except Clinton have filed a wish for a state funeral with the Washington Military District. -- Charlene  05:34, 27 December 2006 (UTC)