Talk:Germans in the United Kingdom

Merge to Western European migration to Britain
'German Briton' is a neologism rarely used outside Wikipedia and does ot cover all the people discussed (e.g. Handel was not 'British', he just lived there). In addition, this page is short and mostly unsourced, and can easily be merged to the above page. Cop 663 (talk) 19:12, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Karl Marx?
He may have been from Germany, but he was not part of the German people aka ethnic Germans - he was Ashkenazi Jewish. Saimdusan Talk|Contribs 05:38, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
 * who are jewish Germans —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.164.249.193 (talk) 16:45, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

To exclude individuals from certain ethnic or religous background from a specific natonality is clearly contrary to common sense and also contrary to the legal systems of the majority of countries in the world, not least all European Union members, and the United Nations. Therefore I would recommend to remove any reference of the above comment. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.148.122.204 (talk) 18:01, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

There are no THE ethnic Germans, stupid! Most of them are Germanic, the rest has a Slavic background. Get your facts straight. Anyone with German citizenship DOES BELONG to the German people. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.202.110.27 (talk) 10:13, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Saxons
Why is there no section dealing with the fact that a majority of British people are descended from Germans, the Saxons, who migrated here following the collapse of the Roman Empire and who's name - accompanied by the reference to the Angles - is normally used to refer to the English?

I am suggesting the creation of an additional history section detailing the Anglo-Saxon colonisation of Britain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by NeroAxis (talk • contribs) 23:41, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

Well, I think that the Anglo-Saxons were Germans and since the British have anti-German sentiment since the war, they play down the importance of the Anglo-Saxons (genetically, culturally, etc.) on the English population. Seems like the English are descended from Basques now. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.159.108.31 (talk) 10:34, 1 April 2011 (UTC)

Anyone who downgrades Anglo-Saxon influence on England and our genetics is a fool, English people are a very Germanic people descended from all things Germanic, The vikings danes Angles, Saxons, jutes, Normans all are Germanic and from a common background.86.144.115.174 (talk) 15:46, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

The Royal family part is a bit inaccurate
"Every subsequent British monarch until Edward VII in the Twentieth century would take a German spouse." Slightly True, but Edward VII did marry a German. His wife, Alexandra of Denmark, was from the Danish Royal family, the Danish Royal Family like the British Royal family are predominantly German descent. Queen Alexandra was from House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg. So Edward VII did marry a German. His son, King George V, also married a German descendant, Mary of Teck, from the House of Württemberg. It was until Edward VII's grandsons, King Edward VIII and King George VI, who married non-Germans. Edward VIII married an American while George VI married a British woman. The current Queen Elizabeth is too married to a German descendant, Prince Philip is from the House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg. So the statement in this article, "Even today, the Royal family is sometimes parodied as being 'German' even though the family's German blood is now much diluted" is not accurate since the British royal family is still predominantly German, and the blood is slightly diluted, not much diluted. 99.179.174.131 (talk) 03:33, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

German Jews
Most of these great contributors to British life from Germany were in fact Jews, who fit into a different ethnic group entirely from ethnic Germans. For example, many of the Jews who came to the United Kingdom from Germany were forced out of Germany due to the fact they were not ethnically German, and therefore it is absurd to say that they represent an ethnic group that they were deliberately excluded from for thousands of years. I suggest removing most of the 'prominent Germans' from that section, including Marx, Freud, Reuters etc, and moving them to their rightful place as 'British Jews'. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.7.25.244 (talk) 12:47, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

No refutation has been made, therefore I am removing all of those of Jewish or other non-German heritage from this section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.7.25.244 (talk) 16:15, 26 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I think you'll find that there are far more reliable sources describing Marx as German than as British. Cordless Larry (talk) 16:22, 26 February 2011 (UTC)

Marx was born in Germany, and lived there, France, and also in Britain, where he eventually died. In terms of nationality he could have held all three; this is a disputed fact and not relevant to the discussion. In terms of ethnicity, however, Marx was an Ashkenazi Jew not an Ethnic German and therefore does not belong in this section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.7.25.244 (talk) 17:47, 2 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Marx is regarded as German by reliable sources. Nothing in the article states that it refers only to ethnic Germans. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:05, 7 March 2011 (UTC)

The article is by necessity about ethnic Germans. Let us say, firstly, that being a German has two dimensions: one related to being an ethnic German, and the second holding German citizenship. Should a German citizen of Ethnic German descent relinquish his citizenship and move to the United Kingdom, he would still be a British German, considering he held the ancestral connection. Should a non-German citizen of German relinquish his German citizenship and move to the United Kingdom, he would be cutting his only formal tie to Germany, and therefore his right to call himself a German. This would therefore lead to the favouring of his current ethnic identity over his former national citizenship. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.7.25.244 (talk) 19:02, 8 March 2011 (UTC)
 * This has nothing to do with someone's "right to call himself a German". Reliable sources call Marx German and that's what we go by. Cordless Larry (talk) 19:09, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

As I have just demonstrated, your point not only contradicts the facts of the situation, but the logic too. If these much vaunted sources are 'reliable' they will also list that Marx's ethnic identity was Ashkenazi Jewish, not Ethnic German, and that he relinquished his German citizenship and lived in France and the United Kingdom, too. I do not need to restate the case as it has already been made, but I suggest that you list your sources that identify Marx's primary ethnic identity as a German, and not a Jew. Otherwise, the article requires alteration. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.7.25.244 (talk) 21:41, 8 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I suggest that you take this up at Talk:Karl Marx since the article on him states that he was German. If you want sources, there are a stack of them here. His ethnicity has nothing to do with it. He was a German who migrated to the UK, which is what the article is about.Cordless Larry (talk) 21:48, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

I will take it up with them, but the point is you are taking a simplified view of the situation that is not consistent with the facts. I do not know how to state it any more clearly. The burden is on you to show me, in clear terms, how he was a German. He was not a German in an ethnic sense considering he had no German blood; he was not a German in a national sense either, considering that for the majority of his life he lived outside of Germany and did not hold German citizenship. Those are the two components of being a German and he had neither of them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.7.25.244 (talk) 22:56, 9 March 2011 (UTC)
 * in Germany the idea that a German jew is not German is viewed as Nazi ideology 15:38, 21 February 2012 (UTC)15:38, 21 February 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.5.184.243 (talk)

A German Jew is like a German Catholic, ethnically German. Seamusalba (talk) 12:19, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

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