Talk:Great Lakes region/Archive 1

U.S Region
This article is really about US region. This should be main plain in the article, rather than including Ontario. This would parallel the division between the Great Plains and Prairie Provinces further west. Kevlar67 18:07, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I have to agree. A term like "Canadian Great Lakes" makes about as much sense as "American San Francisco Bay." Both areas only have relevance in one province/state.  As such, the Great Lakes should be identified as a region in the Ontario article, if anywhere.--129.89.207.24 16:48, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Living in Michigan, I have to come to the conclusion that Ontario should be included in this page. We depend on Ontario and Ontario depends on us, and both of us depend on the Great Lakes. We have to look at this from a diffrent point of view, although the United States thinks they own the lakes, lets not froget about our friendly neighbors. Cgord (talk) 23:00, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Count me definitively on the side of including Ontario. Not only geographically, economically, and culturally, but even politically Ontario and the American side are a coherent unit. GreatLakesdemocracy (talk) 19:03, 21 April 2008 (UTC) The 2008 ratification of The Great Lakes Commission finally commits American and Canadian governments to the geographical definition of the North American Great Lakes as a distinctive political entity. In fact and operation, the complex cooperative management of The Great Lakes for purposes of trade, border discipline, parks, transportation, hydro-power, water management and environmental protection has been a reality since 1815. Ethnically and economically, the borders have always been porous. Politically, the region has more bi-national commonalities than generally supposed. Much of Ontarian political culture derived from both Anglo-American heritage and the simultaneous influence and threat of American examples. More importantly, both the American and Canadian sides played analogous roles in the world-economy. Both sides of the border transformed from peripheries that supplied natural resources; to semi-peripheries that performed middle-man brokerage functions; to core regions, represented by such world cities as Chicago and Toronto, that provided hubs of capital, administration, and management. History, politics, culture, and ethnic composition, as well as the more obvious economy, technology, and geology, define Ontario and American Great Lakes states as one region.GreatLakesdemocracy (talk) 04:11, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

I would say that "Great Lakes region (North America)" should have Ontario, while an article called something like "Great Lakes states" (which is currently a redirect) or "Great Lakes states (USA)", if ever made, would be about the US geographical area. Awickert (talk) 05:48, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

Great Lakes Regional Identity

 * Regional Identity **

I added a few summary paragraphs about the Great Lakes region's most famous, and least controverial, contributions to national, continental, and global history, political economy, technology and culture.

I'd appreciate feedback on the selection of content. It's hard to judge what to include and leave out. Abraham Lincoln and the Northwest Ordinance of 1787 are easy. Frank Lloyd Wright? Oprah Winfrey? Balloon-frame house?

The Great lakes, for instance, is arguably home and host of modern-day industrial labor unions, large-scale agricultural cooperatives, mass production of steel, and contemporary versions of blues, polka, Rock'N'Roll and Motown. But other regions, even other nations, would instantly dispute the claim.

GreatLakesdemocracy (talk) 19:02, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

On reflection, I included the list of states and Ontario in the introductory paragraph, and subordinated the list of cities to below the text.

Nominations, please for contributions and native sons/daughters.

thx —Preceding unsigned comment added by GreatLakesdemocracy (talk • contribs) 20:21, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

History
I'd like to add a "History" section. Any reactions from anyone?

thx —Preceding unsigned comment added by GreatLakesdemocracy (talk • contribs) 19:55, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

History
I propose organizing a "History" section in seven parts:

1. First nations (the Canadian term for pre-European inhabitants; and a better one than "Indians" or "Pre-Columbians") 2. European colonies (France, England/Britain, and The Netherlands) 3. Anglo-Ameican hegemony 4. The American Northwest and Upper Canada 5. Civil War and The Dominion Act 6. Industrial Development 7. Global Manufacturing Center

Reactions? —Preceding unsigned comment added by GreatLakesdemocracy (talk • contribs) 05:32, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Can we capitalize Region?
Other, more commonly acknowledged, Regions are capitalized. Does anyone know, or can anyone tell me, how we might appeal to the Wikipedia powers to have The Great Lakes Region qualify for its own properly nouned name?GreatLakesdemocracy (talk) 02:39, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Illustration
Could somebody, starting with the Wikimedia Commons File:BlankMap-USA-states-Canada-provinces.svg, create a single file showing both the U.S. states and Ontario on a single map, instead of the awkward two-map system we have now? -- Orange Mike  |   Talk  18:47, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * I was thinking the same thing a while ago but never added it to the commons. How does this look ? UrbanNerd (talk) 19:52, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Excellent! -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  13:17, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Added Duluth to list of major cities
Duluth is right on lake superior. I've been to Duluth and I'm a bit surprised that Duluth wasn't on the list considering its huge importance and its size of over 80,000 people and the fact that there is a clear view of Lake Superior in the downtown area. I noticed that cities smaller than Duluth were on the list of major cities but Duluth wasn't (which offended me as I am from Minnesota). JohnnyRH (talk) 22:59, 27 August 2011 (UTC)

I don't understand why my edit keeps being reverted. Duluth is a large and important city that is RIGHT ON lake Superior. I'm starting to think that some people editing this page may have a personal bias against Minnesota. JohnnyRH (talk) 20:53, 5 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Where did you add it? If it's on the list of Population Centers, it's because Duluth isn't big enough in population. Hypertall (talk) 23:57, 30 January 2012 (UTC)

Kansas City?
Kansas City is considered a Great Lakes Population Center? Can Phoenix, Arizona or Plovdiv, Bulgaria be far behind? 70.29.14.65 (talk) 06:31, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Kansas City and St.Louis should be removed from the list immediately. UrbanNerd (talk) 04:10, 3 February 2012 (UTC)

Population Centers
If Kansas City and St. Louis are listed as Great Lakes population centers then why not New York and Philadelphia? This is a genuine question, KC and SL look pretty far from the Lakes on the map. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Red Hair Bow (talk • contribs) 00:17, 5 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Good question. There's no way KC and STL should be considered "Great Lakes" population centers. I'm taking them off the list. Terence7 (talk) 01:39, 5 March 2012 (UTC)

The list of cities is still ridiculous. Since when are Louisville and Cincinnati in the Great Lakes region? I suppose Pittsburgh, Ottawa, Minneapolis, etc are debatable, but none of the cities I've just mentioned are in the Great Lakes basin. Any city in a state/province bordering Great Lakes is not automatically in the Great Lakes region, this list needs cleaning up. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.121.102.136 (talk) 20:00, 14 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, the list of popluation centers in this article is rather peculiar. It appears to duplicate (prior to edits here) the list at Great Lakes Megalopolis. As that article is nearly entirely speculative, I don't really have any comment on the list there -- but what is the basis of the list in this article? older ≠ wiser 13:55, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Agreed as well. I'd also take off the Twin Cities; they're not in the part of Minnesota that's along the lakes, and are actually separated by the Mississippi, which is an entirely different basin. Pittsburgh is the Ohio River basin (the source, in fact), and should go as well. (Don't really know enough about Ottawa to comment there.) oknazevad (talk) 04:52, 23 April 2012 (UTC)


 * I am restoring the article to the August 31st rendition. The last few edits are completely uninformed, original research that tear the article apart. Every city in the drainage basin of the Great Lakes is included in the Great Lakes region. The article itself makes this pretty clear. -  Floydian  τ ¢  13:17, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
 * There were numerous cities in that restoration that are not in the least part of the Great Lakes drainage basin. That's why they were removed in the first place. oknazevad (talk) 13:43, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
 * And I promptly removed most of them. The restoration also brought back several that are certainly part of the region. -  Floydian  τ ¢  15:31, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it looks good now. I'm not sure about Ottawa, though; If it's included because its proximity to the St. Lawrence River, why isn't Montreal? While the St. Lawrence is the outflow of the Lakes to the Atlantic, it's fed by other sources (Lake Champlain comes to mind), but not all cities on the St. Lawrence are part of the Great Lakes Region. So that may take a bit of thought. But otherwise, it looks good oknazevad (talk) 18:56, 1 October 2012 (UTC)

Why is Minneapolis-St Paul, a centre of 3 million people not listed within the population centres if Minnesota is part of the region? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.129.43.20 (talk) 01:37, 29 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Because while some parts of Minnesota are in the Great Lakes basin and part of the Great Lakes region, the Twin Cities are not, as they are in the Mississippi River basin (the Mississippi is what separates Minneapolis from St. Paul, after all), and that is a separate basin from the Great Lakes basin. As noted above, not every city in a state that borders the lakes is automatically part of the Great Lakes basin/region. oknazevad (talk) 04:35, 29 January 2014 (UTC) PS, new comments to on the bottom, and please remember to sign your posts using four ~

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