Talk:Germany–Italy football rivalry

Notability of the rivalry?
While this article is being worked on, I just wanted to point out that WP:NRIVALRY requires the rivalry itself to meet WP:GNG guidelines. Specifically, I don't think it's enough to say these teams have played against each other in previous World Cups, etc., or even that some of the matches were themselves notable. I think there needs to be reliable sources that there's an actual, notable rivalry between the teams. I'm neither a Germany nor an Italy fan, so there may be something that I'm not aware of, but I haven't come across anything to suggest that there is a notable rivalry between the two teams. Singularity42 (talk) 03:35, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm neither a Germany nor an Italy fan, same here. I will improve the page slowly, let's see what happens. --Hydao (talk) 03:57, 29 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Is there any reliable source that says there is a notable rivalry between these two teams (other than just the fact that they have played against each other in notable matches) - that is, something similar to references 2 to 5 Yankees–Red Sox rivalry? If there aren't any, then this really should be discussed at AfD. Singularity42 (talk) 04:19, 30 June 2012 (UTC)


 * There is. But it's a different type of rivalry. It's something between France–Italy football rivalry and Germany–Netherlands football rivalry. If you want feel free to nominate it for deletion. I just created the page yesterday, time is needed. There are plenty of sources in Italian or German. Not so many in English language though... It seems that other "random" editors added stuff, but well, it's a work in progress. --Hydao (talk) 04:49, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

--Hydao (talk) 05:11, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
 * http://forzaitalianfootball.com/2012/06/italy-v-germany-the-never-ending-story/
 * http://sportsun.org/2012/football/euro-2012-match-preview-germany-v-italy-another-chapter-of-an-epic-story/
 * http://mediacenter.dw.de/english/pictures/item/554959/Germany_vs_Italy_a_historic_rivalry/
 * http://www.i4u.com/2012/06/sugar-ray-robinson/rivalry-germany-renew-euro-italy

It is a rivalry. We Germans feel a deep sense of inferiority toward the Italians and try to beat them in football. Unfortunately the matches against Italy are always losses in competitive matches. 3-4 in the 1970 WC final, 1-3 in the 1982 WC final, 0-2 in the 2006 WC semifinal, and again 1-2 in the 2012 EC semifinal. Fortunately my cousin just had a baby and we are hoping that his great-great-great grandchildren will finally be able to see Germany triumph over Italy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.51.216.7 (talk) 15:44, 18 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Your English sounds rather maccheronic than krauty, brother. Your sense of humor as well. Would you have the article edited on trust? Greetings from Motherland :-) --82.57.6.174 (talk) 15:28, 15 May 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, you Germans finally overcame Italy on July 2nd, 2016 :) Congrats, hope you can advance more and more. 171.255.76.176 (talk) 12:05, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Comparison of Germany and Italy in major international tournaments
Can anyone explain this chart? I'm a big sports and soccer (football) fan, and I can't make heads or tails of it. If I can't figure it out, then maybe it needs a legend or explanation, or maybe the information needs to be presented in a different format. Thank you. Holy (talk) 14:05, 2 July 2016 (UTC)

Basically it shows the positions each team finished in at a Euro or World Cup tournament. FTQ means fail to qualify and DNP means did not participate. Maybe this should be shown in a legend. Vaselineeeeeeee★★★ 14:07, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I added a little legend at the bottom of the table. Vaselineeeeeeee★★★ 14:10, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Thank you for explaining and for the work. I figured it out eventually. I had already understood the acronyms. The really confusing part is that the finishing ranks are the numbers displayed in the columns, but nothing says that that's what they are. Even more confusing is the "9–16" and similar notation, showing (I now understand) that the team finished in that range of places in that tournament (when the tournament did not declare or determine finishing places among teams that fail to advance, or those that lose in the round of 16, or those that lose in the quarterfinals, etc.). There should be something at the top (a new row, perhaps?) that indicates that. Even better, the "9–16" could be changed to a clear statement, like, "lost in Round of 16" or "Failed to advance to final 8," or whatever is appropriate for that particular tournament. I would be happy to make the edits myself, but I don't want to insert an awkward standard when I myself took a while to understand the meaning. Holy (talk) 19:35, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Hi again. I removed that tag as it seems to be the convention on other rivalry pages such as England–Germany football rivalry. I'm not suggesting that it is the right or wrong way, but if you would like to reach a consensus maybe ask it at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football. Thanks. Vaselineeeeeeee★★★ 23:03, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
 * OK, I see that. Thanks. Holy (talk) 04:33, 3 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi again. I've changed it to reflect the actual positions. I think it makes it clearer now. Vaselineeeeeeee★★★ 00:18, 8 July 2016 (UTC)
 * That looks great! For even more clarity, for the section title, how about "Comparison of Germany's and Italy's results in major international tournaments" or "Comparison of their results in major international tournaments" or "Comparison of results in major international tournaments"? Holy (talk) 01:01, 8 July 2016 (UTC)
 * How about "Comparison of Germany and Italy POSITIONS in major international tournaments"? Because the table is really about positions. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 01:03, 8 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Even better! Then there's the nitpicky choice of "their positions," "Germany's and Italy's positions," or just "positions" by itself. Holy (talk) 01:25, 8 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I think positions should be fine enough; we don't want to make it too long or confusing. I'll change it now. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 01:30, 8 July 2016 (UTC)
 * That looks good. I just made a minor edit for style and readability. Holy (talk) 15:47, 8 July 2016 (UTC)

Last match
I think that, from a merely statistical point of view, it should be considered as a draw, and counted in the general overview like that, with a note signalling Germany advancement on penalties. Fab8405 (talk) 22:59, 2 July 2016 (UTC)


 * It is. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 23:02, 2 July 2016 (UTC)

You're right, I didn't read the overall statistics, where it is rightfully counted. My bad, sorry. Fab8405 (talk) 23:10, 2 July 2016 (UTC)

That also means that Germany has no win/victory or whatever in a comeptitive match. It might sound theoretical, and fans won't care about it, but Germany did not win the match but only the shootout. --SamWinchester000 (talk) 06:10, 18 July 2017 (UTC)

Additional suggestions
I would like you to add the Olympic 3rd place match between Germany and Italy in Seoul because the 1988 Olympics were already one national team competition at the professional level, even though the Olympics cannot be compared with the World Cup (and Euro) it's still worth mentioning. So, let's add it; please. Football is very great (talk) 17:43, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Hi. This is about the senior Italy national football team, not the Italy Olympic football team. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 19:18, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Yes but football at the 1988 Summer Olympics was really the national team competition at the professional level, not club or U23 or amatuer level.

Football is very great (talk) 04:34, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Even if the squads of both Germany and Italy were not the strongest, they were still not U23s or amateurs. Olympic is a big tournament again, I think I should list this event. Football is very great (talk) 04:41, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
 * The 1988 Olympics was a tournament for the national team, although at that time its status was no longer like the World Cup, but the Olympic teams at that time were for the national team level. Football is very great (talk) 04:50, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Olympic 1988 is a tournament for professional players, Olympic is only for amateur players from 1936 to 1984, U23 is from 1992 to present. 1988 was tournaments for the professional national team ;) Football is very great (talk) 05:21, 10 July 2021 (UTC)


 * I object to this, the Olympics is not an official FIFA tournament. FM and AM radio (talk) 15:48, 6 September 2021 (UTC)

Mistake
On pages related to football rivalry there is no emphasis on championships by highlighting them in the table comparing the performance of the two teams in the major tournaments. 171.255.73.15 (talk) 12:47, 18 September 2021 (UTC)
 * I mean the rivalry between the two teams is not only about winning the tournament, look at other rival sites, just write who is better in the table comparing the performance of the two teams in the major tournaments, like on other pages, the bolding to emphasize the details of the results is only for people to see which team is the winner of the direct confrontation when we list in the table of the direct confrontation results between the two teams, please fix it.

115.76.61.40 (talk) 14:06, 18 September 2021 (UTC)
 * I agree with you, we have to improve this. Jimmylink (talk) 18:33, 18 September 2021 (UTC)
 * The comparison of the two teams' head-to-head record should also be paralleled with the two teams' achievements in major tournaments, but it's not just about the number of tournament championships the two teams have, because it's okay not to win the tournament. 171.255.78.170 (talk) 04:54, 19 September 2021 (UTC)

UEFA Euro 2016
In the overall section that needs to be added, Germany overcame Italy after the penalty shootout. Friendly member (talk) 09:18, 18 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Re-added. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 20:58, 18 October 2021 (UTC)