Talk:Grouse

Taste
But what if they indeed do taste like chicken? What's wrong with mentioning that? I am prepared to share recipies if anyone is interested. Canadacow 02:19, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * There are 20 species of grouse listed. I know that at least two of them do not taste of chicken, so the statement is not correct. Anyway, this is a bilogical article, not a cookbook. jimfbleak 04:40, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Oh well. Sorry for my vandalism.  Was just trying exercise a little bit of humor and test the self-correcting nature of the wikipedia.  I shall not do it again.  Canadacow 16:32, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * No, no, no, don't apologize. Research some on relationship with humans in general, take 2 or 3 trustworthy sources, write up some paragraphs and then do a section. I have never had any grouse, and I found the idea that some (possibly many) do not taste like chicken - though they do look a lot like chicken in habitus, and they may well be - entirely plausible; not many chickens eat spruce needles. The food aspect is not one to be underestimated; I would go as far as to say it is one of the 3 top reasons who people know about these birds who don't know Lawe's Parotia. Dysmorodrepanis 03:30, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Systematics
There has been much talk about the evolution and systematics of grouse as of recently. Perhaps someone who knows the refs could write something up. Dysmorodrepanis 03:30, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

MtDNA shows new genera
A paper on grouse seems to classify some grouse into new genera. Frankyboy5 02:05, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
 * That's an ancient one. Dysmorodrepanis (talk) 21:46, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Sexual Size Dimorphism in Grouse
Hello! I am studying this topic for a class assignment. References for my topic can be found below. Feel free to add any comments or suggestions about any of the articles.

1. Drovetski, S. V., Rohwer, S., & Mode, N. A. 2006. Role of sexual and natural selection in evolution of body size and shape: a phylogenetic study of morphological radiation in grouse. Journal Of Evolutionary Biology, 19(4), 1083-1091.

2. Isomursu, M., Rätti, O., Helle, P., & Hollmén, T. 2006. Sex and age influence intestinal parasite burden in three boreal grouse species. Journal Of Avian Biology, 37(5), 516-522.

3. Lislevand, T., Figuerola, J., & Székely, T. 2009. Evolution of sexual size dimorphism in grouse and allies (Aves: Phasianidae) in relation to mating competition, fecundity demands and resource division. Journal Of Evolutionary Biology, 22(9), 1895-1905.

4. Remeš, V., & Székely, T. 2010. Domestic chickens defy Rensch's rule: sexual size dimorphism in chicken breeds V. Remeš and T. Székely Sexual size dimorphism in chicken breeds. Journal Of Evolutionary Biology, 23(12), 2754-2759.

Aa3z4 (talk) 00:19, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

Sexual Size Dimorphism Peer Review
After reviewing your added section of sexual size dimorphism in grouse, I thought that your section was structured well. I thought you included a good amount of information that was easily understood. I thought that you also did a good job in explaining what reverse sexual dimorphism was, so that people understood what the purpose of your section was. I also added "Sexual size dimorphism manifests itself differently between grouse and other birds, particularly birds of prey. For example, in owls and kestrels, it is typically females that are larger, while males are smaller in order to be more effective at hunting and defending the young. Females are larger, as their responsibility is to feed the young with prey that the males have caught. " Leflame123 (talk) 17:19, 24 October 2015 (UTC) Leflame123

Aa3z4 response: I included the information that you added about owls and kestrels and how the sexual size dimorphism is different. I read the article and found out that in owls specifically, the female is dominant in mating and social behavior, and decided to include that information because it explains why the females are larger. Aa3z4 (talk) 09:05, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

Your section on sexual dimorphism is very informative and well written. I linked back ‘sexual dimorphism’ and the word ‘lekking’ to their corresponding main Wikipedia article. I really like how you compared grouse species to birds of prey. It helps the ready put the effects of natural selection in perspective. For editing, I deleted some phrases that sounded repetitive (Males are generally much larger than females in terms of body size.) I also fixed small grammatical errors such as the use of a colon for listed items and removing the word ‘size’ from sexual size dimorphism for the sentence defining the phenomena seen in animals.Daisuke 780 (talk) 08:13, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

Aa3z4 response: I tried to expand a little bit more about how grouse and owls vary in terms of sexual size dimorphism. Thank you for the copy edits and removing repetitive phrases. Aa3z4 (talk) 09:11, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

Aa3z4 response to professor: I moved the sentence that I previously had in the section back in and I expanded off of it. I consolidated the section that I had about hypotheses down to a couple sentences. I also changed my wording in several parts and tried to be more concise. I also found more information about lekking and connected it to how it explains the differences between grouse species in the degree of sexual dimorphism present. Aa3z4 (talk) 09:22, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

Overall, I thought the article gave a clear definition of sexual size dimorphism and how it manifests itself in grouse. One suggestion I have is maybe putting the first half of the lekking section in the feeding and habits section and, keeping the rest of the information on how lekking contributes to the dimorphism in the sexual dimorphism section. I think that by doing that it will help keep only information regarding sexual dimorphism in that section. The section on owls seems to be a bit out of place. I think that maybe, if you want to keep that section, you could more generalize the section and say that the grouse differs from other birds and that some birds have larger females as they have different mating behavior/ fecundity selection acting on them. For each of the paragraphs I added subheadings to help break up the text and the headings are: Male Size Selection, Mating Behavior Selection, and Differences in Sexual Dimorphism Seen in Other Bird Species. I based these subheadings based on the information seen in each section but, if you feel that these don’t convey what you were trying to explain feel free to change it. I hope these suggestions helped and good luck on your article work!Cbiology (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 18:06, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

Suggestions for future edits I changed a sentence structure for this sentence in order to be seen clearly: “There are two types of lekking that male grouse exihibit: exploded lekking (the territory is more expansive and has more variation) and typical lekking.” Also, I changed some sentences by removing or adding commas. One suggestion for your article would be that talking about differences in sexual dimorphism in other bird species was good, but talking only about owls was not enough for this section. I expected you would talk about another birds besides owls but you only ended up with owls. I suggest to add another species besides owls or to make general explanation of how sexual size dimorphism of grouse is different from other birds. Also, under the section of the Mating Behavior Selection, at first you say that “males and females also differ in behavior.” However, you mainly talk about the males not about the females. I suggest to add more information about the females’ behavior so that you can have enough information between the males and females. It is a good to link the term with the Wikipedia page which is good for the readers to be easy to follow your article. Also, the flow of overall information are great! Jihyek13 (talk) 05:12, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Sexual Size Dimorphism Peer Review Pt. 2
First off, good job on titling the sections for the specific topics you covered. You went into great details and the article is even more informative now! In terms of edits, I switched the orders of some sentences for better flow. I also fixed some grammatical points to avoid long winded phrases. I also took out some words that felt extra without changing the overall meaning of the sentence. “The hypothesis with the most supporting evidence for the evolution of sexual dimorphism is sexual selection.” > I think this could be worded a little better. I tried to change it a little bit but I’m not sure if it relays the information clear and simply. This is the 4th sentence in the ‘Male Size Selection’ section.Daisuke 780 (talk) 05:36, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Comments on Final Draft Changes
I made sure to include citations at the end of every sentence. I changed some wording and sentence structure to make the article more concise. I revised how I defined the different types of lekking behavior. I included exactly which differences in mating systems account for the evolution of body size in grouse. As for the section on differences in sexual dimorphism seen in other bird species, I removed the specific information about owls because that did not belong in this article and did not relate to grouse specifically. Instead, I chose to give a more general statement about how sexual dimorphism in grouse can differ from other birds. Aa3z4 (talk) 14:52, 10 December 2015 (UTC)

Species
I thought it might be helpful to add a column to this table containing images of the species' ranges. 2600:1700:5090:17B0:954E:7897:387:D34E (talk) 16:45, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Two articles in one?
This article discusses both birds called "grouse" in general as well as the taxonomic tribe known as Tetraonini. The first body section only discusses grouse; for example, it doesn't mention turkeys when discussing largest species

Edit: My bad, was not aware that there is debate on Meleagris's inclusion, makes more sense now KettleMettle (talk) 11:13, 27 July 2023 (UTC)