Talk:Helios/Archive 1

Reference
Under Notes 2. "helios Online Etymology Dictionary" is listed. Is it now acceptable to use any unscientific reference? Just because someone put it on the internet? So how do we know if an etymology dictionary is a credible work? You look up 'circle'. If it talks about Latin and/or French origin, the author is a dummy. For 'circle' is a Sumerian origin word as you'll find it documented in prof. Anton Deimel's Sumerisch-Akkadisches Glossar, (published Rome, 1937) under sign 42 'GAR' and 142 'KAR'. Further, sign 199 'KILILU' or 'KIRILU' means ring. Understanding that 'circle' is really 'kirkle' the origin is quite obvious even for a layman. Some backyard 'scientist' proclaims his garbage and it is spread all over the world as fact. PLEASE stop doing that. Please erase the 'etymology' part, it is incorrect.

Not to be confused with Helios, the god of "sun"
I'm pretty sure the ancients did confuse him with Apollo, and thereby make Apollo god of the sun per se, though it would make sense if it was through such a connection.

...In fact, thinking about it, that Artemis, who had to do with things like hunting, later became goddess of the moon pretty much guarantees that there was a full conflation. So I'm changing the above passage.


 * I agree with you. Apollo largely supplanted Helios' role in later Greek society, and took over essentially his whole portfolio. Tokerboy 20:21 Dec 10, 2002 (UTC)


 * There may have been links, but to suggest that Apollo completely subsumed Helios shows a distinct lack of acknowledgment of the ancient sources. To suggest such an identification would mean ignoring just why there were distinct difference in icnographic styles between Helios and Apollo? Both are almost instantly recognisable, and instantly differentiated. Why there were different temples? Why different priesthoods? Why different roles and functions? The whole idea of Apollo-Helios is an unfortunate by product from classical scholarship from the 19th century that was utterly obsessed with theories of the development of monotheism (and hence "proving" the superiority of the Christian faith) despite all evidence to the contrary.


 * Have some respect... ancients knew what they did, and why...to claim that they were confused at this point in history is an unthinkable degradation of... who else? but yourself... tokerboy.


 * I think this article shuld be devided. Artist


 * Isn't Helios also a spacecraft? They were launched in 1974 and 1975 to orbit and measure the Sun. They also set the speed record for spacecraft at 252,800 km/h. There were two of them. Helios 1 and 2.


 * Correctamundo. I have added a page for the Helios probes and also a French satellite, the Helios 1B, and linked to them from the Helios (disambiguation) page.  akaDruid 09:04, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC)


 * "Many believe that Apollo becomes the Olympian "sun god", but this idea is mostly based on speculation and assumption." This was entered 18:45, 24 April 2005 by User:12.214.203.120 and let stand. . --10:01, 10 March 2006 (UTC)


 * My issue is that in Ovid's Metamorphoses, the story of Phaeton says that his father is "Phoebus". Can someone explain? Only dead fish go with the flow. (talk) 00:57, 25 November 2008 (UTC)AsterSelene


 * "Phoebus" is an epithet used in common (at least, in poetry) for both Helios and Apollo (although this should not be taken as indicating full assimilation of the two). 128.205.73.127 (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2008 (UTC)

Modern Greek pronunciation
EY-lee-os?

Does the Halo that Helios has (which pretty clearly represents the Sun) have any precidents, or is this the first time one is recorded with a deity? Is it also the source of the christian halo's, as there seems to be some transition between the Greek and Christian traditions? Does this imply that the 'power' behind christian iconography is pagan sun worship?


 * The connection is indirect. In literature (e.g. the C6th BC Homeric Hymns), Greek gods are described shining with a bright light. In art history, however, the halo first only appears as the sun's aureole (with spikes representing sunbeams). This device was developed in Roman times into the halo we are familiar with and was used for gods in general (from Aphrodite to Poseidon in mosaics). It was from this tradition in Greco-roman art that the Christian device was adopted, to signify divine (rather than solar) light. Theranos 15:24, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

"Consorts/Children"
These empty lists of consorts and children appended to all the Greek mythology articles offer no context, no sources, and so are rendered meaningless. --Wetman 07:09, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Does anyone know how the html to render a long list in two columns? That will improve at least the look of this list. --Wetman 19:23, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

"Sacred" animals
"The rooster and white horse were sacred to the god." This statement does not represent any feature of Greek religion, which held no "sacred" animals; the red cattle of the sun appear in myth, not in daily life. Some herds do seem to be consecrated to gods in Mycenaean Linear B tallies. I've moved it here. Horse-sacrifice was not a Greek feature, and as a numinous animal, a white horse would betoken the presence of Poseidon, not Helios. The chicken was a late arrival in mainland Greece, but by the fifth century it was a suitable gift  to a young lad from an erastes. Can anyone source any Hellene cultus of Helios?--Wetman 19:23, 16 July 2007 (UTC) --Wetman 19:23, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
 * The cattle of the sun are described as white by Apollonius of Rhodes in his Argonautika, iv.964-979 Can someone cite something for the red color? Geryon's cattle are red, and there is the red heifer of Jewish tradition, but I don't know of any reference to the cattle of the sun being red. --Eponymous-Archon (talk) 17:22, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

Typo?
"In Greek mythology the sun was personified as Helius (Greek: Ήλιος). Homer often calls him Titan and Hyperion."

is "Helius" a typo?
 * No, it's a Latinised spelling of Helios.--Wetman 04:55, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Caution
Vandals are furtively changing the section numbers in the cited references. Editors who edit vandalized versions are likely to find their good-faith-but-irresponsible edits reverted when a good version is restored. Don't edit vandalized text without looking over the recent edit history.--Wetman (talk) 09:28, 9 December 2008 (UTC) error/sol invictus is a roman name for apollo, apollo's history is clearly an error in the historical records, Helio is named as sun god as found in the historical records. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 166.217.140.68 (talk) 02:33, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

OK Was SunDay a special day for worship of Helios?
Sunday dasy of the sun Was it a special day to worship Helios .Or ????Thanks!Andreisme (talk) 01:05, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
 * No. The Sunday page will go into more detail. Spartan198 (talk) 07:34, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Spelling Typo?
The article has the spelling of his name as 'Ἥλιος'. Doesn't it start with 'Ή' (IPA /hɛː́/), not 'Ἥ' (IPA /ɛː́/)? I didn't want to make the change without some input first. ...there's not really a lot of documentation on the ancient lettering. 66.65.94.53 (talk) 03:13, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Halios
in Doric Greek. Böri (talk) 14:29, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

No mention of Helios = Saturn
There exists sources on the net that assert that Helios was once the name given to Cronos or Saturn. Archaic copies of Plato's Timaeus and Diodorus are cited. Perhaps we could check out these references and add something about this in the article? I don't have more to go on than what anyone will get when searching for these terms in combination. __meco (talk) 15:53, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

The Sun is a place, thus capitalized as a proper noun
It's no different from Mars or Nebraska. See Sun. However, sunlight is not capitalized, and I'm not sure about sun-god. Perhaps not if hyphenated, but perhaps so if not: Sun god. S B Harris 17:04, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Helios in the Synagogue?
Helios in the Synagogue. Was there some kind of syncretism back then? Komitsuki (talk) 10:27, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

Various mothers
The introductory paragraph claims Helios to have 'various mothers', then seems to back up this claim by citing two different names from different sources - Theia and Euryphaessa. The problem is that Theia and Euryphaessa are both names for the same Titan according to the wikipedia article on Theia, Euryphaessa even redirects to Theia. Euryphaessa seems to be a nickname for Theia. Shouldn't this be re-worded or clarified? 80.1.159.196 (talk) 10:11, 15 December 2014 (UTC)


 * Theia and Euryphaessa are the same character. It seems the reference to the two mothers has been clarified. ICE77 (talk) 06:15, 17 February 2018 (UTC)