Talk:Harper's Island/Archive 1

Replaced Cast
Shouldn't there be a mention of why the cast was all replaced, except for two? Duchess of Bathwick 23:43, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

I don't know anything about that - but I'll certainly start researching it. Thanks for the tip, Duchess. Gqpolitico (talk) 04:03, 10 April 2009 (UTC)gqpolitico

Episode Summaries
I am going to be doing my best to keep up to date on the play by play per episode. If you find an error, feel free to fix it and just let me know here so I can be sure I catch the killer too. :) I hope you guys enjoyed the synopsis. Gqpolitico (talk) 03:58, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

I did some editing of the synopsis page yesterday - there was a bad link. --Blkmagwom (talk) 05:11, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Up for grading by the Wikipedia Staff
I put in a request for our entry to be graded. Keep up the great work guys and make sure this thing looks awesome for the graders. Gqpolitico (talk) 04:02, 10 April 2009 (UTC)gqpolitico


 * If this article is going to be graded, someone needs to pay more attention to literacy, as regards the episode summaries. The one currently posted is full of grammatical and stylistic errors, and is vastly overwritten. Monkeyzpop (talk) 07:43, 10 April 2009 (UTC)


 * I feel you are completely incorrect on being vastly overwritten. We are dealing with a mystery show where details are important and I wrote it with intent that it may give some clues to help solve the mystery.  I want even those who are unable to see the show to have a chance to decide for themselves who the killer is.  Now, if you would like to edit it for grammar, I have invited people to do so.  Your condescension is entirely not needed.  Please show me an example of an episode summary you have written. 192.188.162.241 (talk) 15:48, 10 April 2009 (UTC)gqpolitico


 * My editing history is available for anyone who wants to look at it. I do not normally write episode summaries, but I know a good one when I see it.  Perhaps if this one were not so full of run-on sentences, uncapitalized proper names, and other stylistic faults, it would not seem so overwritten.  But if you refer to episode summaries on a variety of other shows, I think you will find that, in the main, they are much, much shorter.  The purpose of a WP television episode summary is to summarize, not to provide a nearly equal experience to having watched the show.  If you wish to summarize episodes, please summarize them.  I welcome that.  What runs counter to WP style, tradition, and guidelines is exhaustive recapitulation.  You may take this as the constructive criticism it is intended to be, or you may opt for feeling bruised, which is not my intention.  Your choice, friend. Monkeyzpop (talk) 22:49, 10 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Again, this is not a typical program where I can write a one paragraph summary to give the full effect. What works for an episode of ALF may not exactly work for a detailed murder mystery.192.188.162.241 (talk) 12:34, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Chloe's Status
As per Episode 1, Chloe did not die; She was shown storming out of the beach due to dismay towards Cal.

The Preview for the next episode clearly shows Chloe. And per the voice over of the preview " TWO people were already killed", alluding to Ben's and Marty's deaths, which means that Chloe is still ALIVE


 * EDIT**

Here is the Link:

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.49.83.33 (talk) 06:06, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Order
I've changed the order to show cast members and characters before the information about 'harpers globe' and online stuff - because surely that is more relevant to the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ameeromar (talk • contribs) 15:44, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Ratings
Hmm, I am super-weak in editing, so, someone else more skillful should do that but Harper's Island's overall rating wasn't 32! It was 20! It was thirty second in 18-49 demo! Here is the link: http://tvbythenumbers.com/2009/04/14/from-american-idol-to-harpers-island-top-20-shows-for-week-of-april-6-12/16715 So, somebody should take care with that! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.237.128.186 (talk) 19:44, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

Edit warring
To User:CrunchyCredits: You are in repeated violation of WP's 3-Revert rule. The information you are reverting is viable information, in particular because billing is a contractual matter of payment, not story importance. Additionally, billing will change over the course of this series. That is all beside the point, since you are in violation of WP:3RR. Please cease this edit war or risk being blocked. Monkeyzpop (talk) 05:26, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

Global "HUH" note
On Week 4, the Canadian station Global aired a "Have U Heard" segment as a commercial break began, and it stated that in order to keep the mystery a secret, actor/actresses were not told if their character was going to die until they arrived on set on the filming day. Is this worth mentioning in the trivia or development section of the article?99.254.104.18 (talk) 01:11, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think so, especially because it's contradicted by a great number of articles in which the producers describe a different manner of informing the actors of their characters' deaths. http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/blogs/guest/notes-of-an-assassin/preview-to-a-kill.php, for example. Monkeyzpop (talk) 01:48, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

Thriller versus Horror Thriller
I think we would all agree that this show is a mystery, a whodunnit. However, what this show is not is a thriller. The movie, Scream was not a thriller. The characters from Friday the 13th and A Nightmare on Elm Street — Jason Voorhees and Freddy Krueger — did not appear in thrillers. They appeared in horror films. True thrillers are films such as North by Northwest, Clear and Present Danger, Vantage Point, etc.

It is very common to confuse the word thriller with horror when describing horror films. However, such confusion does not, by virtue of repetition, make the misunderstanding correct. While one might argue that a horror thriller is a sub-genre of the larger thriller genre, one cannot drop the word horror from the description. One must call such films either horrors or horror thrillers, but not thrillers without the modifier, horror: They are clearly not pure thrillers, per se.

Thus, if the Harper’s Island series is Scream meets And Then There Were None, then it is a horror/mystery or a horror thriller/mystery, and not a thriller/mystery, given that its thriller aspects fit so clearly in the horror vein. The fact that the killer’s primary weapon is a head spade with a three-foot long blade that leaves bodies decapitated (the minister) or legless (Uncle Marty) gives us a great big clue that we are in horror territory. Also, the fact that the movie uses virutally all of the plot devices of classic horrors (with, of course, those of a whodunit) is another clue that we have landed in horrorland. Let’s be accurate in labelling this series! — SpikeToronto (talk) 07:01, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

Characters
Shouldn't the characters listed on this only be the main ones that are located on the cbs Harper's Island site. I don't feel the preacher is an important character. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Spaidace (talk • contribs) 02:55, 17 April 2009 (UTC)


 * It is important to have the preacher and any other minor characters listed due to a thorough understanding of what occurred. The death list is measuring the deaths on the island - suspects or not.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gqpolitico (talk • contribs) 03:08, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

i agree. the characters such as cousin ben and the preacher were not important as they were only mentioned in one episode. The chart should be to rule out possible suspects, not just to name random deaths. 24.62.14.200 (talk) 20:35, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

Why can't it be both?99.247.244.120 (talk) 02:49, 25 April 2009 (UTC)The Fool is a FOoL.

Having both main and minor characters on the death chart are important to the storyline of who is dying on the island. They should denote who is a main character or minor< which they did (using bold lettering to represent someone who is in the 25 list of suspects). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Flipian86 (talk • contribs) 11:59, 26 April 2009 (UTC)


 * The edit war currently going on (in contradiction to WP policy, BTW) should take into account the following fact: the so-called "tertiary characters" in the first few episodes will in some cases become primary characters as the show progresses.  Even some actors who are currently listed as "guest stars" will move into starring position as the show progresses. IMO, the distinction between primary, guest, and "tertiary" characters should be eliminated, as it will become meaningless as the show continues. Monkeyzpop (talk) 16:10, 28 April 2009 (UTC)


 * This show is a "Ten Little Indians" knockoff about people getting killed "one by one," so it is silly to leave out the "minor characters" that some editor's original research determines to be "not important." Every murder/death should be included. Every death may be a clue. Edison (talk) 15:27, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Kelly Seamen? Really? Kelly Seaman? Kelly _Seaver_...

Guaranteed to live
The main cast (Elaine Cassidy to Adam Capbell) will surely survive the whole season. Shouldn't this be shown in the death chart? Ameeromar (talk) 09:39, 18 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Can we be positive all of them will survive? We can't.
 * The excutive producers have said that everyone is at risk of death, including the main cast, so no that doesn't mean they will or wont survive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.101.124.202 (talk) 06:14, 5 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Leave the chart as is. To date Cal and Chloe have died, and they are main cast. In episode 12, which has already aired in Canada, one more of the main cast will die as well. No-one is guaranteed to live.

Suicide vs. Murder
Very well done to whoever managed to sort out the death box to show dead vs alive vs killer ... rather than suicide or murder. I'm impressed! Ameeromar (talk) 20:43, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

I have updated the death list to show Kelly as a suicide. The evidence presented in the show indicates this is probable. In the fight that occured in the Cannery during episode one, it was pointed out that they both were suicidal. In episode two, suicide is indicated by the collapsed chair beneath her. Now, this is not to say she could not have been murdered, but given the info we have, it appears to be suicide. It also would not amount to a pattern of deaths (1 non-suspect, 1 suspect) which continues through this episode if you label Kelly's death a suicide. Serial Killers like patterns and this one likes dramatic deaths, generally involving blades and now fire.Gqpolitico (talk) 03:15, 17 April 2009 (UTC)


 * It is revealed in the third episode that, if she did kill herself, the killer tampered with her body. There is ink on her eyes, and one a newspaper. "You found her, now find me" seems to point to murder or "assisted suicide". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 02:43, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

Wrong box color
Shouldn't Chloe's box be black in color since it is not known in the pilot if she died..

"Cannot be the killer" status?
I didn't watch the entire show, but don't some of the scenes—e.g, the one with a man holding the knife watching some of the characters—rule out some of the characters as possible suspects? [Well, either that, or the show is cheating, since it says there's one killer.] If so, shouldn't that be indicated as well? Samer (talk) 18:31, 12 April 2009 (UTC)


 * I've been giving this some thought and while I am keeping a personal list; it is impossible to say someone cannot partake in the killings in some way, there are reasonable assumptions. So far, on my list after carefully scrutinizing the show twice, it cannot be Henry Dunn, nor can it be Abby if you assume the man seen in the foreground with the leash is the killer.  It also cannot be anyone who was on the boat party because they were all being shuttled to the inn at that time.  This leaves it as being a local or was not booked to be at the wedding: Hunter Jennings, Jimmy Mance, Kelly Seaver, Maggie Krell, Nikki Bolton, Shane Pierce, and Sheriff Charlie Mills.  (cont.) Gqpolitico (talk) 06:54, 13 April 2009 (UTC)


 * If we fast forward to the Cannery scene, we get a flash from the killer's POV... which means no one who was inside the cannery at that time could be the killer (but those who show up later still could be.) This leaves us with: Hunter Jennings, Maggie Krell, Shane Pierce, and Sheriff Charlie Mills.  Going out on a ledge, the hand was thin that held the leash - that removes Sheriff Charlie Mills and Maggie Krell leaving us with the choices of Hunter Jennings and Shane Pierce... assuming what we saw was reality or not. :)  I hope the person with the dog leash wasn't just out walking their dog. haha! I guess my point is - its hard to eliminate people Gqpolitico (talk) 06:54, 13 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Remember, though, that Cousin Ben was tied to the propeller for some time before the boat took off, so you can't rule out anyone on the ship on that basis alone.


 * That said, there does appear to be a "plot hole" of sorts with his death: either the propeller decapitated him, and his headless body is still tied to the propeller of that boat, or he was outright dismembered—in which case something seriously amiss should have happened as he dragged those containers forward, either the propeller should have broken, or those canisters should have exploded). Samer (talk) 15:49, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

Death List Name Change
In episode 2 of Harper's Island, it is noted that "a preacher" has been murdered, but is it possible to change that to "Reverend Fain"? Considering that is the character name, as oppose to "a preacher"?

Also is there a way to denote from that list who is a minor character, and a major character (top 25 suspects) on the death list?

-- The Rev's name wasn't mentioned on the show, or made exceedingly obvious so we should keep it as 'The Preacher'

-It states his name in the closing credits —Preceding unsigned comment added by CrunchyCredits (talk • contribs) 19:54, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

Who?
At the very last second of episode eight, someone is stanging behind Abby with bloody hands. Who is it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 03:44, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
 * It was Henry —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.101.124.202 (talk) 06:17, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Deputy Lillis & Death Chart
If anyone is going to post spoiler info on the Death Chart, can you all make sure you're being correct on the info? Saw Lillis name on here and almost died laughing at whoever assumed so. When I noticed that the character Deputy Garrett wasn't even on here yet. I added it, please ensure it stays there. His character is credited in episode 7 and 8 and was the one who got shot. So please next time you're editing the Death Chart, please be accurate and not surprise people with incorrect info. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.101.124.202 (talk) 06:27, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Booth
Booth wasn't killed. He shot himself by accident, shouldnt that be shown on the chart? 24.224.170.188 (talk) 04:27, 7 June 2009 (UTC)RoshanMcG
 * It is currently shown that Booth is dead, is what you propose to show accidental deaths?--69.233.130.213 (talk) 02:23, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, or maybe "Self-inflicted deaths", or "Not killed by killer", etc. 24.224.170.188 (talk) 04:27, 7 June 2009 (UTC)RoshanMcG
 * We have been led to belive that Booth shot himself. This may not be the case. It's really very hard to make a dropped weapon fire and hit someone with such accuracy. It could be that he was shot with a rifle from some distance and the shot might not have been heard by Booth or Malcolm —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.70.228.162 (talk) 04:46, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
 * CBS has fully stated that Booth is a victim of the killer, because of this his death will not be changed, we have changed it in the past but found it to just be misleading. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.101.124.202 (talk) 06:17, 5 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Right now, the chart says "this person dies", which is completely unambiguous regarding how any of the characters died or if they were murdered. We must err on the side of safety on Wikipedia and not make definitive statements that have not been confirmed by CBS or the production team. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 22:21, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Killer's Identity: Maggie Krell?
Nine suspects have been killed, and nine cast members have been ruled out.

This leaves eight possible suspects. One of them is the Wedding Planner, Maggie Krell.

I'm just spitballing here, but it says on her bio that she has "more than a few" surprises in store for everyone there. She has lived on the island her whole life. She was around when Reverend Fain when he was killed. She could have lost a family member in the Wakefield killings.

Basically, she could be the killer. Anyone else think so? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 19:19, 31 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes, she could be the killer and so could anyone else, including people that aren't part of the main 25 characters. Until the killer is revealed on the show, then we shouldn't speculate in the article. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 19:44, 31 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Fair enough. I'm just pointing out that there is a good deal more evidence pointing toward her. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 19:55, 3 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I think that'd be a bit too easy. Plus she's really not a main character & there hasn't been any buildup for her to do anything. I think that the killer will be one of the main characters or someone that has had a lot of screen time. I don't believe that it is J.D.- that's also too easy of an answer. I'm also thinking that there may be more than one killer. The amount of work done is an awful lot & it would be very hard for one person to do it alone. Not to mention that there's enough reasons for many of the people to kill each other off... My personal belief is that the killer is either the Sheriff, Jimmy, Abby or one of the other main characters. I'm wondering also if Wakefield had another reason for coming back. Maybe because he had a fling with Abby's mom & gave birth to Abby? Also, I'm wondering if the killer hadn't been following Abby around as well. She's moved around a lot & the supposed Wakefield killer did as well (assuming that the Sheriff's ideas are correct). Maybe the killer was folling Abby... or maybe the killer IS Abby! Tokyogirl79 (talk) 17:59, 4 June 2009 (UTC)Tokyogirl79


 * See: NOTAFORUM ("In addition, bear in mind that talk pages exist for the purpose of discussing how to improve articles; they are not mere general discussion pages about the subject of the article [...]") This conversation is not about the article or how to improve it, you're having a conversation, speculating on the killer which should be done elsewhere. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 09:12, 7 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Jackieboy87, you say that the killer could be someone that is not one of the 25 suspects. That is false!  I believe it was CBS (or was it the people working on "Harper's Island") who confirmed that the killer is indeed one of the 25 suspects? Mr. College (talk) 21:16, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Dead in water?
It appears CBS has moved Harper's Island from its cushy Thursday post-CSI position into the Saturday Night Death Slot, for at least the next two weeks, a tactic often used by networks when a show is performing poorly and they decide to quietly kill it off in favor of airing reruns of a more popular show. Is that the case here, or is there some other reason for the move? –Fierce Beaver (talk) 22:35, 27 April 2009 (UTC)


 * What an intriguing question! I have yet to hear (on previews) that it was changed to Saturday.  Has it been shown on previews yet? Mr. College (talk) 19:41, 30 April 2009 (UTC)


 * It's only 13 episodes, and CBS had committed to airing the entire series before it premiered. Plus, in these days of time-shifting (whether via VCR, DVR, or other means), the supposed "death slots" don't mean what they once did. 69.136.13.211 (talk) 01:21, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

I don't know how reliable this site is -> http://www.tvsquad.com/tag/harpers+island/ < but they give some explanations that they credit to CBS....at least saying that the show will complete its run.


 * About a couple of minutes ago, I saw a preview and it said it was on tonight at 10/9c (the usual time). However, I went to tv.com, and it says "Criminal Minds" is on at 10/9c.  I'll still watch to verify, but it would be nice if we could get some confirmation. Mr. College (talk) 23:50, 30 April 2009 (UTC)


 * A couple of minutes, I saw a preview and it mentioned the day/time change. Still not sure what to think. Mr. College (talk) 00:58, 1 May 2009 (UTC)

I can now confirm that the show DID get bumped to Saturday. According to my newspaper (Sacramento Bee), the show will probably remain there if the ratings continue as they are right now. D33PPURPLE (talk) 21:59, 2 May 2009 (UTC)D33PPURPLE
 * More bad news for the show... CBS's schedule (same link as before) now shows a rerun of The Mentalist on the evening of Saturday, May 16 in the slot that would have aired episode 6 of Harper's Island. If CBS lives up to their promise to air all episodes, it looks like it's going to be on an irregular schedule. –Fierce Beaver (talk) 20:22, 3 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Global is still airing them on Thursdays.

Exact number of Characters
I am confused. The promos stated that there were 25 characters. But it ended up with 36 characters including the guests and people from the island. On wikipedia, it stated 25 characters as well. But on the "dead and alive" list, there are 29 characters and on an article about a list of characters there were 36 including John Wakefield.Could somebody explain? Does it mean only 25 characters would be killed?

--210.24.206.186 (talk) 06:48, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * This question is simple, the 25 are the suspects of the killings, the additional cast are not a suspect since they arn't part of the 25. Instead of asking questions maybe you should check out HarpersGlobe.com to be more informed of the show instead of posting on edit page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.101.124.202 (talk) 06:17, 5 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes, they are the 25 suspects in the killings as stated by CBS. In the death chart, we list the 25 suspects and all other victims; on the characters page, we list all characters of the show, regardless of their suspect status. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 16:41, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

So how many people are there on the island since the beginning? --210.24.206.157 (talk) 10:05, 10 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I don't think there's an exact number, as there were several people there for the wedding, who have left and several locals, who may still be on the island. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 13:18, 10 June 2009 (UTC)


 * On the death chart, if a persons name is not bold, he or she was killed, but was not one of the 25 suspects in the killings. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 14:46, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Abby in woods
has anyone seen the following scene in a episode yet =abby is running through lawns/bushes when suddenlly a man with a buzzsaw apperars in front of her  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.199.23.163 (talk) 02:29, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Cut scenes?
Harper's Island Cut Scenes —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.199.23.163 (talk) 14:13, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Episode 10 Easter Egg
In Episode 10, Shane can be seen drinking alcohol. On the bottle, it says Robert McLachlan. Robert McLachlan is the directer of photography for the episode. Just something I felt mentioning —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kailman4322 (talk • contribs) 18:59, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Possibility?
I would greatly appreciate if viewers waited until after nine on saturday night ot post what happens on Harpers Island because it spoils it for the rest of us.


 * I mentioned something like this lower down the page. I was told that there are allowed to post it as soon it airs for the first time, wherever that might be.  I just avoid everything Harper's Island from Thursday to Saturday. Mr. College (talk) 23:04, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Wakefield: KILLER!
Wakefield killed SIX PEOPLE and then he killed Sheriff Mills. I don't care that he's not THE killer, he's A killer. Stop editing the death list. Wakefield is a killer! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 00:18, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Shane and Madison's Deaths??
The death chart shows Madion and Shane dying in a later episode, that's not even out yet, not even in Canada, and Cal's row ends early. Can we PLEASE protect this page from being edited?? 67.249.228.224 (talk) 23:06, 23 June 2009 (UTC)Ulrock7777

Wakefield on Death Chart Bold?
He isn't listed as a main character on the CBS website, so why is he bold? I changed him from bold to normal font the other day, but it seems my change has been reverted. Seeing as the page is now protected, could somebody unbold him, or of course if you think he should be bold feel free to state your case. Sirrontail (talk) 11:34, 26 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I have just edited the page for this reason. I also added a note to the key to explain the difference between bolded and non-bolded names, as I've found it weird that no explanation was given in that section. Someone may have a better idea on how to display that note, since it looks kind of out of place down there with the Color Boxes, but it'll do for now, I think. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 13:25, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Kelly's Name
Someone changed Kelly's name from Kelly Seaver to Kelly Seamen. Isn't there some way to stop all the vandalism on this page?


 * Uh, somebody should change it back... Semi-protected - really? 48park (talk) 01:50, 26 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Fixed. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 13:32, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Run Time??
As an avid viewer of this show, I know the run time of this show is not 99.2097 minutes. Who keeps editing this page, I thought it was semi protected?


 * Fixed. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 13:32, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Article Content
It kind of seems to me as though this article has some elements that are really leaning more toward a community gossip page rather than a regular Wikipedia page. Specifically, I'm not sure exactly why there's a death chart. That seems like the kind of thing more suited for a fan page, or at the very least to be integrated into the episode list article. This talk page suffers from the same problem, more than the actual article itself (the talk page is supposed to be talk relevant to the actual development of the page and not discussion on what happened on last night's episode) but that's a lot more commonplace, and it's not the main page anyway, so that doesn't really bother me. Can anyone cite a reason as to why the death chart should remain on the main page (besides it being relevant to fan interests)? 68.47.205.200 (talk) 21:56, 15 June 2009 (UTC)68.47.205.200
 * The death chart is crude but it does remind me very much of the elimination charts from reality tv series. I mostly object to the inaccessible formatting of the chart that fails to use text to convey the primary information and instead relies on colour which is fine as a secondary way to convey information but poor web design to rely on it and assume users are viewing the page using the same content style and or user agent as you. -- Horkana (talk) 16:28, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Death Chart #2
I would like to ask that my edit to the death chart, in putting in "self-inflicted deaths" be kept. They are really helpful. Also, I don't think that putting "... and commits at least one murder in the episode." is helpful, they can still be a killer without killing someone in an episode.... Thanks. RoshanMcG (talk) 03:27, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Why is it helpful? Until it is confirmed that Booth's death was self-inflicted we "err on the side of safety on Wikipedia and not make definitive statements that have not been confirmed by CBS or the production team." as Jackieboy87 said earlier on in the talk page. Until that is confirmed then Chloe is the only one who suffered a self-inflicted death, and do we really want one colour for the unique circumstances of Chloe's death? Although I would also argue that Chloe's death isn't self-inflicted, it was, to all intents and purposes, a forced suicide.
 * They can still be a killer without having killed someone in an episode - so why didn't you colour all of Wakefields boxes red? Because that wouldn't be helpful, the death chart aids us in seeing who killed in a certain episode, not just who killed. Sirrontail (talk) 17:09, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The Producer says in his twitter page "when a character dies, they are never coming back. Sorry Booth fans".
 * Well, maybe not put it as self-inflicted, but we should be more specific in the cases of Booth and Chloe. And if not now, will it change when the show is done? 24.224.170.188 (talk) 21:40, 27 June 2009 (UTC) RoshanMcG
 * I didn't suggest Booth would come back. He is dead, but the question of how he died hasn't been sufficiently confirmed by the show yet. IF at the end of the show the self-inflicted nature of Booth's death is confirmed then the discussion of whether a new colourbox is needed should be raised again - however I will still be of the opinion that the current ones are sufficient. This is because of the issue I raised before about Chloe's death, and the question of whether we want a new colour for the unique circumstances of one person's death. If people want specifics about the deaths, which I assume they will, they have links to the character profiles which will explain more - that was exactly the reason as to why I put the character links there in the first place. Sirrontail (talk) 22:41, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Okay, Fair enough. 24.224.170.188 (talk) 02:30, 28 June 2009 (UTC) RoshanMcG

Plot - Malcolm's Death
In the plot it says he was killed by a headspade. But the weapon is not shown... 24.224.170.188 (talk) 18:02, 28 June 2009 (UTC) RoshanMcG
 * I've changed it to a more generic "Malcolm being hit" rather than mentioning the headspade. Sirrontail (talk) 19:01, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

Death Chart spoilers
I added a spoilers warning to the Death Chart. The episode had not aired yet.

Rickj64 (talk) 23:14, 15 April 2009 (UTC)


 * I have reverted your edits per Wikipedia policy. Please see here and here for more info. I have also removed the information from the chart as no source is provided and the episode has not aired. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 23:23, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

These episodes are shown in canada before america. So the information is correct.


 * I removed death marks for episodes which has not been aired yet. Borleszk (talk) 14:43, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

I hope somebody agrees with me that the death chart being edited on Thursdays before the episode airs in some states on Saturdays is a real mood killer. It depletes the reason of Harper's Island and it really makes you not want to watch when you know who is killed before it goes on television. Please, don't post spoilers. Wait until the episode airs. After Saturday, it is okay. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.100.181.123 (talk) 00:50, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but by a similar logic, the episodes don't air until MUCH later in Australia, UK etc so shouldn't we save it until everyone has seen it? No. Wikipedia is not an American-only website. Once the show has aired on TV somewhere, it is public information for Wikipedia's use, as far as I'm concerned. 121.127.205.160 (talk) 11:06, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

How about each country makes their own death chart page. That way it is only updated when your country airs an episode.

How about everybody wait until they've seen the episode before consulting Wikipedia? You know that it airs in Canada first on Thursdays, so don't look at the pages between Thursdays at 10pm EST and when it airs in your neighbourhood. That way, you won't see the spoilers. 20:13, 29 June 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.225.63.10 (talk)

Sully as Guest Star??
How is he a guest star, he has been in practicly every episode....... CAN SOMEONE FIX THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.238.222.204 (talk) 21:51, 29 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Nothing needs to be fixed. Matt Barr, who plays Sully, is credited as a guest star by CBS. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 20:27, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

Killed by Wakefield
We should make the squares of people who have been confirmed as killed by Wakefield a different colour (blue?). The Sheriff, Nikki, Shane, Deputy Lillis and Cal for starters. Black can be unknown or by the "main" killer. 58.161.115.20 (talk) 08:28, 30 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Also, Richard probably was, since Wakefield threatened Madison with Shea's death, in addition to her father's.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 17:46, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

We DON'T need to make the death chart so complicated. The death chart serves as a quick guide on who has died in which episode. People can get all the details about the murders (way of death, who did it etc.) by reading the episode summaries. I repeat. NO NEED to make the death chart complicated. Xanthi22 (talk) 12:10, 30 June 2009 (UTC) Xanthi22

Ruth (Episode 3)
In Episode 3, Ruth got hit by a car. I was under the impression that she died. Did she die? Mr. College (talk) 22:17, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

just watched the episode, not sure what youre talking about. Only person to get hit by a car was the brother, and he survived.... Xornok (talk) 23:43, 25 April 2009 (UTC)


 * You're right. Maybe it was the hair, maybe it was because Ruth gave Henry a key to Hunter's room shortly before, but I thought JD was Ruth. Mr. College (talk) 19:47, 30 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Who is Ruth? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 03:06, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Semi-protection
This page needs to be semi-protected. The amount of people messing with the death chart and generally messing with the page, each of them with their own ideas of how it should be like, is quite huge. This page has to be semi-locked or something, NOT open for edit to people who haven't logged in. Xanthi22 (talk) 12:14, 30 June 2009 (UTC)


 * It already is semi-protected and will continue to be until July 9th. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 13:40, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Hey, Chloe Commited suicide, I beleive ther should be a color for the people who commited suicide, eventhrough for right now it was just Chloe, it should still be on the death chart. Kaybugg1 (talk) 20:09, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * A colour box for just a few people isn't needed, it is excess information - if people want more information then they can visit the character page. I also don't think she committed suicide either, it was a forced suicide, which I wouldn't class as a suicide but a killing on par with all other killings Wakefield committed.Sirrontail (talk) 20:38, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Hey Sirrontail You might be right, so i put it on the color chart that she was forced to commit suicide, still it shouldn't be classified as a Wakefeild murder, it should have it's own classifisation. (sorry for my spelling.)Kaybugg1 (talk) 16:35, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * It should NOT have its own classification. Black simply means "This character dies in this episode."  Regardless of how she died, she still died.  We don't need a sub-classification for that.  Also, Wakefield didn't force her to commit suicide, because if he did it wouldn't be suicide, it'd be murder.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Satturos (talk • contribs) 17:44, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Satturos is exactly right. It being forced suicide means that is is a killing - just like all other killings are - and as such belongs with the black colour box. Sirrontail (talk) 18:17, 2 July 2009 (UTC)


 * The fact of the matter is that calling their deaths a "forced suicide" or a "murder" or a "self-inflicted death" are all observations made by the users who keep adding those terms to the chart. The mere fact that there is such a debate over which terms to use is evidence enough that these are basically opinions about what has happened and using these terms without proper sourcing (such as the official recaps referring to the deaths as such) is a violation of the no original research policy. We should stick with what has been confirmed- that they died. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 22:32, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't agree that it is original research, she chose suicide over "an alternative [she] perceive[d] as worse", which is the definition we have for Forced suicide, so I don't think quoting WP:OR is the right thing to do. However things have their place, and if people wish to include these terms in the character page then they should. My major problem is cluttering the death chart with useless information, and information which is, potentially, only applicable to one character. Sirrontail (talk) 00:51, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
 * And how exactly do we know what she perceives? It's a fine line between describing what happens and original research. My point was that we should leave it to the basics because there are so many ways to interpret what happens. I agree with you anyways about wanting to keep it simple.... --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 02:16, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
 * It is my belief that her last line before jumping (can't remember it verbatum, it has been a week) showed that she was picking suicide as the preferable option over being killed by Wakefeild. But seeing as we basically agree I'll shh now :)Sirrontail (talk) 05:35, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
 * It wasn't forced suicide. She commited suicide because she wanted to be with Cal. Well, that's what I and many others thought. I think that after the series is over, and we know all the causes of the deaths, that we should include self-inflicted deaths. Surely adding one other colour box won't be considered "cluttering"... 24.224.170.188 (talk) 03:09, 4 July 2009 (UTC) RoshanMcG
 * It was "You can't have me," Sirrontail. If there's some kind of confirmation that she was not 'killed' by a killer, then I fully support another color for her, especially if Booth is revealed to have actually shot himself, then if could be a "self-inflicted death" to distinguish between Kills and other deaths. (since people are likely to read the Death chart and assume they were all killed). Not a must, but, whatever. If it's given some confirmation, I'd vote for it. Mizery Made ( talk  ·  contribs ) 05:16, 4 July 2009 (UTC)
 * And isn't saying "You can't have me" an indication that she would find it preferable to kill herself rather than give Wakefield the satisfaction of killing her? If it is shown that Booth did shoot himself, and if there is another clear suicide/accidental death, then sure add another colour. But at the moment I don't think there is a clear case for a new colour based on Booth's and Chloe's death. The death chart clearly says that they died, it doesn't mention that they were killed, it just says death. Anyway it's a pointless argument at the moment, lets wait and see how the finale pans out. Sirrontail (talk) 14:22, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

Two Cassidies?
This will likely go in the eventual "Trivia" section, but I found it interesting that both the best friend of the groom and the bride to be are played by actresses with the surname Cassidy(although they do not appear to be immediately related). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.156.14.109 (talk) 14:59, 12 April 2009 (UTC)

They are not immediately related and wikipedia doesn't like trivia sections Ameeromar (talk) 15:41, 13 April 2009 (UTC)


 * You could probably mention as an aside in the Cast/Casting section they are not related. Alternatively you could make the split clearer or be a bit more pedantic and write a slightly more verbose descriptoin of them such as Ms. Casssidy an American actress and Ms. Cassidy an Irish actress. It's tricky enough but with the right phrasing you can work in all kinds of things or lead implications in a certain way.  -- Horkana (talk) 03:38, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

Season 2?
I'm just wondering if there will be any further seasons of this show? The show is generally addressed as "Season 1".

Is this just protocol, or is there a potential future for the series? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 01:37, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

->  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Laconix (talk • contribs) 03:21, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks. Just wondering. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 14:40, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

The Reason I removed the sentence about Richard Burgi
I know it was sourced, but the source was wrong. Harry Hamlin, according to IMDB, is the only actor to know the length of his contract. Which makes more sense because his character died in the first episode. If you go on IMDB and look in Harper's Island trivia, it will say that correct statement. I am now going to add Harry Hamlin back to the sentence, but I'll keep Richard Burgi's up there. I request that it not be removed again because it isn't wrong. Plus, my statement about Harry Hamlin shouldn't have been removed in the first place because it was sourced as well. —Preceding unsigned comment added by HarryPotter013 (talk • contribs) 06:49, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Why is it that IMDB is right and the Executive Producer of the show is wrong? IMDB is not a Reliable Source,whilst the producer of the show is. Sirrontail (talk) 07:22, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree, IMDb is not reliable as it uses user-generated content for a majority of its information. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 13:38, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Only creators of the show can create a page for it. I would know because I tried. IMDB is not user-created content, I don't know where you got that idea. The only user-created part of IMDB is the FAQ. However, I just realized that Harry Hamlin was just making a guest appearance and was never going to be part of the original cast. I suppose I could just leave the statement alone since he DID know the length of his contract, but only because he was making a guest appearance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by HarryPotter013 (talk • contribs) 15:34, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The Triva section is user created, I know I just had the form up to input a triva item. We can't assume anything though, until a reliable source says different, all we know is that he was employed to work on the show and only found out he was going to die when he received the script for the first episode.Sirrontail (talk) 16:44, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Shane
In both the "Splash" article and under Shane on the characters page, it states that after he's killed, Shane's arms are cut off and he is hung from the ceiling by his elbows. If you look, both of his arms are still there and he's tied up on a cross-like contraption which is hanging from the ceiling. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Link McCloud (talk • contribs) 21:51, 9 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I changed it to his hands being cut off. I also changed Cal's death to being stabbed in the chest, not stabbed in the neck.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by RoshanMcG (talk • contribs) 23:54, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Death Chart Again
Why are some of the boxes pale pink? There is no discernible reason for them to be changed at this time, or at least, nothing that I can see. It doesn't make sense, and the colour has now entirely gone from maggie's box. Please, stop changing the chart, especially when the changes are incorrect or irrelevant. 78.16.126.11 (talk) 01:58, 10 July 2009 (UTC)
 * And where's Abby? In all the editing, her name has gone missing.... Aristophanes68 (talk) 02:12, 10 July 2009 (UTC) Ahh, she's back. Thanks! Aristophanes68 (talk) 02:46, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Robin on Death Chart
Why is she there? I thought the point of it was to show the people who had died in the show. We only found out that she died via Harper's Globe. She shouldn't be on there as we never saw her die in Harper's Island itself. Otherwise why not include Sparky, Brent, Andy Cullen etc? Get her off there! 58.161.113.139 (talk) 04:11, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Post-Finale Death Chart Colors
I feel that the death chart looks very clumsy as of now. Seeing as we know who the killers are, and generally who they killed, we should update the death chart colors to reflect this. Seeing one or 2 red squares above an episode is confusing and does not specify who killed whom in that episode. Therefore, I think that designating two colors for Wakefield and Henry and putting those for who they killed will make things easier to understand. For example, Henry, who's color is, oh, I don't know, blue, killed Rev. Fain and therefore, instead of a black square by Fain's name, it shows a blue square. Same thing for Wakefield; whoever he killed, gets his color. Then, we can go without the red "killer" squares entirely. Now, I think more people than I should discuss which colors they will have, but for the sake of getting the ball rolling, how about red for Wakefield and navy blue for Henry? I suck at editing, so please excuse me if I do not edit it myself, but maybe we should talk about it before someone goes off and starts changing colors around. Discuss... Kmanner (talk) 04:15, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Globe isn't over!
In the Harper's Globe section, it says that Robin killed herself in the last episode. However, Globe has one more week to go, and Robin has been revealed to have faked the hanging (gasped for air in the very end) It's not over yet people67.249.228.224 (talk) 02:44, 13 July 2009 (UTC)Ulrock7777

Booth
Booth did not commit suricide, or suicide. I mean, he shot himself on accident, but is that really considered suicide? Not like Chloe, who knowingly and intentionally killed herself so as to not be killed by Wakefield, and to be with Cal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.95.174.10 (talk) 21:40, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * It is not considered suicide unless the death was intentional, yes. We do not know, however, if Booth died from his own bullet or the killer shot him. When asked about this, the actor who played Booth's character, said that he could not reveal the secret. --Pgecaj (talk) 00:04, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh, c'mon, Booth accidentally shot himself. How the heck could the killer perfectly time a shot with the handgun's accidental discharge? Answer: he couldn't. 74.73.110.46 (talk) 12:52, 10 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I share your reasoning. But we must remember that this is a television show and anything goes. The reason I think we should not specify it is because Booth himself and Malcolm, when asked if Booth's death was an accident or not, said that they could not disclose the secret and themselves verified that the scene was ambiguous. Now, however, that the show is over and Henry nor Wakefield have not confessed about Booth's death, it is safer to say that his death was accidental, not intentional (by the killer). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.190.83.197 (talk) 23:32, 11 July 2009 (UTC)


 * In the finale, Henry says that he purposefully arranged for Malcolm to find the money to see how he would react. One could say that this indirectly leads Booth to shoot himself and that Henry is responsible for his death. Once again, this another example of why we should merely state that the person died instead of making qualifications relating to how each person died. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 23:51, 11 July 2009 (UTC)


 * By this logic though, that one persons actions indirectly cause the actions of another, then one could argue that Trish should be marked as a killer as it was her and Henry's wedding that brought a vast majority of the victims to the island to be killed. It's my opinion that this accident is too far removed from that action to be considered a "kill." That's not an argument either that it should be marked as an accident or suicide either. Perhaps this falls under the "Butterfly effect" or something? Not actually familiar with that however, so just taking a stab in the dark. Anyway... Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 03:36, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

What happened?
You'll notice that several key images from the trailers (Abby running through the hedge maze, someone bleeding on a newspaper) are not in the series at all. Why is this? Was there a re-write or something? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 04:45, 12 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes. They changed things as they went, including the cast. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.232.57.248 (talk) 17:59, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

These scenes were cut, and were probably from the original 15 min pilot presentation which ended up being re-written. Karim Zreik mentioned the maze scene in one of his tweets, "Q: Will the scene with Abby in the maze with the chainsaw still be shown, or was it cut? KZ: Cut, cut, cut. Cutetanny (talk) 18:06, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Just wondering. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 21:00, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Death chart #3
Can someone please explain to me the purpose of the death chart? Aside from being a huge spoiler, is there any other purpose?

Anyone coming to this site who has already watched the series already knows the information. So the only people coming to this page who don't already know are people who haven't watched the series.

Can someone give me a genuine valid reason for including the identity of the murderer in such a prominent way? AlistairMcMillan (talk) 00:51, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * It's purpose? To give easily accessible information about a show. It isn't a spoiler - the show has now finished. What is your reason to remove the Death Chart other than an aversion to "spoiler". I am reverting you edit, if you wish to convince people that it should be removed, then do it here, don't just storm in f-ing and blinding before removing the chart. Thanks. Sirrontail (talk) 01:05, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * (e/c) It sums up the majority of the plot in one simple chart; it is essentially a bare-bones episode list, which is useful for quick reference. Also, the spoiler thing has been debated to death. For a complete, accurate article, spoilers need to be included, so one way or another the identity of the killers will still be included. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 01:08, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * The show has finished airing in the US and Canada. Believe it or not there are other countries on this planet.


 * And of course it is a spoiler. Anyone who watched the show obviously knows who is the primary killer throughout the series. The table serves absolutely no purpose for them. Only people who haven't watched the series are going to find any new information in the table. Therefore it is a spoiler.


 * The identity of the central killer is the core mystery running through the series. Spoiling this plotline in such a prominent way doesn't do any service to the series, the people who worked on it, or Wikipedia.


 * The only possible reason to add this to an article is fulfil your own pathetic need to say "ha ha I knew this before you did". I'd love to know how quickly you all leapt to add the information to Wikipedia. Did you even wait until the credits had ended? Pathetic. AlistairMcMillan (talk) 02:11, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Wow, it only took until your first reply to start with the ad hominem attacks. I expected more from an administrator. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 02:30, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Goodness. I agree with Jackieboy87, I'd expect much better Wikiquette from an administrator. I am well aware that there are other countries on this planet, I live in one of them - however this changes nothing. Perhaps make yourself familiar with the Spoiler guidelines, why do you think Harper's Island should be considered an exception to the guideline? Sirrontail (talk) 02:54, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Okay, AlistairMcMillan, if you don't want to be spoiled, DON'T READ THE DEATH CHART. Or do you have no self control? It's a reference point, not a bragging mechanism, and if people don't want to know the information, they can notice the death chart and quickly avert the page without absorbing any information. So, in conclusion, even if it is a spoiler, it'd be your own fault for identifying it.   —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.247.244.120 (talk) 00:31, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Indeed. I mean it is called a death chart, its pretty clear that you should avoid it if you don't want to know about deaths. Sirrontail (talk) 01:08, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

It is a spoiler. so wat? Wikipedia needs to stay up-to-day. rememr, were not censored. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.232.57.248 (talk) 18:04, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Color Code for Death Chart
I remember when this first began we had RED for being revealed to be the killer. Shouldn't we keep it RED for revealed only and not killed someone in an episode? In other words, remove all red boxes except for when the killer's identity is revealed. I only ask for this change because that was how it originally was. (Note: I didn't want to go ahead and edit this just in case an edit war will follow.) Mr. College (talk) 04:17, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

I totally agree. It keeps the chart simple and less confusing. The chart is there to serve as a quick reference point, not a detailed one. That is why we have the character pages. If someone needs to see who killed a certain character, they go check out their page. Shimples, no? And why does Abby have a red square? It makes her look like she was working with Wakefield! Cutetanny (talk) 18:14, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

The chart is simply a condensation of all information that we have been given. Showing who killed who is important information that we have - that in my opinion doesn't complicate or confuse the chart. Colouring Wakefield and Henry red only in the episode that they are revealed to be a killer is pointless and superfluous - the reveal can simply be mentioned somewhere else in the article - whilst having the chart show who killed in each episode allows it to give important information about the killings. Abby had a red square because she killed Henry, the colour box said "This person kills another in this episode", so with that note on the colour box she should be coloured red.Sirrontail (talk) 18:42, 12 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Exactly, if we're going with the argument that the black box is vague and thus covers both murders and suicides, then the killer statement is equally as vague and should cover both murders as well as the Abby case. Can't have a double standard. Abby killed Henry, that made her a killer (even if it was self defense or a otherwise justified kill) in that episode. Result, red box. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 03:36, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

The red box indicates who is the main killer throughout the show, not 'people who've killed'. The red box was originally intended to show us which person, or persons, were behind the current murder spree. Just like the original black box meant 'dead' and the original white box meant 'alive'. There shouldn't be any buts, maybes, ifs, or halfs. The original concept of the death chart was simple and easy to understand, so why not leave it like that? It's a quick reference guide to shows us who died in what episode (not how), who stayed alive and who was going around killing people. If people need to know more there are episode and character pages. Cutetanny (talk) 15:55, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 * That might have been how it was, but that doesn't mean that should be how it should stay. As I said before, the death chart is supposed to be a condensed form of the information that we have been given - now that we know, for the most part, who killed who we should make note of that on the chart. To stick with something just because of how it was originally is not a good reason. Sirrontail (talk) 22:56, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes it is. Besides, some are pure speculation, we are not told who kills Marty or Ben ect. and I thought that stuff was against wiki rules or whatever. Just leave the chart as it was. Once again, each episode page has a list of who dies and how. If you need to know you go there. Cutetanny (talk) 23:21, 16 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Some were pure speculation, and I had originally left the ones that weren't confirmed blank hoping for later confirmation after the show had ended. I still believe it exists as a condensed form of information and we should include the extra information, as it doesn't make the chart that much more complex, yet conveys a lot more information Sirrontail (talk) 00:54, 17 July 2009 (UTC)

Episode pages
Many of the individual episode pages have been proposed for deletion per WP:NOTPLOT and WP:EPISODE. Fences &amp;  Windows  14:25, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Why are all the episode pages getting deleted? I don't see the problem with them, they look just like other shows episode pages... Are we not allowed to have episode pages for Harper's Island now...? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cutetanny (talk • contribs) 20:37, 17 July 2009 (UTC)


 * If the episodes are not independently notable - i.e. if they haven't each received significant coverage in independent secondary reliable sources - then they should be deleted or merged. If other shows have episode pages contrary to policy, they should also be deleted or merged. See WP:OTHER. Fences  &amp;  Windows  19:21, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

Death Chart
The chart is incorrect. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Laconix (talk • contribs) 03:23, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Here's all the discussion about the death chart on the page. Ameeromar (talk) 09:39, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
 * There must be a distinction between murders and accidents. Or else visitors who are unsure about certain facts in the episodes might assume that accidents were murders, for example that Malcolm murdered Joel.--91.65.29.113 (talk) 01:32, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

Deaths of a Character should Not be put on the website until the Show is over on the west coast. I was just on the site and saw who was killed before even seeing it on TV. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.221.241.147 (talk) 01:41, 3 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I think they should be updated as soon as it is shown on TV, no matter where.--24.224.170.188 (talk) 02:58, 15 May 2009 (UTC)Roshan

agreed. wikipedia is not a west coast only website.Ameeromar (talk) 16:04, 23 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Would it really kill people to hold off updating the page for a few hours so as to save folks from spoilers, though? 69.136.13.211 (talk) 19:51, 8 June 2009 (UTC)


 * And please stop updating the page with deaths from episodes that has't even been aired yet. Borleszk (talk) 14:38, 13 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Okay so Wikipedia doesn't have any policy about spoilers but even if there isn't a policy people are supposed to try and be nice to each other. The Death Chart could be massively improved, the current layout is not reader friendly.  The chart should be changed to list Episodes along the Vertical Axis and then say who died in that episode, at least that way readers who have only seen the first few episodes can take a look at the list and see the first few and choose not to have the deaths spoiled by reading further.  Most importantly that chart would have the spoiler about the killer at the bottom making it easier to avoid reading unintentionally.  Changing the layout could also allow room to accommodate more information like the manner of the death.  Take a look at the layouts used for Survivor they are listed in chronological order.  Also the current colour boxed layout is design failure, the right way to do it is to present the information as text and then use colour as a secondary information otherwise the data is much harder to interpret for anyone with accessibility issues or reading Wikipedia on unknown devices (like a cellphone).  Hoping to get some support for changes to the Death Chart before I start working on it. -- Horkana (talk) 03:38, 15 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I myself don't see the big issue with the Chart's current layout. You point out the Survivor: Borneo article as an example of how you feel it should be laid out, but I fail to see how any of the charts in that article would save people from spoilers. Heck, the Death Chart looks not much different to the "Voting History" charts in the Survivor articles. You also say it could accommodate more information, like how they died, but that information is already available in the Character write-ups (which are available by clicking the characters name) as well as on the episodes' article, so I fail to see the need to include this information in the chart. The colored boxes might be an issue with cellphones or people with accessibility issues, but it's my opinion that the table looks cleaner and overall better than tables such as those in the Survivor articles. *Shrugs* Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 12:40, 15 June 2009 (UTC)


 * For lack of support I wont bother then, I've noted my objection perhaps others will see it and flag it for accessibility too and be more motivated to work on it. The detail in the character profiles could potentially be repeated or moved, since the table is going to inherently contain spoilers it might even be better to have all the spoiler type information there rather than in the character profiles. Nevermind, maybe later.  -- Horkana (talk) 16:31, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

There was some color vandalism on the death chart...basically someone put some random colors with no key, so I made the assumption that they did not mean anything and deleted them. --Anzac36 (talk) 20:52, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Will someone fix the death chart, the final episode hasn't been aired anywhere, the survivors aren't known yet. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Aselig (talk • contribs) 15:40, 10 July 2009 (UTC)


 * The finale has in fact aired in Canada and the chart is correct. --Jackieboy87 (talk · contribs) 18:11, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Hey. Just want to let you know the Death Chart is incorrect. Henry killed Reverend Fain, Mr Wellington, Mrs Wellington, Ben Wellington, Richard and a few more that havn't been put up on the chart. Lots of the victims of John Wakefield aren't updated. Please update them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Matthoenn (talk • contribs) 05:29, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

Information on Deaths?
Do we think that below the death chart information should be given on how each character was killed? e.g. Uncle Marty was chopped in half by the killer after falling through the Bridge, and that the Bridge was later repaired. Ameeromar (talk) 16:02, 23 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I also have this concern; it may be that determining whether a death is intentional or accidental is difficult and also whether an apparent "death" is genuine since it is possible that the (independent) killer(s) may want to have been assigned "dead" and the discovering parties may be complicit. --69.233.130.213 (talk) 02:23, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

Killers
Until characters are confirmed, absolutely, to be killers, leave the red square off the chart. Similarly, leave guest characters off the chart until they're confirmed to be dead. It's bloody irritating to see people there who don't belong. Epenthesis (talk) 03:06, 21 June 2009 (UTC)epenthesis


 * Epenthesis, please do not remove the Wakefield section of the Death Chart just because it does not fit your liking. The marking is valid as according to the legend. Wakefield is now a character on Harper's Island so be all means he deserves a spot on the Death Chart. The only reason why his episode 10 marking should be white is if the legend say "the" killer and not "a" killer.70.24.45.233 (talk) 03:59, 21 June 2009 (UTC)


 * "A" killer is not the point of the chart, for one thing. For another, my point was that the chart shouldn't contain such speculative information.Epenthesis (talk) 04:13, 21 June 2009 (UTC)epenthesis

According to the legend, the red markings show that the person is not "the" killer but "a" killer. So by all means, this, in my mind anyway, validates a red marking for Wakefield in episode 10. If you do not agree, it could be suggested that the legend also be changed to "the killer" or a new colour be given for "a" killer.70.24.45.233 (talk) 03:51, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

The events of episode 10 don't confirm Wakefield to be a killer any more than the events of episode 8 confirm Henry to be one-it's still circumstantial, and the chart is about what has been confirmed. The red mark is not validated. I will remove it again if it appears. Epenthesis (talk) 04:02, 21 June 2009 (UTC)epenthesis


 * To satisfy you, I've changed the legend from "This person is revealed to be a killer in this episode." to "This person is revealed to be the killer in this episode." Wakefield should remain on the Chart regardless as he is a charter and if the two cops are on the Chart Wakefield stays on the Chart.70.24.45.233 (talk) 04:04, 21 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm fine with him remaining on the chart if (a) he isn't in bold, and (b) he doesn't have a red mark. He is not one of the 25 main suspects listed on the CBS website--to date, the only characters other than those 25 who have been added have been characters killed off. He's somewhat special, but the red mark should be reserved for the killer or killers from the main cast.Epenthesis (talk) 04:09, 21 June 2009 (UTC)epenthesis

That may be, but he killed the sherriff and it looks clear that he did. So a red square should go there, or at least some color saying that he did kill one of the characters on the chart.(talk) 21:23, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Why don't we just add a new color for perspective or assumed killer, and rename red as confirmed killer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.178.204.171 (talk) 05:35, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, that would work with me. I mean, in the episode that Malcom gets killed we see Wakefield killing someone, we should put a color for the people that have been shown to kill someone. Weather in flashback or present. I do have to say though, after watching the sheriff's death scene that I agree with Epenthesis, that Wakefield shouldnt get a red square, because I watch it and the person driving the truck was wearing the sherriff outfit, whereas Wakefeild was shown not wearing one.(talk) 14:31, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Wakefield
I've marked Wakefield as red as he was revealed to be "a" killer in episode 10 which according to the legend validates this marking70.24.45.233 (talk) 03:40, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

This change is valid according to the legend given below the chart. If one is to change this change that I've made, please also change the legend. Thank You.70.24.45.233 (talk) 03:48, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Wakefield is not confirmed to have killed anyone (even if it's likely), and he's not an official suspect. How difficult is this? He does not belong on the chart until he's killed or the show is over. Period. I will remove him as necessary until that point.Epenthesis (talk) 03:56, 21 June 2009 (UTC)epenthesis

Wakefield was the only one who could have killed the sheriff. Also, even if e didn't go out and personally kill each person, I think if he planned it then it is still his fault. I think we should add him as the killer but also add a color for an accomplice. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.58.74.136 (talk) 01:24, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Though it looked like Wakefield killed the sheriff, and probably did, we have no proof that he did. Throughout the episode that it shows the killer wearing a sheriff's outfit. It also shows the killer still wearing the sheriff outfit when he kills the sheriff, but when Wakefield comes into veiw he's not wearing one. even though he could of changed his clothes while Abby was coming from her room. And then there's the thing that that might not be Wakefield, and its his kid or something, so we don't even know if that is Wakfield.(talk) 14:46, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

cbs confirmed wakefield--Bob of Mars (talk) 23:01, 24 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Wakefield killed SIX PEOPLE prior to the show, then he killed Abby's father, then he directly killed three more on screen (possibly four) and caused a suicide. I think that classifies him as a killer.99.247.244.120 (talk) 12:03, 9 July 2009 (UTC)Right?

Abby
The death chart needs to include Henry as being killed in the last episode. It should also include Abby as a killer. While, these two facts are secondary, they are no less important to the outcome. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.139.16.68 (talk) 03:20, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Someone jus took my comment and updated the death chart, great! Now that I see it I have one further comment. Perhaps the red square for Abby should be half red and half white to say that he killed and survived. Right now it is not clear because the other killers end up dead. So, people can question "Abby killed, but did she get killed?" since there is no white block with her name. But, since it is the last episode you can't put the white box in the next episode column. So, a half white / half red block should work. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.139.16.68 (talk) 03:33, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Protection?
There seems to be an awful lot of activity on this page, and most of it seems to be people coming through and messing with the Death Chart, filling in random people as Dead or the Killer. Perhaps some protection on this page could be useful to cut down on this behavior? Mizery Made ( talk  ·  contribs ) 13:01, 19 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Thank you for the protection, Lectonar. Hopefully that cuts down on a lot of the issues this page has had. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 13:26, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Protection should have expired on July 13. Please, extend the period. (--Kodos77 (talk) 14:36, 20 July 2009 (UTC))

Character Pages
It has been said that we would only include in the death chart who dies. That we should not include self-inflicted deaths, or explain who killed who. It has been said if people want more info to check the character pages. Well, there are about a gazillion spelling mistakes there that have yet to be fixed. There are ASSUMPTIONS of who killed who, such as Henry killed Malcolm, which was NEVER clarified. Make up your mind. If you want us to look at the character pages, clean them up. Or otherwise, include self-inflicted deaths, and/or who killed who in the death chart... 24.224.170.188 (talk) 21:00, 24 July 2009 (UTC) RoshanMcG

Whap
Under the title "Plot", it says that each episode's title relates to the sound of a death of a person in that episode. In every case except for the first episode, the sound is that of the last death in the episode. Because the sound "Whap" could have been made just as easily by Uncle Marty getting hit with the head spade, and Uncle Maty's death is the last in that episode, I think the description for the episode "Whap" should be changed to "Whap: The sound of the head spade hitting Uncle Marty." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.206.82.100 (talk) 04:42, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Firstly, the weapon is never seen, so do we really know that it's a head spade?. Secondly, I don't really think either death involves a "Whap" sound. But Ben's is slightly more "Whap"-ish (had to invent a word there), so I say it stays. 99.247.244.120 (talk) 02:06, 12 July 2009 (UTC)T'was Henry


 * This is kind of the reason that I argue this list shouldn't even be included. Where is a source quoted anyone involved with the show stating that this is the logic behind the titles? Sure, it's something that makes sense, but we're putting something out there that may not necessarily be true. Even if we let that part float, the simple discussion of this shows that the more defined meanings of the titles can be classified as POV or Speculation or other such things. Mizery Made  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 03:36, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

According the the Harper's Globe wiki: "Whap is the first episode of Harper's Island. It was originally broadcast on April 9, 2009. The title refers to the sound made during the bifurcation of Marty Dunn." So he has a point. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Link McCloud (talk • contribs) 17:33, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

In the category of un-identified sounds, why does the "Snap" sound apply only to Sheriff Mills? Maggie Krell was also hung in that episode. Also, why does "Splash" apply to both Cal and Chloe? "Splash" is the sound Cal made AFTER he dies, not before. Chloe's death is a splash. Were these sounds also confirmed by Harper's Globe Wiki? Just wondering. 99.247.244.120 (talk) 15:34, 29 July 2009 (UTC)T'was Henry.

International Broadcast
The Portuguese regional title is "A Ilha". Can someone update, please. Regional mini-site for verification: http://www.fox.pt/a-ilha/home —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.139.98.143 (talk) 10:34, 4 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Added to the table Sirrontail (talk) 14:23, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

The series will start airing in Finland on September 3rd on Nelonen and the title has not been translated. (Zinfandel FIN (talk) 20:27, 19 July 2009 (UTC))

The series premiered in Argentina on May 13.(--Kodos77 (talk) 14:30, 20 July 2009 (UTC))

The series is about to be broadcasted in Greece starting from September, 9 on the SKAI channel. For verification browse in http://www.skai.gr/tv/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Elmina (talk • contribs) 20:07, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

Harper's Island on Youtube
I'm not sure if it's mentioned anywhere but I thought somebody who knows how to do it can put this link in the external links area. It's for Full episodes of Harper's Island on youtube. http://www.youtube.com/show?p=b2EIe-XTad4

Can any of the registered editors of this page consider this link? Or at least comment on why it shouldn't be added. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.10.97.65 (talk) 04:28, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

If its not an official link from CBS/Viacom then it is a copyright violation and cannot be placed here for that reason. Ejfetters (talk) 07:16, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Archive?
Perhaps it's time to think about archiving this talk page. It's grown entirely too big, and making comments to several sections (like I just did) can take ages to submit, even on "decent" internet. There's discussion here too, from very early in the airing stages, so seeing as how the show has completed airing in a couple markets (Canada & US, maybe others?), perhaps it's time to move these discussions elsewhere and create a nearly fresh slate to discuss improving this article from here, forward. However, I've never done a talk page archive, so if someone else more experienced in that field feels the same way, perhaps you could do this? Mizery Made ( talk  ·  contribs ) 03:42, 13 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree! Would you suggest archiving the whole page, or only up to a certain date? How about up to and including 31 July (i.e., up to and including Character Pages)? Thanks! — SpikeToronto (talk) 05:21, 13 August 2009 (UTC)