Talk:Haggis/Archive 1

Photographs
Come on, we must take a photograph (or several!) of a haggis to add to this page! --Kaihsu Tai 16:23, 2004 Jan 25 (UTC)

Unfortunately the picture contributed is appropriate for the Burns Supper article (where it also appears) but not for this one since the haggis takes up a very small portion of what is a very large picture. We need a more appropriate one for this article -- a smaller one which depicts a haggis rather than a man attacking a haggis. -- Derek Ross
 * I wholeheartedly agree. I put the current one here until a better one comes along! --Kaihsu Tai 13:09, 2004 Jan 26 (UTC)


 * Sorted now. Cheers. – Kaihsu 18:27, 2005 Jan 30 (UTC)


 * That's great, Kaihsu, but I take it from the timing of these edits that you only eat haggis once a year, . Cheers -- Derek Ross | Talk 01:23, 2005 Jan 31 (UTC)


 * I actually ate haggis about 5 times last year, about 4 times in Edinburgh and about 3 times for breakfast. – Kaihsu 11:34, 2005 Jan 31 (UTC)

Removed Compare lutefiskFZ

History section
I see little about the history of the haggis in this section, just a short section about a poem by Rabbie Burns.....would be good if you could expand it a little Jcuk

"Superficially resembles Scrapple"
I won't alter the article to argue with someone else's national dish, but I've had a lot of scrapple and a reasonable quantity of haggis (yes, in Scotland, not an outland recreation), and IMO they are more similar (as compared to other foods) than different.

The first time I had haggis (in a small country B&B) it immediately reminded me of scrapple, and haggis may technically be a sausage, but it is more like scrapple than any sausage I've had. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 21:09, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)


 * Interesting. I shall look out for scrapple so that I can do a "taste test" from the other direction. -- Derek Ross | Talk 19:43, 2005 Jan 24 (UTC)

Neeps
The article says that "neeps" are turnips, whereas the Robert Burns Day article, which links to haggis, says that "neeps" are rutabaga. I'm not familiar with Scottish culinary culture, but someone should correct one of these articles. (Unless the term is used interchangeably.) JD79 17:19, 25 January 2006 (UTC)


 * See rutabaga. If that article is right, what American call a "rutabaga", Scots call a "neep" or "turnip" (and the English call it a "Swede", "Swedish turnip", or "yellow turnip"). What Americans call a "turnip" is -- I think -- either called a "white turnip" or not called anything, being relatively unknown. &mdash;Bunchofgrapes (talk) 19:28, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Update. The turnip page is a little clearer, but the situation is even worse than I said before. The Scottish call the thing Americans call "turnips" "swedes", which is the same thing the English call the thing Americans call "rutabagas". My head hurts. &mdash;Bunchofgrapes (talk) 19:35, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

The turnip page is the one to believe. This page attempts to repeat what it says. -- Derek Ross | Talk 21:43, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Well then...I guess I never knew that the rutabaga was so closely related to the "American turnip". Thanks, Wikipedia! JD79 22:57, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Odd Facts and pop Culture
Spicey McHaggis the former bagpipe player for the Dropkick Murphys, quite obviously named after the food delicacy was removed, surely that is a reference to popular culture connected to haggis. If the band called Enter the Haggis which no one has heard of (and was probably added by one of the band themself) can remain, surely Spicey McHaggis as a more famous musical artist can remain.


 * Not to mention the Ren and Stimpy character, Haggis MacHaggis.


 * I was about to add Enter the Haggis, after somehow coming to the article and recalling seeing them in concert. I wouldn't say it was probably added by the band themselves, but merely by a fan. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.66.202.33 (talk) 21:52, 9 May 2007 (UTC).

Vegetarian haggis taste test
There's a comment in the current version of the article that vegetarian haggis is pleasant in taste but unlike the traditional variety. This is an oversimplification. In fact the flavour of the "traditional" haggis varies quite a lot since there are many recipes, some heavier on the liver, some heavier on the oatmeal, or with other changes. That goes for the vegetarian haggis too: the flavour tends to vary with the recipe. Surprise, surprise. The point is that there is an overlap in the flavour range and that means that some vegetarian haggis is indistinguishable in flavour from some traditional haggis, so it's not entirely true to say that all vegetarian haggis tastes unlike any traditional haggis. -- Derek Ross | Talk 15:49, 24 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Goodness me: I quite like vegetarian haggis, but I've never encountered one that tasted anything much like a meat haggis! I think there's something irreproducible about the taste of animal fats. Ming the Merciless 16:44, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

I speak from experience. The Henderson's veggie haggis fooled me completely. I did not realise that it contained no meat until I was told. Delicious! (Henderson's cafe is well worth a visit if you're in Edinburgh even for those who don't like haggis and aren't vegetarian.) -- Derek Ross | Talk 06:20, 25 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I've eaten a fair few haggis in my time, and tried a couple of vegetarian ones. Very nice, but more like stuffing than haggis. Would go well with a nice roast dinner, but that might defeat the whole vegetarian aspect... I will keep an eye out for Henderson's if I'm ever up that way, mind. Slavedriver 14:58, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

McSweens haggis (available every branch of Waitrose I come across - so i'm not sure about the "available in *some parts* of england" comment.. I can certainly get it here in Portsmouth whenever I want) comes in a meat and vegetarian variety.. I've had both, and at first taste, they're almost identical, but the aftertaste differs, and the meat one was certainly more addictive, but that said, they definitely qualify as being "similar". I've been considering converting to vegetarianism, and this is one product which makes the whole process sound less painful! Yum.

Similar dishes
Regarding dishes similar to Haggis:

Mutton 'Pancita'
In central Mexico, in the State of Hidalgo, one of its traditional dishes is “barbacoa” which is made from mutton. A “barbacoa”, although similar in name to barbeque differs from it in that it is a process of cooking consisting of making a hole in the ground, wrapping meats in maguey leaves and placing them in the hole which is then heated by embers that slowly cook the meat in its own juices. During the 19th Century, Hidalgo was an important mining centre that had a strong British influence with many Britons coming to live there, mainly in the town called Real del Monte. They left, among other things, the method of making pastries, now called “pastes” that are now the typical dish and perhaps a variation of haggis, the “pancita” or “little belly”. The innards of the mutton; lungs, liver, kidneys, spleen and such are placed inside a pouch made by the stomach lining, with a liberal sprinkling of spices including the typical chilli and cooked along with the rest of the meat. The only flavouring given to the rest of the meat is salt inferring that the “pancita” was a latter addition. Once cooked it is eaten with the flat maize bread called tortilla in Mexico, but then so is mostly everything there. Other thing the Britons left were the first football (soccer) teams.

Contributed by Rafael Maffey

What about (UK) west-country Faggots?
I realise this traditional English word has unfortunate connotations for North American readers: Faggots are large roasted meat-balls also made from minced offal - typically pigs lights (lungs), liver, heart, caul-fat etc. Lots of spices and pepper, but they have no cereals added. The result is a very dense meaty ball which is much more nutritious than sausages or beef patties. Nevertheless, I thinks it's in the same food-class as these and the excellent Haggis, i.e. offal-based preparations. I'm no expert in their preparation but occaisionally like eating 'em, accompanied by a pint of English beer - dark, tangy, frothy, unchilled, un-gassed and hand-drawn from barrel.

By Stewart Hall


 * We already have an article on them: see Faggot (food); and articles on various other kinds of faggot: see the list. -- Derek Ross | Talk 15:53, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

Criteria
What's the criteria for being similar here? It seems that some of the ones added are only vaguely related to haggis. Perhaps some could be trimmed and the good ones given a bit more detail? Munci (talk) 12:57, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Drinks
I have a couple of issues with this new section that's just been added.

1. There isn't really a drink, traditional or otherwise associated with haggis. Most haggis is bought from chip shops, day in, day out, in the form of haggis suppers without any drink at all. Even if a drink is bought with it, that drink is far more likely to be cola or Iron Brew than whisky or wine.

After purchases from chip shops, the second largest consumption of haggis is in the form of supermarket haggis at family meals. Again I would suggest that most families would have it with water or fizzy drinks. Wine is a less likely possibility and whisky is highly unlikely.

The only place where it is likely that haggis will be eaten with whisky is at a special event such as a Burns supper or a St Andrews day dinner where haggis is on the menu as a Symbol-of-Scotland. So it would be much more accurate to say that whisky (another Symbol-of-Scotland) is a traditional accompaniment at these type of events than to give the misleading impression that it's normal to drink whisky whenever you eat haggis.

2. There's an unwarranted assumption that haggis is spicy. While some haggis may well be spicy (because it may have a lot of pepper in it), there is a lot of haggis which is light on the pepper and thus isn't spicy at all. It all depends on the recipe. In my experience people who eat haggis for the first time are far more likely to say that it tastes like liver paté than to say it's like curry. And so, again in my opinion, you'd be much better served by thinking about wines to go with liver than in thinking about wines to go with chilli.

So if the new section is to remain, it should be updated to take these points into account. -- Derek Ross | Talk 19:40, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

The article states "Since fish and chip shops sell large amounts of haggis but do not serve alcohol, it can be assumed that haggis is frequently eaten in Scotland with the accompaniment of neither wine nor whisky." - The author evidently hasn't been to a Scottish fish and chip shop on a Friday night, where wine, whiskey and beer are abundant in the bellies of the establishment's inhabitants..


 * Ho, ho. You are a veritable wag, sir! -- Derek Ross | Talk 15:56, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

Tampering?
Um, can someone with more experience take out the sub-plebeian attempt at humor? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.201.158.78 (talk) 22:21, 24 January 2007 (UTC).
 * Done. But please feel free to do it yourself, next time. We always welcome helpful contributions like that. -- Derek Ross | Talk 00:07, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

I found some more tampering, in the Modern Usage and Drinks with haggis sections. It goes as folows:Remember to scottish people it taste good. Not all people may like it. This is the most important thing about haggis, it is hazedest to your health. Also, Haggis is a bitchy food. apologies if I edited this wrong, this is the first time I've made any edit to wikipedia. 75.165.0.28 (talk) 23:09, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Well done! That's exactly the right action to take when you see obvious nonsense in a Wikipedia article. Thanks! -- Derek Ross | Talk 01:53, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

No mention of Highlander?
Haggis had a prominent mention in the film Highlander (1986)

or so I married an axe murdererMbr1983 (talk) 13:34, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

History of Haggis
All the theories on this page regarding the history of haggis assume that it was invented in Scotland - although it's been a symbol of Scottishness ever since Burns's apostrophe, I'm not sure that its origins are Scottish. Does anyone have any evidence for that?

Ninj 15:00, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm re-writing the history section in view of the fact that no-one's come forward with an answer to the question above.

Ninj 16:33, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

On the BBC's [QI] program under a question on Scottish inventions, haggis was one of the booby-trapped answers, and was revealed to be of Roman origin. They didn't go into much detail though.

--MeteoriK 11:10, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Smile
Why is Image:Rabbie Haggis!.jpg this haggis smiling?

Deep-fried Pizza?
Regarding this sentence:


 * Haggis is one of several foods (e.g. pizza) that Scottish fish and chip shops serve deep fried in batter.

They really serve pizza deep-fried in batter?

rowley 17:56, 24 August 2007 (UTC)


 * You'd be amazed what can be deep-fried in batter. Oh, wait a minute. You already are, . -- Derek Ross | Talk 19:43, 24 August 2007 (UTC)


 * They do NOT sell deep fried battered pizzas in Scotland! That is a pure myth!  They just drop them straight into the hot fat without battering them first!  I haven't had one for years, but feel oddlly peckish now!212.203.97.66 (talk) 13:04, 9 February 2009 (UTC)


 * That very much depends on where in Scotland you are - I'll admit that they are most frequently sold unbattered, but for sure around the East Kilbride area, you CAN buy a battered deep-fried pizza - they call it a "pizza crunch"

79.68.15.45 (talk) 13:57, 11 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Seems to be the case that on the East Coast pizza is usually battered and fried while in Central and Western Scotland it's more likely not to be and in a lot of cases there will be a choice of either regardless of the shops location 84.64.104.126 (talk) 08:02, 21 February 2009 (UTC)


 * deep-fried mars bar 62.64.203.135 (talk) 21:30, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

the deep fried mars bars are very good, though i'm not sure what kind of batter they use, its a sweet tasting batter Mbr1983 (talk) 13:22, 24 April 2008 (UTC)


 * You should see deep fried creme eggs...-- Neo  Nerd  00:10, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Vegetarian "haggis"
Vegetarian haggis technically isn't haggis, so can someone who knows how to change the article to reflect this? Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.164.31.113 (talk) 20:25, 16 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Ummm. That's why we put the adjective "vegetarian" in front of it ... so that people will know that, technically speaking, it's not haggis, but practically speaking, it is. -- Derek Ross | Talk 21:48, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Earthworm Jim and What's It Taste Like?
I'm not sure if this is worth putting in the article anywhere, but a recurring gag in Earthworm Jim was where Peter Puppy would start eating something, say how much he loved it, ask what it is, then be informed it was some form of haggis and immediately stop eating it with a look of revulsion stating what it is. Just a random thought.

Now, on to the meat (no pun intended) of why I make this post... Does anyone have any idea what haggis tastes like or anything it could be compared to that would be accurate? I really want to try it, despite knowing what it is, but heck, I figure I may as well see if I can get a fix as to what it tastes like if possible! ~ Joseph Collins [ U | T | C ] 02:18, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Liver pate flavour; crumbly texture. If you like liver pate, you will probably like haggis. It doesn't taste as strong as pate though. Probably because of all the oatmeal in it. -- Derek Ross | Talk 03:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Oooh... That's a pretty detailed description!  I like crumbly.  Kind of iffy on meat paste, but like I said, I do wanna try it.  Thanks! ~ Joseph Collins  [ U | T | C ] 09:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

I wouldn't think of liver pate myself. I'm not sure what I would think of, mind you, but certainly haggis has spice to it which I wouldn't think of liver pate. Certainly, the best way to find out what it tastes like is to come to Scotland and actually eat it. Munci (talk) 05:27, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Sounds like I have a new life goal! Then again, I wanted to go to Scotland anyway, so...  Pretty convenient.  ~ Joseph Collins  [ U | T | C ] 09:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * It's not identical in flavour and I agree about the "spicier". However that's what I've been told by quite a few "first-timers" at the private Burns suppers which I hold/take part in every year. Mind you the flavour can vary quite a bit depending on the recipe used by the individual manufacturer so it's only possible to give a vague answer really. -- Derek Ross | Talk 15:36, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Haggis Hurl
I deleted the Haggis Hurl link. It has absolutely nothing to do with the food. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.21.176.240 (talk) 01:36, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

Photo
Can someone add a good photo of what the dish actually looks like? Maybe cut in half would be good so we can see the inside? Turning on the lights would be a help, or is this dish only served in darkness? :) ChildofMidnight (talk) 19:04, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Does anyone else think that that haggis and oatcakes picture is VILE? And whats more, that doesn't look much like haggis, and those certainly don't look like oatcakes! Anyway, you don't eat oatcakes with haggis, you eat oatcakes with stovies!212.203.97.66 (talk) 13:11, 9 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Agreed, whatever is pictured there isn't haggis and oatcakes. I can't say I'm a good Scot and eat haggis very regularly but I'll try and remember next time to take a proper picture of haggis, neeps and tatties. 84.64.104.126 (talk) 08:05, 21 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I eat oatcakes with stovies, cheese, ham, pate, hummus, jam, butter or just about anything edible that I can fit on top of them. The oatcake police haven't arrested me yet, so I would say it's probably safe for you to eat them with haggis. -- Derek Ross | Talk'' 16:04, 11 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Safe enough, but surely no-one actually does this ? I've gone ahead and replaced the photo with what's surely more recognisable as haggis, neeps and tatties. Barry Wom (talk) 11:21, 19 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Dear oh dear, those pictures are terrible. I would say delete them all apart from the top one. On a separate note, as a Chef I can confirm Haggis is really lovely - my favourite food in fact!--Tuzapicabit (talk) 23:37, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Here's one I hope is better. It was taken just after the Address to a Haggis at a Burns Supper in Minnesota. Jonathunder (talk) 22:00, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

IPA version of 'Address to a Haggis'
IS there a Scot among you able to provide an IPA version of this poem? (see here) --Surturz (talk) 06:00, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, there are Scots among us and we have considered providing an IPA version. However there's a problem with IPA. It's extremely specific. If Scots was a single dialect like Scouse that wouldn't be a problem. But it's not. In fact there are several different Scots dialects and if we were to provide an IPA version, it would have to be for just one of them. Naturally this would cause complaints from those who speak the others. What I can do however is to provide an English phonetic spelling version, as I have already done for the poem, Auld Lang Syne. I hope that that will be good enough for you. -- Derek Ross | Talk 06:19, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That would be brilliant. I've memorised the poem, but as I am not Scottish, I'm sure my pronunciation of most of it is completely incorrect. --Surturz (talk) 06:22, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Don't worry about that. You should be proud of memorising it, no matter what pronunciation you use. Of course if you want to improve your pronunciation we will do our best to help. -- Derek Ross | Talk 07:12, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually, thinking about this, wouldn't Robbie Burn's dialect (or as near as we can approximate it) be the 'correct' pronunciation? --Surturz (talk) 06:30, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

That's what I was thinking too so I plan to do a version in West Central Scots. Where should it be posted by the way? Munci (talk) 06:42, 21 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That's probably best. I have just finished a North-east Scots version but please go ahead and replace it with an Ayrshire one. You can post it here. -- Derek Ross | Talk 07:13, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

I've finished by the way. Munci (talk) 04:51, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 * FANTASTIC! Thanks heaps. --Surturz (talk) 05:00, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Similar dishes (June 2009)
There are many dishes listed here, I am not familiar with many of them but I did see tripas which is really dissimilar to haggis, it being simply grilled intestines. It's like saying pizza and lasagna are similar because they both have cheese. While delicious in it's own right, I've removed tripas from the list. --71.110.82.178 (talk) 15:47, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * In general, it seems to me that the list of similar dishes in haggis badly needs an overhaul. For instance, the list contains many items that are variants of blood sausage, not haggis at all. It would be nice if someone with the right expertise could start weeding out the inappropriate entries. --Zlerman (talk) 16:12, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

Claim that origins of haggis are English
Just to note an article in today's independent

The gist of the article is that someone refered to as "food historian Catherine Brown", claims to have found a recipe for Haggis in an recipe book by Gervase Markham that was written in 1615. She claims that the first recipe she has been able to find in Scotland was in 1747. Various Scottish butchers seem to have, seemingly without grounds, dismissed the claim. Probably worthwhile waiting for more learned opinion, but thought I would mention it now. Thehalfone (talk) 14:06, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's in the article now. What should be remembered ;
 * earliest recorded written mention is not in itself definitive proof of earliest use.
 * in all likelihood neither Scotland nor England 'invented' the dish. It's probably been around since the year dot.
 * earliest use doesn't change its status of a national dish.
 * -- Escape Orbit (Talk) 14:32, 3 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I've reverted again the change of nationality on the lead. It needs to be made clear; the earliest recorded mention does not necessarily indicate earliest use, and this mention in the English cook book makes no claim as to where haggis originated.  Changing its nationality is therefore unsubstantiated by this evidence.  -- Escape Orbit  (Talk) 16:47, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

The word 'haggeis' is mentioned in the Scots Flyting of Dunbar and Kennedie, reportedly from around 1508. Could of been written before it was printed as I've seen earlier dates online. It's over 100 years before this, so the opening of 'almost 200 years before any evidence of the dish in Scotland' is wrong.


 * "As thow wald for ane haggeis, hungry gled" (Quod Dumbar to Kennedy)

The Scots Leid dictionary already had this mentioned and also something reportedly from 1420. haggeis, haggies - a haggis. It also states "Now regarded as a traditionally Scottish dish, but also popular in England until the beginning of the 18th cent. and still made in n.Eng. with some variation of the ingredients." --Revolt (talk) 18:11, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

The recent information refers to the earliest possible recipe found which is the listed in ref [1] [2] [3] [4] [5]. Your dictionary ref does not refer to the recipe of haggis,its origin or the Country of Original origin but simply the name "Haggeis,Haggies". Johnsy88 (talk) 20:42, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
 * The recent theories are already well covered in the History section. Please stop adding them to the lead. -- Escape Orbit  (Talk) 21:40, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

== I believe with reference to your last message to my Wiki that you assume i am "Edit warring" is incorrect. I also believe that by changing the fact that the most original copy of the RECIPE of haggis( Which was first recorded in “The English Huswife” by Gervase Markham 1615) should not be mentioned in the LEAD section of the article is incorrect as this information has caused much recent controversy ( as noted in my original edits and also my orignal sources) and needs to be mentioned in the LEAD Johnsy88 (talk) 22:15, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
 * The point is that you are including this fact in a paragraph questioning the origin of the dish, leaving the clear suggestion that this is somehow evidence of its origin, which it is not. The history section handles this debate in a clearer and more even handed way.  You have also left the History section in a mess of Misplaced Capitals.  Please revert your changes and bring them to this page where they can be discussed. -- Escape Orbit  (Talk) 22:29, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

I feel that as there are no sources available to explain or shed light on the Scottish Origin of Haggis it is important to give information on the current controversy highlighted in my UNDONE original edits which did cover this and showed the topic in a far more fair and unbiased light. With refrence to this i feel that my original edits should be re instated as this does cover both sides of the argument and also the recent media controversy.Johnsy88 (talk) 22:37, 3 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Johnsy88 - the reference is from Flyting of Dunbar and Kennedie written by a Scot from around 1508. It's in print. He died in 1520, so wasn't after it. Again wiki is stating "1615 mentions haggis, 132 years prior to its first recorded mention in Scottish literature." This precise wording of 'first recorded mention in Scottish literature' is incorrect. And I agree with Escape Orbit. There is no real need to add it to the lead. --Revolt (talk) 08:44, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * This is certainly worth a mention. Can you give a good cite for it? -- Escape Orbit  (Talk) 09:20, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Silly season ! The popular press in England have gone to town on this non-story. The Gervase Markham book in 1615 gives the earliest known recipe - but the existence of the haggis in Scottish literature pre-dates it by about a century. The Oxford English Dictionary is a more reliable source than those quoted in support of the "Haggis is English" theory and I have changed the text to reflectBoulet rouge (talk) 10:25, 4 August 2009 (UTC) this.


 * The article should mention that there are several English cookery books from the 1400's that have recipes for haggis. In particular, there is an English recipe book, the 'Liber Cure Cocorum' from 1430 that has a recipe for haggis written in Middle English:
 * For hagese.
 * Þe hert of schepe, þe nere þou take,
 * Þo bowel no3t þou shalle forsake,
 * On þe turbilen made, and boyled wele,
 * Hacke alle togeder with gode persole,
 * Isop, saveray, þou schalle take þen,
 * And suet of schepe take in, I ken,
 * With powder of peper and egges gode wonne, <<53>>
 * And sethe hit wele and serve hit þenne,
 * Loke hit be saltyd for gode menne.
 * In wyntur tyme when erbs ben gode,
 * Take powder of hom I wot in dede,
 * As saveray, mynt and tyme, fulle gode,
 * Isop and sauge I wot by þe rode.
 * http://www.uni-giessen.de/gloning/tx/lcc3.htm
 * http://community.livejournal.com/favorite_words/267102.html
 * http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=haggis
 * The balance of evidence seems to suggest that haggis was first known as a dish, by that name, in England and later became popular in Scotland.
 * Jacob Davidson
 * If you can cite the 'Liber Cure Cocorum' it may be worth a mention. Of the links you show there, only the livejournal one actually mentions the "hagese", and that's just a blog. But the conclusion you reach from it appears to be unfounded. You may as well conclude that this is evidence that recipe books originated in England.  All it is evidence of is that haggis was known in England, and English writer wrote about it at the time.  -- Escape Orbit  (Talk) 20:59, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually, the entry for "haggis" at the livejournal blog site was taken from the Oxford English Dictionary. Please note that I did not say that haggis was invented in England. I said only that evidence suggests that it was in England that this particular culinary item was first known by that name.
 * Jacob Davidson —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.68.95.65 (talk) 22:20, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Haggis reference in The Simpsons
I created a new section called "In popular culture," and added this to the article, but Escape Orbit removed it, saying that it was "trivia."

I am curious to see what the consensus is on this content:

In an episode of The Simpsons titled Lisa the Beauty Queen, at the Springfield Elementary School Carnival, Groundskeeper Willie runs a booth trying to sell Haggis, and shouts, "Get your Haggis right here! Chopped heart and lungs boiled in a wee sheep's stomach! Tastes as good as it sounds!"

Grundle2600 (talk) 02:41, 26 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Adding this would be like catching up to the Simpsons and bacon article (which is no more). If we add this trivial reference to the Simpsons we just would open up the article for all kinds of trivia. So let's leave it out as it doesn't add to the understanding of the article.--The Magnificent Clean-keeper (talk) 03:23, 26 January 2010 (UTC)
 * OK. We'll keep it out. Thanks for commenting. Grundle2600 (talk) 05:28, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Indeed. Heaven forbid Wikipedia be as infomative as possible.

Intestine or Stomach or Both
Hello, The lead states: Haggis is a dish containing sheep's 'pluck' (heart, liver and lungs), minced with onion, oatmeal, suet, spices, and salt, mixed with stock, and traditionally simmered in the animal's stomach for approximately three hours. Haggis is a kind of sausage, or savoury pudding cooked in a casing of sheep's intestine,, as sausages are.

So - is it cooked in the stomach or the lining of the intestine or both?Uncle uncle uncle 22:49, 23 March 2010 (UTC)


 * Stomach (or artificial) casings are used. Not intestines which are big enough for sausage but not for haggis. -- Derek Ross | Talk'' 23:07, 23 March 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the speedy reply! Any suggestions how I can fix the sentence that states: "Haggis is a kind of sausage, or savoury pudding cooked in a casing of sheep's intestine"  Should I just remove it?  Uncle uncle uncle  23:13, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Folklore
I resent the line under the Folklore section that "According to one poll, 33% of American visitors to Scotland believe haggis to be an animal". Lagit or not, by stating only American visitors it fails to state that there is a certain percentage of visitors on the whole who think haggis to be an animal. By that it seems to take another swipe at Americans -- in my travels, I've met smart people everywhere and I've met dumb people everywhere, I've met rude people everywhere and I've met polite people everywhere ... people are people, and the lowest common denominator of humanity exists everywhere, not solely in America for the sake of people in other countries to one-up themselves. I think this line is in poor choice and I feel it is outside the charactre of Wikipedia and its guidelines for writing. ManOnPipes (talk) 16:32, 26 March 2010 (UTC)