Talk:Gigha/GA1

GA Review
The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.''


 * Starting GA review.Pyrotec (talk) 22:23, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your attention. Initial replies below. Ben   Mac  Dui  14:40, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

GA review
This article has the makings of a good GA. It is readable and wide ranging. However, there are a few minor problems that need resolving first.
 * The Info box which is non-compliant in respect of WP:Verify. Lumping together a few references at the bottom does not constitute in-line citations / verification.

Goodness – we’ve got about a ten GAs and no-one has ever queried this before – it may stand out as there are usually only 3 or 4. If you know the sources well it is pretty clear which are used for which.
 * The Ordnance Survey is the reference for the OS co-ordinates and highest point.
 * Mac an Tailleir’s work concerns Gaelic place names
 * The Orkneyinga Saga specifies Norse place names– see also WikiProject Scottish Islands/Orkneyinga Saga.
 * General Register Office for Scotland is a census analysis and specifies the population in 2001.
 * Haswell-Smith provides a second map and specifies everything else including ranking tables (with updates and modifications at WikiProject Scottish Islands/Populated Islands and WikiProject Scottish Islands/Islands by area)
 * We don’t usually use Keay in the infobox at all unless H-Smith forgot to include something. I’ll check on this later.

It would be a bit of clutter to have a ref-marker for H-Smith for six or seven entries, although I can do that if you want.

You may not think it is relevant but I note that WP:UK geo’s FAs such as Altrincham, Bath, Birchington-on-Sea don’t have any references at all in the infobox!


 * Note 4 does not provide a citation for anything in particular.
 * See Orkneyinga saga above.

Hmm – I don’t have Grimble and this source states "Donald McNeil descendant of John Og acquired Colonsay and Oronsay from the Duke of Argyll in 1700 in exchange for Crerar. This line then went onto buy the lands of Gigha in 1780 that had been repurchased by Hector of the Taynish line from Campbell of Cawdor in the late 16th century.” I fear you are right - I’ll do some more checking.
 * Grimble, p45 does not state precisely whether the offer was accepted, but I don't believe that Note 25 is an accurate interpretation of what Grimble says - it appears to be diametrically the opposite of what is implied.
 * The web link in Note 29 does not link to the cited article.
 * Fixed


 * Note 35, provides confirmation about a number of awards, it does not provide a citation for the statement of ownership; and the whole sentence could, uncharitably, be challenged as advertising (WP:SPAM), the words used to describe this venture and the creation of red-link article link are possibly unfortunate.
 * True enough, and fixed.

These are (possibly) "technical errors" in the article, however the article as a whole is of GA standard. I'm therefore putting the review On Hold so that these points can be addressed.

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria


 * 1) Is it reasonably well written?
 * A. Prose quality:
 * B. MoS compliance:
 * 1) Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
 * A. References to sources:
 * B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:
 * C. No original research:
 * 1) Is it broad in its coverage?
 * A. Major aspects:
 * B. Focused:
 * 1) Is it neutral?
 * Fair representation without bias:
 * 1) Is it stable?
 * No edit wars, etc:
 * 1) Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
 * A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
 * B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass or Fail:
 * 1) Is it stable?
 * No edit wars, etc:
 * 1) Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
 * A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:
 * B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass or Fail:
 * B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass or Fail:
 * Pass or Fail:

Pyrotec (talk) 00:11, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Responses
Thanks for your replies above. These are "storms in tea cups", but: See below for example of how it might look. I don't know why the OS and population not coming out right. I'm not getting the Hebden logic - if it only has one reference surely it is even less compliant than the current Gigha one? Ben  Mac  Dui  09:37, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) I'm not used to seeing Info boxes with a line of references at the bottom, it looks non-complaint to me. I'm suggesting that the references that are already in this Info box be made in-line citations like the Info box in this article - Hebden, North Yorkshire - it only has one in-line citation and that is for Population. Is it possible to do this without undue effort? P.S. I did the GA review on Prehistoric Orkney for you last September, but it does not have an Info box.


 * Tweaked per your suggestion plus using an "unless otherwise stated" reference at the bottom. I don't think it matters that several of them have multiple references. This also eliminates the Orkneyinga Saga issue - I don't have a copy I'm sorry to say. I clearly must get one if this problem is not to be repeated. Ben  Mac  Dui  13:20, 30 January 2009 (UTC)


 * 1) I have a different copy of the Orkneyinga Saga, I have the Pálsson and Edwards (1981) Penguin classic version which is based on the 1978 Hogarth Press edition. Sorry, but quoting a book without a page number (or in this case a chapter number / Genealogy / Glossary) does not provide an adequate WP:Verify of anything, especially if its not linked to anything in particular (apart from the Info box). From a process of elimination I could work out that in was not intended to verify the OS coordinates and/or the 2001 population and/or the Local Authority; but I am still unsure what it is being quoted. The names Gigha, Guðey and Gjáey do not appear in the Pálsson and Edwards version. Re-looking at your reply and the link to WikiProject Scottish Islands/Orkneyinga Saga, it appears to be an unstated use of the maps in the Joseph Anderson's edition that is being referenced (if it is, then specifically say so). The Pálsson and Edwards  edition has only three maps: Orkney and Caithness, The Faroes - West Norway - British Isles, and Shetland; and the "GB" map is too small to name Gigha. Do you really think that this "uncertainty" is compliant with WP:Verify?
 * Not at all - see above. Ben   Mac  Dui  13:21, 30 January 2009 (UTC)


 * 1) What I think is the relevant quote in Grimble (P. 45) states: "' The astonishment of Angus of Islay may be imagined, and also his sense of relief when Campbell of Cawdor castle, a junior cousin of the Earl of Argyll, made friendly overtures to him. Campbell offered to purchase some lands in the isle of Gigha, which lies between Islay and the Mull of Kintyre. No doubt this helped to defray the expenses when Angus was commanded to travel to Edinburgh with Lachlan of Duart in 1591, to face the King. One of them had escaped from trial on the gravest of capital charges, yet both were imprisoned on their arrival as though their crimes were equal. They were released only upon finding security."
 * Apologies - the pre-existing text was clearly in error. This has now been fixed.

Pyrotec (talk) 20:52, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) I'm happy to sign off the other two points - a broken link and (possibly) over-enthusiasm.

✅. Thanks, I'm awarding GA. Congratulations on having produced a Good Article.Pyrotec (talk) 17:44, 30 January 2009 (UTC)