Talk:Grey's Anatomy/Archive 1

Split the section: Awards into Grey's Anatomy Awards

 * Take a look at this section. It is overly long and it consists of just a list. The amount of awards that this series has earned is substantial and it will continue to earn more as the series continues. So I propose this section to be moved into another article so that the list can continue expand without violating Wikipedia's polices. - Omghgomg 09:10, 6 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree. Another article would help, since the Grey's Anatomy article is long.--Sli723 21:13, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

I decided to be bold and create List of Grey's Anatomy awards and nominations. Evil Monkey - Hello 01:02, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Series descriptions
As a non-american reader, the descriptions of both seasons one and two give a basic plot overview. However, the season three description gives hardly any info as to developments to the series, focusing more upon ABCs decisions about its timeslot. Just wondering whether anyone agrees with me that character delevopments in a series should also appear in the description? Please contact me at 25722299@sky.com Thanks

"Begin the Begin"?
Can we source that? The song is titled "Begin the Beguine". --Baylink 04:17, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Sources for "Begin the Begin" is on and . Sfufan2005 03:12, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

The correct title is "Begin The Begin" (http://www.greyswriters.com/2006/01/from_kip_koenig.html) "Begin the Beguine" is a Cole Porter song, the episode title came from the REM song.

with regard to what critics have said about the amount of time spent and the types of relations the employees have with one another in this show, it isn't so much fiction. I have worked at three different hospitals in the South Puget Sound area and the amount of drama was about equal. Hell, I still can't figure out why a particular male nurse was able to have "relations" with multiple women on the staff only to... Bottom line is; the drama I had experienced was no less than the amount on this show. It was fun!


 * It is fiction, in the sense that many (most?) of the episodes are based on Frank Vertosick's nonfiction book "When the Air Hits Your Brain", often verbatim, and in this book he criticizes TV medical dramas for exactly this reason. He recalls being so exhausted that if they had any spare time, they spent it napping, not fooling around with others.  --KH

Vote of confidence
"In 2005, ABC gave the hit show a vote of confidence by announcing that Grey's Anatomy would recieve the coveted post-Super Bowl time slot on February 5, 2006."

I removed the preceding because of WP:PEACOCK. It could be mentioned in a more NPOV way, and certainly not in the lead. --Christopherlin 04:52, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

I readded the phrase and included an article that used a very similar wording. -TAOW

Cleanup
I'd like to suggest tagging this article for a cleanup effort. Portions of the piece, particularly the character descriptions, are very poorly written. --AWF

I agree - I edited them as they existed, but I think the character descriptions and plot details could use an overhaul. Just my humble opinion (not sure how that all gets started). NickBurns 02:40, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, this needs a good cleanup. The summaries for season 1 & 2 need to be trimmed and become more concise. We should be able to do these with a paragraph or two. Not a huge list like what is there. K1Bond007 03:53, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm going to try and shape this in the next few days. My thoughts are: (1) that the character descriptions should be more concise, and any references to plot should be removed. I also think the season synopses should be moved to their own page. NickBurns 17:05, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

The character list is now on a separate page. It's a step in the right direction on the cleanup, hopefully. — ArkansasTraveler 19:54, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Arkansas Traveler, thanks. I combined your link in the same paragraph as the cast list, so cast and characters are all together.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...I'm looking at the Season 1 and Season 2 episode listings, and I think all of the plot points contained in THIS article are redundant - most are already on THAT list (in more concise form). I'm thinking they could be deleted...so I am going to be bold and delete them....Just wanted people to understand my reasoning. Thanks! NickBurns 20:41, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

UPDATE: They are deleted. If someone wants to address individual plot points, they should go to the Episodes of Grey's Anatomy link at the beginning of the season synopses. This will take you to a list of the shows by episode (with synopses). NickBurns 20:51, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

Another item that needs cleanup: "The show has been widely criticized by various groups, many of them medical, for [...] greatly exaggerating the degree to which doctors and medical professionals fraternize with one another." First: doctors are medical professionals, so I'm not sure what this means. Should it say "other medical professionals"? Second, I'm not sure "fraternize" is the intended word, because the following sentence starts out "In particular, the show was initially targeted as showing a disrespect for nurses" -- fraternizing doesn't have anything to do with disrespecting. (The show may contain too much fraternizing *and* too much disrespecting, but in that case "In particular" is the wrong linking phrase.) And finally, the footnote for those sentences ("[1]") points to a blog entry that doesn't seem to have anything to do with criticizing the show for interactions between doctors and others. That blog entry does point to previous blog entries which mention, in passing, an affair that I gather is between a doctor and a non-doctor, but the footnote reference as it stands does not support the assertion as it stands. I haven't seen the show, nor have I read the criticisms, so I don't know enough to be able to fix the sentences I'm talking about, but it's clear that there's something wrong with them as they stand.

The cast and characters section is still in need of a dire cleanup. It reads as if a semi-illiterate preteen girl wrote it to a friend over IM, (including 'lol'). There is a great character article (seperate) written by a poster above, that link should be included there and what information that is on this page should be edited/changed/trimmed down. 67.68.194.155 03:59, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Shaping up
Really like how this article has shaped up! It's looking really good (especially since synopses were moved to their own pages). And I like how the catchphrases section has been organized. NickBurns 16:20, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Forum links

 * Anyone seeking to link to forum sites needs to read and understand External links. Continued attempts to add these improper links constitute Vandalism. Erechtheus 03:17, 22 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, the whole external links area is a mess. I have removed another message board link that is impermissible, but there are several news articles, You Tube videos, and fansites that appear improper. If a link is a source for the article, it needs to be in References. A link to a particularly notable fansite or to a directory of fansites is appropriate, but it needs to be labelled as such and be the only one. Erechtheus 18:17, 22 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I have removed the majority of the external links. Articles from news syndicates such as Yahoo News, or E! Online articles belong as citations, not external links.  YouTube videos fit under the same category as fansites, and 99% of the time a YouTube video will infringe on copyright.  It's best to stick to official sites, official blogs, and external links that have their own template (i.e. Wikia, IMDb, TV.com, etc...). Jtrost (T | C | #) 18:26, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Scrubs
I eliminated a few sentences of the article that were discussing the parallels with Scrubs. These sentences seemed pretty subjective, and had a pretty clear agenda of defending Grey's Anatomy. This sections (criticisms) I think should just bring up criticisms and let people decide for themselves, not make conclusions. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Cms479 (talk • contribs) 21:02, 8 August 2006 (UTC)  Which is stupid because Grey's Anatomy is just a copying scrubs —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.128.106.235 (talk • contribs) 06:05, 16 December 2006  (UTC)


 * ??? Your statement and reasons is pretty subjective and POV. I think the sentenses she be put back. (if they haven't been already) I think the "agenda" is not in defending Grey's but in presenting both sides of the arguement. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Amyanda2000 (talk • contribs) 06:25, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

This is plainly a biased article leaning towards Scrubs (which makes no sense because I love scrubs as the comedy that it is and grey's as the drama that it is). Regardless, by saying that Grey's "Borrowed" a trait, you are insinuating with the quotations that they're stealing. Get rid of it... it's irrelevant anyway. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)

Season synopses section
Are you all with me? Anyone? Please - somebody has to fix this up, and as I haven't seen all the episodes, it might be better if it was someone else. Emily ( Funtrivia Freak ) 20:42, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Season one is good - or ok, at least. It tells about plot and stuff in season one of the show.
 * Season two - good information, and should be included somewhere, perhaps even there, but where is the synopsis we need?! Someone needs to add a synopsis.
 * Season three - I'm not sure if anything about the synopsis is known yet, but if it is, we should add it, and if not, we should at least mention that no episodes of it have aired yet, and that's why, and then add a SHORT synopsis as the season progresses.

I know it's only been a few days, but I'm posting again here, trying to bring attention to my previous post on this talk page. A synopsis is really needed here, people! Emily ( Funtrivia Freak ) 16:10, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

Emily, I added a synopsis so... It's all good. Lol

User:Mattjblythe ( User_talk:Mattjblythe ) 14:26, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

I think it's really not possible to provide an adequate synopses for Season 3, because it's still in progress, particularly with the current Isaiah situation which could change the look and feel of S3 completely. Somebody just added a lengthy episode guide for the first 6 or so episodes of Season 3, i've taken it down because there's a separate page anyway and it was messy and making the article too big. Hope it's ok BumblebeeUK 17:57, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

I thought the episode guides were good. It gave me a chance to catch up on Season 3 as I have not seem them that much. Where is the seperate page? Thanks

There's a link at the top of the section - all the episodes are thereBumblebeeUK 18:31, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Connections to other medical shows
Should a section be added on how Grey's pays tribute to other medical-type shows? The fact there is a recurring character Dr Mark Sloan (a character name also used on Diagnosis Murder) has me wondering if there are other instances on the show that I'm missing (either in character name, location name, etc) Dwp49423 00:15, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Heigl plays isobel stevens, in roswell she played isabell evans, prolly another of those things.


 * In a recent TV Guide, Krista Vernoff said that naming Sloan the same as Van Dyke's character on Diagnosis:Murder was unintentional, so I don't know if that was a "tribute". NickBurns 20:46, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Link spam
If you notice User:Smarsi has been her/his fansite to this article since March, i've removed it three times tonight and will not remove it again as i will not violate 3RR. User:MatthewFenton (talk • contribs) 20:55, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I've requested said link be blacklisted from Wikipedia. User:MatthewFenton (talk • contribs) 21:09, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Season 2
In the UK, on LIVINGtv season 2 begins with the episode "Into you like a train". Why does your's begin with "Raindrops Keep Falling On My Head"? (Part of out season 1)

Zeldamaster3 17:59, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

originally, the first season was planned to have 14 episodes(i think). but shonda or abc decided to move the episodes to the second season. Tomba 02:40, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

yeh the UK went on to show all 14 episodes, as america and most other countries kept it to 10 episodes because the other 4 episodes were leading into the non-ratings season. The American DVD of season 1 has 10 eps, but the UK one has 14 eps.

House reference
Why the random House reference in this article? Specifically, "Another NBC Universal production, "House" on Fox television, retorts his subordinate's diagnosis with a reply, "then Grey's Anatomy must have it wrong..."" It's awkwardly inserted after the somewhat more valid comparison to Scrubs. Additionally, I just watched that episode of House today, and it's not criticism at all, just one of the many snarky comments that Dr. House makes. Lastly, I don't think this article needs to reference -every- comparison and reference to other medical dramas that air on TV. However, I don't wish to get rid of it if other people think it's valid, so. Kylara21 10:41, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't clearly remember the context, but I remember hearing the comment on House, and I don't think it was a reference to the show, "Grey's Anatomy," but to the textbook, Gray's Anatomy. Maybe someone who has the episode on tape should take another look.


 * I was about to address the same issue. I rewatched the episode and it seems pretty clear to me that House was referencing the textbook, not the TV show.

Katherine Heigl - Dr. Isobel "Izzie" Stevens (Has Quit) - there is nothing mentioned about this further down the page. does anyone else think we should add something into the synopsis? (unsigned comment)
 * Um, she didn't quit. The character did quit the intern program but has since returned. NickBurns 20:46, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Episodes named after song titles
I can't find any statement that in fact all GA episodes are named after songs. Should be inserted somewhere, maybe in the list of episodes article. Subversive element 09:18, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
 * It is in the trivia section. Evil Monkey - Hello 05:06, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Your source is the Trivia section of this article? What is the ultimate source? Crunch 15:44, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

All GA epi are infact named after songs. It was stated by the writers and also in the recent first issue of the GA magazine Mclover08 18:23, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

The Title Card Picture Should Be Changed
That title card is no longer in use, and should be replaced. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.176.169.63 (talk • contribs)
 * Done, Hit your F5 key to refresh. thanks/Fenton, Matthew Lexic Dark 52278 Alpha 771 20:02, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

-Agrees

New articles made like the ones for List of Desperate Housewives characters
Start by undirect in the characters named and start new Article!--Brown Shoes22 16:52, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Patrick Dempsey - Dr. Derek Shepherd a.k.a. "McDreamy" (Neurosurgeon) is one so help add and fixup article--Brown Shoes22 16:53, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

The Fray
Is there a reason this is here? It seems irrelvant and seems more of a opinion than a objective view. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.122.4.155 (talk) 05:51, 15 December 2006 (UTC). -- Beginning the article by citing awards seems less than npov to me. -- Jesus, yes, yes I know I should register etc etc before mouthing off, but Christ, this kind of thing just makes Wikipedia, in so many ways such an admirable enterprise, seem plain foolish:

"Regardless of any similarities in the medical cases presented, one thing it does seem to share with House is the use of an underlying hook borrowed from nineteenth century authors. House of course borrows from Arthur Conan Doyle, and Grey’s Anatomy from Jane Austen, especially in offering the viewer/reader the vicarious thrill of being pursued by two very attractive yet quite different men."

Yeah, ok. And the characters also speak in prose and stuff like that. Just like people did in the nineteenth century. And there are, like, plots and stuff. And the "sharing" with House doesn't stop there; they're both television series!!! Set in, oh my God, hospitals!!

Trivia Question
Does this line come across as somewhat derogatory and inaccurate to anyone else?

"Like all popular shows, Grey’s Anatomy provides a “point of entry,” an emotional hook that inspires the viewer to engage in the story — specifically, the prospect of romance with successful men." How does this theory apply to House, Lost, Desperate Housewives... Friends...etc etc.? Trcrev 21:24, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

I would be interested to read about the cynical, focus group driven engineering that goes into the making of television programs, and how the writers ensure the advertisers will reach the audience they are paying for.

Strongly agree with comment directly above. Entry reads like an all-too-cloying fan site. Would like to hear analysis of it's popularity from a more detached point of view. 75.40.233.171 01:38, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

"The special episode got a record-high 38.1 rating."
What is a 38.1 rating? Million viewers? This is ambiguous to the non-American reader. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 211.31.89.170 (talk) 21:47, 11 January 2007 (UTC).

Tagged for cleanup
I have tagged this entire article for cleanup. I also tagged the Trivia section for possible removal or integration and the Viewers section because it needs citation. Most of the information in the Viewers section seems to be included earlier in the article as well. There is a lot of good information in this article but it suffers from including everything ever known about Grey's Anatomy, much of it written from a non-neutral Point of View, much of it without references and a lot of it repeating. It could use a good paring down, removal of non-encyclopedia material, attention to Wikipedia Neutral Point of View policies and continuation of the start of citing sources. I've done some and will continue. It would be good to have help. Crunch 15:41, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Cleaned up (a little)
The last paragraph of the Season 3 bit was kind of... yeah, I saw a lot of mistakes, and now after capitalizing a lot of things and adding spaces and everything, I think it's just kind of unneeded. It's a whole paragraph meant to explain the season, and it doesn't really fit in with the other Season... describy things. So yeah, somebody with more experience should probably check it out or something and see if I missed anything or if it's really needed. Crazyquesadilla 06:34, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Callie's surname
To speak in character-talk: Do we have anything other than Alex's joking comment in the most recent episode that Callie's changed her surname? If not, I think we should hold off for now. Sean Hayford O&#39;Leary 02:55, 2 February 2007 (UTC)


 * George character at the end of the episode made reference to Callie's full name and omitted "O'Malley." Safe to leave it off? Sean Hayford O&#39;Leary 03:01, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

In the episode aired Thursday March 22, 2007 when assigning rounds Dr. Bailey says to Izzie you are with the O'Malleys (plural) and nods towrds both Callie and George. This implies that Callie has infact changed her last name to O'Malley. March 25, 2007 8:35pm
 * I would say that "implies" is a bit of a stretch. People have referred to her as Callie O'Malley since they first got married--it's cute and joking and all fine and good, but Callie's medical license is under "Torres".  That is the name under which she can legally practice medicine, and she CAN change it, but it's a long and arduous process to do so.  Apart from Bailey's reference and the other characters' joking, there is no indication that Callie has chosen to change her last name.  I would also argue that there is precedent for married women to maintain their maiden names--Bailey and Addison  (who hyphenated her name and reverted to her maiden name upon her divorce).  Furthermore, even in "My Favorite Mistake", Callie's lab coat still reads "Calliope Torres M.D.", not "O-Malley", which could support that she has not in fact taken George's last name. DarkandTwisty29 03:55, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Callie's middle name
Three reasonable possibilities: I think we have to take the ABC reference as definitive, though, until/unless they issue a correction. Emurphy42 06:28, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
 * ABC's episode guide gives the spelling as "Iphegenia".
 * It's undoubtedly taken from the Greek mythological figure Iphigeneia.
 * The article on Iphigeneia gives the alternate spelling "Iphigenia", and uses it here and there. Per Google, this spelling is an order of magnitude more common than either of the others.

Multiracial cast vs. Seattle demographics
I appreciate the range of enthnic/racial groups in the show, but conflicts with the setting. The largest non-white racial group in Seattle is the Asian-American community (~17% of the population), and there are fewer African-Americans than most large cities (less than 10%) - the exact opposite of what you'd expect from watching the show.

The one thing that is shown correctly is that there is comparitively little racial tension in Seattle, and lots of intermarriage. 67.183.15.166 07:00, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

It must be remembered that with a handful of people you will expect large deviations from what might be naively expected as a fraction of population. For example, in this room right now, a 100% of the people (i.e. me) are all of the same sex (I hope!) Nobody would question that in a room of one person, the population as a whole should be relfected. In the show, there are a handful of major characters, and with such a small population, large variations are the norm. In fact, it'd be freakish if it did conform exactly to the wider scale average. If it is true that 10% of seattle are black, for example, then the three black characters (The Chief, The Nazi and Doctor Bloke) do not represent an unusual deviation from the norm. Murkee 19:10, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

Catchphrases cleanup?
I think the whole article still needs a good bit of cleanup, but the catchphrases section really hurts my eyes. Is there a point to listing every single "Mc" reference made in the show. I mean, a lot of them are made in jest of the Mc-labeling trend--for example, Callie's "McFricken Code of Silence about the adulterous McSex I witnessed" or Cristina's latest rant about dealing with Meredith's "McLovelife". If we keep adding each tiny "McSomething" to this list, it's just going to grow ridiculously long. Wait, it's already there.

I think people can get the idea behind "McLabeling" without the virtual cornucopia of examples provided here--I mean, seriously, do we need "McYeah?". What about:

"A trend began of "McLabeling" characters or other terms. Cristina started the trend by dubbing Derek Shepherd "McDreamy", and Mark Sloan was later deemed "McSteamy".  Finn Dandridge was called "McVet", while Derek's sister Nancy was christened "McBitchy".  The characters frequently mock their own tendency to Mc-Label, as evidenced by George's "McVomit" and Callie's "McFricken Code of Silence"."

Wouldn't something like that be sufficient to illustrate the instances of Mc-labeling without being overkill? Just a thought--what do others think?DarkandTwisty29 21:57, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Just my two cents worth: Could the "Mc"s be their own article?? Whereizben 21:20, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

I think the paragraph proposed above gives an adequate reference to "McLabeling" and that if a need is felt to have a list containing every single reference from the show a separate article should be made.67.68.194.155 03:51, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Grey's Anatomy Wiki
I hope I don't come off intrusive and rude, but I'd like to invite the editors here to help greysanatomy to grow. This is a Wikia purposely created for the show and all its inherent components, and unlike at Wikipedia, there are no limits to the amount of detail you want to add. 217.129.172.31 15:21, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Jumped the Shark
The show has become a piece of crap. By using magic spirits to bring the main character back to life after an extended period of DEATH it has revealed itself to be the shitty little soap opera we all knew it would become. I stated as much and cited http://www.jumptheshark.com/g/greysanatomy.htm but had my edit revised. Could someone find a NPOV way to say it's crap for me? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.64.2.160 (talk) 23 February 2007

Whether a show is crap or not is purely personal bias, so I am afraid you will not find any way to have this be expressed as NPOV for it my friend. Whereizben 21:47, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

I think that magical spirits talking a main character to come back to life is certainly a Jumping the Shark moment, especially in a series which tries to carry itself off as a medical drama. Perhaps a comment along those lines can be included. I certainly agree that it has become crap as well, but that's hard to say in an encyclopedia.

wait... cuz the show has always been so realistic? and not a soap opera? um.. ok. I don't think that the show has jumped anything... but "Jumping the shark" doesn't refer to doing something that doesn't fit the show, it refers to doing something desperate to revive a failiing show.


 * Regardless of the etymology of the phrase "jumping the shark", the fact remains that the concept of shark-jumping is very subjective. There are some who believe the bomb episode was shark-jumping, some who thought the prom was, and some who think it's the ferry accident.  Because it is subjective, it's impossible to pin-point one moment as the shark-jump, and therefore it doesn't belong in this article.  Also, just a gentle reminder: please sign your posts. DarkandTwisty29 15:26, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

Controversies
Maybe someone should add a section to the Grey's article regarding just the controversies. The story about Heigl ending renegotiations with ABC touchstone regarding salary-- should this be added? The Chokegate incident can be added in there.

Perhaps someone should create a section on the massive disconnect with medical reality that this show has.

Infobox cast list/billing
I've noticed that the order of the cast list has been changed several times in the past few weeks, mostly moving Patrick Dempsey and/or Isaiah Washington higher in the list. I'm guessing that this has been done based on perceived importance in the cast--obviously those two names are frequently in the press and PD's "McDreamy" is a huge pop culture thing and it could be argued that PD/Ellen Pompeo and IW/Sandra Oh are the two "big" couples on the show, but that has nothing to do with the order of billing--nor is the placement of IW and PD at the bottom of the list someone's idea of belittling their roles on the show. I double-checked the order with the most recently aired episode, and based on that I switched T.R. and Justin Chambers, as well as JP, Jr. and Kate Walsh. The credits read, "with Isaiah Washington and Patrick Dempsey"--that final billing with the preposition "with" is actually a good thing, it reflects upon the actors' value to the show. I just wanted to add this explanation here so that it could be referenced in case anyone was moved around in the order again--my edit places them in the correct order, as billed. DarkandTwisty29 19:27, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
 * They should be in this order: with Dempsey second and Washington fourth because of this list found on ABC Medianet which doesn't use "with and "and."  Because they have the "with" and "and" credit it should be reflected in the article or they should be higher up in the list as can be seen at ABC Medianet. .  --thedemonhog 01:50, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * listing has traditional used the opening credits for the order of names... thats how it should be done here... -Xornok 02:04, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Using that logic (ordering them as on ABC Medianet), one could make just as strong an argument that the cast should be listed in the order of their cast bios here on the offical ABC Grey's Anatomy page. That would put James Pickens Jr. ahead of everyone except Ellen Pompeo and Patrick Dempsey.  One could also argue that they should be listed based on what they're paid, since those figures were recently reported, in which case Isaiah Washington and Katherine Heigl could well wind up on the bottom of the list.  I really think that listing them in billing order--the traditional method, as pointed out by the above response--makes the most sense.  I won't revert it yet, hopefully some other people will add their opinions, so we can establish a better consensus? DarkandTwisty29 04:23, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * My point is that the opening credits say "with" and "and." --thedemonhog 03:12, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I understand your point completely. The counterpoint I made above is that using your argument, I can make an equally valid one for a different cast order, based on the order in which they appear on the official Grey's Anatomy page.  Personally, I think the most accurate way of listing them is as billed, in the opening credits.  Yes, they do say "with-and".  They could say "featuring-and" or simply "and".  Ultimately, IW and PD are billed last in the credits, so they should be listed last here if the general consensus is to use billing order for listing the cast.  That's the great thing about these discussion pages--it allows for differences of opinion to be expressed and consensus reached.  Currently, there are three opinions on record; two of them support listing the cast, as billed in opening credits, regardless of the "with-and" structure.  Hopefully others will chime in with their thoughts or opinions.  I apologize if you felt I was undermining your argument. DarkandTwisty29 04:19, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

spinoff casting
I've held off on adding any new news on casting for the spinoff, such as Tim Daly, Paul Adelstein, Chris Lowell, Amy Brenneman, and Merrin Dungey, as I feel there is some ambiguity concerning the circumstances of their casting, and I felt it was best to discuss it here. Lowell's casting in a "coveted role" seems to indicate his attachment particularly to the spinoff series, and the phrase "with an eye to co-star" in relation to Adelstein seemed suggestive that he could star in the spinoff as well, but I'm somewhat unsure. For the others in particular, it seems as if like their casting is similar to that of Hector Elizondo, which looks to be just a guest-starring role. Thoughts? Dancter 05:56, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I added them in because it appears that all of the "guest" announcements are guest starring with potential to be starring in the spinoff should ABC pick it up. Tim Daly has what appears to be the coveted "McDreamy" role, so I see no reason for him to not be in there, even if there is question for the others. Most of these actors already have a reference to the casting fo Grey's Anatomy in their respective Wikipedia pages, so I see it only appropriate to name them here. Even if it comes to a consensus that they aren't the actual cast, they should be listed as guest stars for the backdoor pilot at least. Mrmike25 07:18, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

easter egg link
I'm not sure how to fix this but for those who do this link (when talking about the doll in the trivia section) links to easter eggs, not virtual eggs(203.23.60.6 01:23, 20 March 2007 (UTC))

New noticeboard
A new noticeboard, Fiction noticeboard, has been created. - Peregrine Fisher 18:02, 1 May 2007 (UTC)


 * This noticeboard has been deleted per Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:Fiction noticeboard. Please disregard the above post. ~ Jeff Q (talk) 11:27, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

How To Save A Life
It says this song was used first on Scrubs... I checked at it seems that Grey's Anatomy used it first. Could someone check that and edit the page?

Edit Heading is Wrong
I watch Grey's Anatomy every week and you have it wrong that it is edited by Meredith. All of the characters have narrated the storyline.

Wrong Photo
In the 4th. Season Zone, the photo is wrong. Addison isn't going to be in Seattle Grace. Beaside, Lexie, Meredith's Sister, looks likes is joing to the cast. Also, Sara Ramirez wouldn't be a regular character. Please, EDIT that n_n 201.246.197.3

International Airings
A discussion has been opened on whether to keep or remove the International Airing section of many TV programme articles.. Cheers—Illyria05 Ring•Contrib. 16:59, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Season Three Viewers
I'm just wondering where the 23.1 million viewers came from? I haven't been able to find a link anywhere that has Grey's Anatomy at number 3 and 23.1 million viewers. All the sites I found have Grey's Anatomy at number 6 and 19.5 million viewers. Other wikipedia pages seem to be using this site for citation on their viewers. I'm not saying that the 23.1 million viewers is wrong. I just want to have the citation for it.Rowena

"va-jay-jay"
Oprah saying "va-jay-jay" has nothing to do with Grey's Anatomy. It is a common saying from hip-hop and elsewhere. Sheesh.

Grey's Fires Isaiah Washington
TMZ has confirmed that Isaiah Washington has been fired from the ABC hit "Grey's Anatomy."

Washington's rep, Howard Bragman, confirmed this evening to TMZ that "Grey's" creator Shonda Rhimes called Isaiah today and told him he would not be invited back to the show next season. TV Guide's Michael Ausiello, who first broke the story, reports that the decision was due only in part to Washington's on-set troubles, and was a result of a "pattern of problematic behavior."

As for how he feels about his termination, Washington issued the following statement: "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore."

Paging a mediator, STAT!

AFAIK he has not been fired since they have chosen not to renew his contract. Technically he wasn't fired.

Music in Episode Titles
Is it true that every episode title is either the title of a song or relates to a song (not necessarily one featured in that episode)? If so, this might be interesting to include in a potential "Trivia" section.
 * This is mentioned in the beginning paragraph. Yes it is true, and yes interesting, but there does not need to be a trivia item about it.  Wikipedia generally discourages trivia sections.  See WP:TRIVIA.74.244.66.152 02:08, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

George as an intern?
We don't know yet what position George will have next year. As such I've moved him to an unknown position section. He could leave the hospital altogether, or come back as a paramedic. Evil Monkey - Hello 09:10, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


 * ABC confirmed that George would be an intern next season. Check the link: http://spoilerfix.com/grey.php  Specialk22 18:04, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Okay, now that we have a source I see no problem as listing him as an intern. I just didn't want him to be in the intern section because a Wikipedia editor was crystal ball gazing. Would be nice if the spoiler site had links to actual press releases, or are they more insider information? Evil Monkey - Hello 21:28, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Recurring Characters
It's been a few times that people have put a recurring character list on the main page. I do not think it should be there because that list could get potentially long. The cast is already large enough and adding a lenthy list of characters will take up a lot of space. There are so many recurrinng characters on Grey's Anatomy, that's why there is a separate page for characters only. Should the recurring character list be removed? Specialk22 21:25, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Is it a soap opera?
Personally I have no real feeling either way on this subject, but feel it would be better to discuss this on the talk page than through edit summaries. Plus I'm also confused as to when "this disccusion has been had before". Plus I don't consider the argument "grey's anatomy is listed as a soap opera on the soap opera page" that great -- two wrongs don't make a right. Evil Monkey - Hello 06:38, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I think it's clear I don't agree with the idea that this is a soap opera. I agree that "because it's on the soap opera page" is not a good enough reason in itself.  How about a few reasons that I think it's not:
 * It's single-camera
 * It runs in seasons
 * It's weekly, not more regularly
 * The cast doesn't doesn't change regularly
 * and finally:
 * I feel a twinge of worry that people are using the term "soap opera" to deride TV shows they don't like.
 * Just my 0.02 Docta247 06:44, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * The thing is that people can't seem to distinguish a soap from a drama, because if Grey's was considered a soap, than almost all dramas would be soaps. Specialk22 15:24, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

I think more dramas are soap operas than you imagine (not that a drama and soap opera are mutually exclusive)... The list of reasons docta gives only describe afternoon soap opera 'characteristics,' but none of those things 'define' a soap opera, especially since soap operas can be radio programs as well (how many cameras does a radio program use?).
 * Things that define soap operas are:
 * fictional episodic show
 * continuous open narrative
 * the characters and conflicts are romantic and epic, and therefore the characters are often high-mimetic like doctors and heroes

All of these things define a soap opera and Grey's Anatomy can be defined by these things. Further, I am not trying to change this to soap opera because I dislike the show. There are a few soap operas i like quite a lot. But I do think people are protesting the labeling of this show as a soap opera, because they don't like soap operas/don't know what makes a soap opera. I do apologize for continuing to change the main page so many times, I always forget there is a discussion page.Bryce32 17:35, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Your first two "definitions" are characteristic of almost every show on television! Docta247 17:54, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Bryce32 is right on those points, but Grey's Anatomy is more than just romatic relationships. Maybe its somewhat soapy for some characters, but other characters don't have heavy romantic storylines.  And as I mentionned before, you can apply all those points to any show on TV, even 24!  24 is not a soap!  Romance is a part of Grey's but not necessarily the core of it.  In soaps sotry lines are based solely on romantic relationships while on Grey's Anatomy they concentrate on relationships of all sorts.  Specialk22 17:58, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

I didn't know we were going to start yelling docta. First of all there are several shows that are not fictional (so-called 'reality television'. Second continuous open narative is where pretty much every episode ends in a cliff hanger, rarely are conflicts summed up in the same episode they are introduced.  This is the complete opposite of most shows (such as sitcoms) where conflicts are more often resolved in the same episode they are introduced.  I know this still leaves a lot of shows open for "soap opera" but i think you underestimate how many soap operas here are... degrassi, desperate housewives, weeds, etc. And you cant apply these charcteristics to any show (try applying them to seinfield).  I can't comment on 24 because i haven't seen it, although from the previews ive seen i wouldnt be surprised if it is.  But I think you're confused by my use of the word romantic.  I didnt mean love stories, I meant boroque.Bryce32 18:10, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Easy tiger, I wasn't yelling at all. If you read through my other talk page entries, you'll note I never get upset cos, hey, it's just wikipedia!  As such there's no need to throw accusations around when I was just making a point.  24 is a soap opera by your definition thus far, which is simply not the case in reality.  Docta247 18:31, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * You're basically saying that all serial dramas are soaps. So that's Heroes, House, 24, Prison Break, Bones, Criminal Minds, CSI, etc..  So anything that doesn't resolve itself in a single episode is a soap?  You're definition is WAY too broad.  If we conform to that definition, every one-hour drama is a soap. Specialk22 18:37, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Most of the shows you list SpecialK I have not seen. But House I have seen and it is not a soap opera because most of the problems are resolved within the episode they are introduced. House is a perfect example of a show that is a drama, but not a soap opera. And no, not any show that doesnt resolve itself is a soap. But, most serial dramas are soap operas, yes that is what i am saying. My definition may still be too broad for you, it does not make it incorrect. And, Docta, im glad you weren't yelling. I'm still waiting for someone to provide another definition of soap opera (since mine is apparently way off base).Bryce32 18:44, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * You're forgiven Bryce32. No definition of soap opera needs to be provided here as we're not the ones trying to classify things.  All I'm trying to say, and I think Specialk agrees, is that your definition is incredibly broad and in my opinion flawed in scope.  What you have provided catches an awful lot of television in its net.  Something worth raising is that you don't think House is a soap opera, despite romantic liasons between several characters and the fact that it has lengthy plots that span several episodes.  In fact, the state of House changes with each episode. Grey's Anatomy has a very similar pattern of lengthy storylines punctuated by the smaller, episodic stories.  Docta247 18:51, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I think that a soap opera is pretty much what you, Bryce37, defined them as except these romantic conflicts in a soap are the base of the plot. But in serial dramas, this element is a part of the show, but not its full foundation.  Not anything with a love story and an open ending makes it a soap.  Specialk22 19:28, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

But, as editors of the Grey's Anatomy page, you should want to define things and classify things. Again, I don't disagree that my definition may be broad, but I do think it is accurate and you haven't provided 'reasons' why it is flawed, you're just providing 'examples' (and poor ones in my opinion). And again, I think that there are many more soap operas on television than you understand. And, in all fairness, dramady could be applied more liberally to television shows than soap opera, same with action, sitcom, etc. So I don't think soap opera encompasses too many shows. And yes there are a few story lines in most shows that extend past single episodes, but the general narrative of most shows are resolved at the end of the episode. Rarely in any episode of a soap opera are problems introduced and resolved within the same episode. Where as most of the conflicts in House, for example, are resolved within the same episode. Further, I apparently am not defining what i mean by romantic very well because it has nothing to do with the relationships of characters. It has to do with the form of the narrative (other romantic shows include pretty much every super hero film/show, and almost every show that includes main character(s) that is high-mimetic (people that are socially understood as better than average) (for further reading on this read some aristotle or northrop frye).  So the fact that any show has a love relationship does not make it a soap opera or not. I am willing to drop this arguement if i am convinced that this isn't a soap opera, but i don't know how you are going to convince me without providing some kind of definition.Bryce32 19:49, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Okay, I think I'm done with this one. The fact remains that you don't have to be convinced of anything by us.  You want to classify, you do the convincing.  Also I've been accused of shouting, been told that my examples are poor without sufficient justification and been talked down to on the assumption that I haven't read any Aristotle.  You might consider rethinking your approach to interaction with other editors who are working in good faith.  Docta247 19:48, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

I apologize, but you didn't know what i meant by romantic after i explained it a few times, and this doesnt make me have much confidence that you had read anything that would have referred to romantic in a more classic sense. Anyway, there are plenty of points that i have made that havent been addressed, so i dont have much more to say right now. Bryce32 19:53, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I did post a definition, Bryce32! It was the same as yours except in my definition, the "romantic and epic conflict aspect" is the basis of the plot in a soap.  In dramas the "romantic and epic conflict aspect" is but one of the many themes of the show.  And like Docta247 said, if you want to make an edit, you have to convince the others that your point is valid.  And just because you haven't seen the shows that I mentionned, doesn't mean that they are bad examples! Specialk22 05:38, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Okay, i'll try again to explain what i mean by romance and epic. It has nothing to do with what happens in the show, absolutely nothing. You could make a show about cheese and make it epic and romantic. Epic and Romantic are merely describing how the plot is presented. Also, if you've ever seen an afternoon soap opera, (shows im sure we can all agree are soap operas) their plots are not always about love (not to be confused with the word romance).Bryce32 21:15, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Cast table
The cast table on the main page is currently too wide for some browsers, and won't hold any further seasons after the twelfth. I have attempted to replace it with the table from the "characters" page (below), but it keeps getting reverted by users who state the current table is "fine". Can we get a consensus on this, because the current table is *definitely* not fine.

--Unframboise (talk) 20:31, 27 April 2016 (UTC)
 * The current table is definitely fine, as it's not too wide for the page and yes, future seasons will fit perfectly on the table. Please refer to the ER page as they have 15 seasons under it's belt and the character table is totally readable and ordered. MSMRHurricane (talk) 22:16, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Franchise page
I am currently in the process of creating a franchise page, and was wondering if anyone could help add sources to it. The page is Draft:Grey's Anatomy (franchise) and would follow the same format as the Chicago (franchise) and Law & Order (franchise) pages. Totaldramaandridonculousrace (talk) 06:33, 6 April 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 21:28, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Sara Ramírez3.jpg