Talk:Gratitude

Copyright violation
I did a major revert of this article because I believe copyrighted text was inserted by Jtsang on 20:28, October 18, 2005. A very large amount of text was added in a single edit and it was completely unlinked (when a person actually writes content on Wikipedia, they tend to do at least some linking). Also, no additions at all were made in subsequent edits. The only changes were some small deletions. I noyt been unable to find an online source for the content, however, I still strongly feel that this has been copied from somewhere. If anyone disagrees, feel free to revert my revert. -- Kjkolb 10:12, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Buddhism connection
The idea, flowing from this article, that Buddhist gratitude is cold and intellectual, is not supported by the Pali canon.
 * Anguttaranikaya 1.3.115
 * "Tinnam, bhikkhave, patubhavo dullabho lokasmim. Katamesam tinnam? Tathagatassa, bhikkhave, arahato samma- sambuddhassa patubhavo dullabho lokasmim; Tathagatappaveditassa Dhamma-vinayassa deseta puggalo dullabho lokasmim;Katannu katavedi puggalo dullabho lokasmim. Imesam kho, bhikkhave tinnam patubhavo dullabho lokasmim ti".
 * Oh meditators, three things are rare to find in the world. What three? A Tathagata, an arahant, a fully enlightened one; A person able to teach the Dhamma proclaimed by the Tathagata; And a person who acknowledges the benefits received, with gratitude; These three occur but rarely in the world.
 * Dukapuggala-pannatti: pg. 42.
 * Katame dve puggala dullabha lokasmim — Yo ca pubbakari, Yo ca katannu katavedi.
 * Which two persons are rare in this world? First, the one who serves others selflessly (without expecting anything in return). And second, the one who is grateful towards anyone who does one a kindness.

And finally from the Mangala Sutta Vanana
 * 25. Katannuta
 * To Be Grateful Is Most Blissful
 * People must always be grateful. The Lord Buddha is always full of praise for gratitude. Persons who are always ready to help are rarely found in this world; but rarer still are those who remember and are grateful to those who have helped them. If we are grateful we are sure to be happy.
 * Without this quality, a person forgets his parents, relatives, friends, teachers and those who teach him the Dhamma. He turns his back on them just when they could be helped by him or when they are in need of aid. A selfish person seems

to try to isolate himself.
 * On the other hand, the grateful person makes for harmony and peace. He will always be remembered and loved.
 * Ajahn Chah gave a teaching wherein he said:
 * "The Buddha taught the virtues of katannu and katavedi, of knowing our debt of gratitude and trying to repay it. These two virtues are complementary."

The mere fact that the word katannuta is a Pali portmanteau, does not limit a full-bodied meaning in ancient times. I am sure that the people of 2500 years ago felt things as fully as we do today and would have feelings of gratitude as immediately as we moderns do when something wonderful is done for us. The paragraph that currently appears re Buddhist gratitude is an injustice that is rippling through the internet. – — … ° ≈ ≠ ≤ ≥ ± − × ÷ ← → · § Enkido 06:23, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I see great difference between Buddhist gratitude and Jewish/Muslim/Christian/Hindu gratitude. Gratitude in Buddhism is toward ones teachers and benefactors. Gratitude in the supernatural religions is toward one or more deities that take a personal interest and intervene in the circumstances of ones life. Wings42 (talk) 19:28, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
 * So... Buddhist gratitude is actual gratitude towards another person and the others are just self-satisfied play with imaginary friends? Nah, to the extent that Buddhist gratitude isn't cold and intellectual (i.e. Hinayana), it also includes gratitude towards a huge menagerie of bodhisattvas and supernatural beings starting with Guanyin or her male form. Likewise, humans of any religion have and express gratitude towards parents, teachers, and benefactors.


 * That said, even "an injustice rippling through the internet" would be preferable to the Abrahamic-exclusive focus of the current #Religion section. Did someone just cut the entire Buddhist section instead of adding additional viewpoints and context? That's a disservice worse than the original mildly offensive text. — Llywelyn II   05:56, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

potential resource
The economics of gratitude "Market transactions only measure a portion of the true economy. Here are ways to extend our resources without additional spending." by Diane Lim Rogers, Csmonitor.com November 24, 2011 99.181.141.143 (talk) 02:43, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Gratitude & the Bible
There are many Bible verses on gratitude. Perhaps the most significant is 1 Thessalonians 5:18. Captain Dunsel (talk) 19:07, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

On a related issue (hence why this is part of the discussion page), there should be a way to thank users for having gone beyond the call of duty to preserve a page. Initial idea:

removed link
I removed " Encyclopedia of Gratitude. A reference book and free website with hundreds of things to be grateful for, from New York Times bestselling author Erich Origen." As the site referred to is now only selling the printed Encyclopedia. Vernon White '''. . . Talk''' 19:09, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

Removed section from article, may be WP:OR, needs sourcing and cleanup
Removed the following section, as written, from the article. It was added here, by this editor. (Note: another editor had already removed some of the more obviously non-neutral statements here.) It appears to be WP:OR, and the given 3 references (one of which is a blog) do not support the info preceding them. The original paragraph has been divided into three sections, based on the given references (i.e. text first, then the ref given to support the preceding info).

Heading : "Necessity for, and the benefits of teaching gratitude to elementary-aged students"

Text :

Part I: "Today's modern world overwhelms children with constant simulations, pressures, stressors, deadlines and technology, actively reducing productivity, learning capability and social competence. Students' academic and personal well-beings are directly associated with the learning environments that they are in, and the situations in which they are placed. Research purports this connection; that a lack of competency in expressing and accepting gratitude is correlated with poor academic, personal and social health, as those students told to focus on the hassles of their daily lives instead of the positives had low satisfaction with their school experiences and high levels of negative self- affect and well-being.
 * REF: Poelker, K.E. & Kuebli, J.E. (2014). Does the Thought Count? Gratitude Understanding in Elementay School Students. The Journal of Genetic Psychology, 175:5, 431-448. doi: 10.1080/0221325.2014.941321. Retrieved from https://www-tandfonline-com.ezproxy .library.ubc.ca/doi/pdf/10.1080/00221325.2014.941321?needAccess=true

Part II: "One effective approach is "appreciative journaling", a technique which requires students to sit down and write or list five to ten things or people in their lives that they are appreciative of or grateful for, negative perspectives are not permitted during this writing period. This exercise actively serves to place students in positive mindsets, leading to improved academic performance and social-emotional health. Studies supports the efficiency of this approach, as appreciative journalling has been positively linked to sustained growth in student social-emotional well-being, optimism, school experience life satisfaction, and less physical complaints and negative emotions.
 * REF: Griffith, O.M. (2014, November 17). Gratitude: A Powerful Tool for Your Classroom. Edutopia: George Lucas Educational Foundation. Retrieved from https://www.edutopia.org/blog/ gratitude-powerful-tool-for-classroom-owen-griffith

Part III: "That teaching students gratitude skills is imperative to their social-emotional and academic well-being is evident in it being a key component of British Columbia's "Personal and Social" core competency that guides educators' teaching approaches and techniques"
 * REF: British Columbia Ministry of Education. (2017). Core Competencies. Retrieved from https://curriculum.gov.bc.ca/competencies#personal-social

Problems
 * The heading is too long, and needs to be re-written neutrally. Suggested: "Benefits of teaching gratitude to students"
 * The reference for Part I is a proxy link, which should have tripped the proxy filter when it was first added. However, the link was broken by placing a space inside the link (probably accidental). Here is the pubmed link for the article (Poelker et al., 2014).
 * + This reference does not support anything in the paragraph preceding it. The study was about whether school-aged children were able to comprehend the concept of gratitude, when presented with a scenario involving gift-giving. (The study involved two groups of children whose median ages were 7 and 10.)
 * + This whole section may be original research; the given reference actually states (p. 431) that not much research has been done--and little info is known--regarding gratitude in (school-aged and younger) children. And yet seemingly authoritative (but unsourced) statements regarding children/students are made throughout the entire section.
 * + Some of the info in the paper's intro/background section is related to info covered in Part II, but it mentions research regarding adults, not elementary-aged children, see next point.


 * The reference for Part II is a blog, and talks about using journalling to increase gratitude. The preceding ref (Poelker et al., 2014) refers to journalling, but only regarding research done on adults and adolescents, not elementary-aged children (p. 432: last para.). So whoever wrote this (Part II: "Studies supports [sic] the efficiency of this approach, as appreciative journalling...") extrapolated the research done on adults and older children--to much younger children, about whom little info is known. This is also original research.
 * + Note: the reason this matters is that gratitude is considered a "complex emotion" (p.432, 1st para.). Young children are not thought to be able to fully comprehend it, as adults might; rather, there is a gradual increase in awareness as they grow older (p. 432: end of para 1; para 2).
 * + A similar study in adolescents was mentioned (p. 443: 2nd para.), but the authors make it clear that there is a distinction between school-aged children, vs. adolescents and adults (p. 441: last line). The referenced study, Froh et al., (2008) used subjects from grade 6 and 7, so the children were about 12-13 years old. This is the age around which children have a much more sophisticated understanding of gratitude (Poelker et al., p. 433: para 4.). But this section could possibly be rewritten to cover adolescents; the heading is currently written to be about "elementary-aged" children.


 * The reference for Part III does not contain the info alleged therein; it is not on the linked webpage, nor in the linked PDF. Also, the text is not neutral and needs to be reworded--if a source can be found. Otherwise, Part III should probably be removed.
 * + Forgot to add - the section, as written, is original research and synthesis, and needs to be improved. Something along the lines of "Teaching students gratitude skills is a key component..." (Except, of course, that this appears to not be the case, as per above--so, a ref for this statement is also needed.)

Cheers, Big universe (talk) 03:56, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The prose needs to be cleaned up. Grammar, phrasing, odd use of terms, punctuation, etc.
 * Bottom line, as written, this section shouldn't be included in the article as is. It looks like the info and assertions contained in the section have not even been proven, and certainly not to the extent that it could be included in WP. It appears to largely be original research, and probably WP:SYNTH--but with proper references, the info could possibly be re-worked to address either older, more mature students, or adults (for which there is more info available).

Inclusivity
I wonder if any other editors have considered gender bias within this article. How many women are cited in this general article? Would be great to be more inclusive. There are number of women in philosophy and media that might be included. Krista Tippett comes to mind.
 * a) Remember to sign your posts.


 * b) If their research is notable and helpful for the article to cover its points, then include them. If reliable sources show their research is uncertain but provides noticeably different coverage on gratitude from males in the field, include that controversy. Otherwise, it's women in toto who need coverage, not female researchers who need to be cited more on Wikipedia just cuz.


 * c) There are HUGE WP:BIAS issues with the current article but they're mostly about how focused it is on Abrahamic religions and questionably reproducable "research" performed on American coeds and/or as an excuse to use grant money to eat out more often. At minimum, the "Religious" section needs to cover Buddhism. (Although maybe better than the article used to: See above.) It should also cover Roman vota and similar quid-pro-quo concepts across most pagan religions. (Based on the Tenakh, early Judaism could probably even be folded into that.) The rest needs to cover other modern cultures including (at bare minimum) India and China. (The concept of filial piety is misunderstood using religious language in English but is understood by the Chinese themselves as growing out of yawning gulf of gratitude towards parents whose gifts the child can never fully reciprocate.) If female scholars have handled those points well, yeah, absolutely add them. When you do so, though, they'll appreciate it more if you've done it because you really think they handled the subject masterfully rather than because people might feel awkward that there aren't enough gendered names in the bibliography. — Llywelyn II   05:02, 13 January 2024 (UTC)


 * d) Oh, also—unrelated to your comment but still connected with inclusivity—while we want to be inclusive of migrants' and immigrants' experiences, we shouldn't be headlining the article with a specific viewpoint whose main focus seems to be getting upper-class Western researchers to tell migrant parents to shut up and let their kids do whatever they feel like with the (usually) better life they've been given. It also appears to ignore the crushing feelings some migrants can have when they do feel nothing but gratitude but then don't feel they've succeeded enough to have deserved their parents' sacrifices.


 * To the extent that research is subjective or limited, it shouldn't be in the article at all. To the extent it is based on objective research with solid and confirmed findings, it should be in the empirical research section. Leaving it at the top where it had been gives waaay too much wp:undue focus for this universal human topic, though. (If this gratitude/indebtedness distinction is universal and does need to lead the article, show that by including more general coverage. At least some migrant research outside North America would be a necessity, as should more general discussion of cultural concepts of gratitude/indebtedness across more classes and more of the world.) — Llywelyn II   05:17, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

Antonia
I would like to recognize Antonia she’s a social worker for Amedisys 863-680-3531. she goes above and beyond for all her patients. she is 100% kind. 2603:9000:B508:24D2:9003:9042:80BA:8813 (talk) 09:29, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

Youre Welcome
I think that the box at the top should say: “You’re Welcome” redirects here. For other uses, see You're Welcome (disambiguation). Anonymous8245 (talk) 20:12, 22 May 2024 (UTC)