Talk:Henri Farman

Untitled
his first name is Henri (and not Henry)

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This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 06:57, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

By what name is Farman better known?
Almost all references to H. Farman I have read before refer to him as "Henri Farman". The first two documents I have ever seen that refer to him as Henry are his obituary in Flight Magazine's archive and this article, both of which I have first seen within the past hour.

Farman was born in France, spent most of his life there, and became a French citizen in 1937, but he was apparently born a Briton and had British citizenship before that. As such, it is most likely that his birth certificate would name him Henri while his British passport (when he had one) would name him Henry.

But by what name is he better known? I believe that is the criterion for the name of the article. How would we find out, so that we may know whether the article should be moved or not?

Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 20:07, 30 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Google "Henry Farman site:archive.org" gives 4700 results
 * Google "Henri Farman site:archive.org" gives 1550 results
 * Many of the results are the same books as even within the same book both names are used. Example: mentions Henri Farman 3 times and Henry Farman 9 times.
 * --NJR_ZA (talk) 21:40, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

He would be Henry in English-speaking countries and Henri in France. The Wilhem/William difference comes to mind. Drutt (talk) 23:01, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, but no-one ever mentions Kaiser William, even if he was Queen Victoria's nephew. Sincerely, SamBlob (talk) 01:10, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
 * He was "Kaiser Bill" in the days when he was still well-regarded in England. William/Wilhelm are the same name. Drutt (talk) 07:33, 1 November 2009 (UTC)


 * He would be Henry in English speaking countries if Henry was was his given/chosen name, or if the speaker/writer was too lazy/bigoted to ask/learn his correct name. Renaming was an habitual British Empire trait. Willy's granny ensured that he was treated with full/(too much) respect until he wasn't.


 * I think the article should be switched to Henri Farman with the redirect page at 'Henry Farman'. The article should show both names with a note (<.r.ef group="n" ... .{.{reflist|group=n}.}. ) added that Henry first appeared in the obits. Autodidactyl (talk) 14:57, 31 October 2009 (UTC)


 * It's not "renaming" since Henry/Henri are different spellings of the same name. They aren't even pronounced differently, as is the case with William/Wilhelm. Drutt (talk) 07:33, 1 November 2009 (UTC)


 * they are only "aren't even pronounced differently" by those who are ignorant of French pronunciation. Speaking louder (HENRY) does not constitute speaking French. Autodidactyl (talk) 08:46, 1 November 2009 (UTC)


 * How far do you want to take this crusade? Do you also intend to get Henry I of France, Joan of Arc and John I of France changed to Henri Ier de France, Jeanne d'Arc and Jean Ier de France? Drutt (talk) 14:39, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

English sources use both spellings, French and other language sources use Henri almost exclusively. The greater weight is on the side of Henri. Charles Harvard Gibbs-Smith, the great English historian, spells it Henry here, but gives Henri first in his 1960 book. Walter J. Boyne spells it Henri for the Smithsonian Institution. Richard P. Hallion spells it Henri. The English world is split on the subject, opening the door for his birth spelling to be the primary article title. Binksternet (talk) 17:13, 15 October 2010 (UTC)


 * The fact that he was 63 when he assumed French nationality means that he was officially British throughout his whole productive life as an aviation pioneer! It therefore seems odd that the lead paragraph he is referred to as French (albeit born of British parents). Are there any sources by Farman e.g. books, letters to Flight, etc. which would clarify the issue? --TraceyR (talk) 07:09, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
 * His contemporary Claude Grahame-White refers to him as Henry in his 1911 book here. FWIW. --TraceyR (talk) 07:13, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
 * A picture of his gravestone (here) shows the name Henry. However, since the original question was "by what name is Farman better known", the Google results just now of 17,700 for "Henry Farman" and 25,500 for "Henri Farman" suggest the latter.--TraceyR (talk) 13:24, 17 November 2010 (UTC)


 * A 1969 re-print of a 1909 news item calling him 'Henry Farman' in Flight here:  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.150.11.216 (talk) 17:41, 24 March 2016 (UTC)