Talk:Hilo, Hawaii

The picture located on this page is actually a picture of downtown Waikiki, HI. It is not an acurate picture of Hilo, HI.

Sugar Town Foodscapes
SUGAR TOWN
 * Lyon Arboretum
 * Watermark Publishing:

Hawai´i Plantation Days Remembered
 * by Yasushi Scotch Kurisu (7" x 10", 112 pp.)
 * Softcover, perfect bound :: ISBN 0-9705787-1-7

The Big Island's Hilo Coast was the classic plantation community RJBurkhart 21:22, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Physical Oceanography
What does Hilo have to do with Physical Oceanography? If you restore the category link, please give a reason here. Sowelilitokiemu 20:09, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Pronunciation
I'm puzzled by the pronunciation [ˈhiːlɛʊ] given, specifically the final syllable. Should it read [ˈhiːloʊ]? Sdoerr 14:36, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
 * It should. I corrected it. --Targeman 17:59, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Who says it like that? I always heard it [ˈhi.lo], as in Hawaiian (which is, of course, where it comes from). The only exceptions to this that I know come from some recent American arrivals and tourists. In Pidgin, which must be the majority pronunciation, it is also non-diphthongal. I'll change it for now, pending any convincing argumentation to the contrary. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.150.247.92 (talk) 07:03, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Presumably then is the Hawaiian-language pronunciation and  the English.  We are allowed to include both if they're different, and it seems odd to link  to the English IPA key when that key doesn't include a monophthongal . Lfh (talk) 16:14, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree with the above: is by far the more common pronunciation in Hilo, even among English speakers. I would encourage English speakers everywhere to use that as their target. English phonology can accommodate loaned sounds, and anyway, the varieties of English spoken in Hilo have been influenced by Hawaiian. So  is not only the proper Hawaiian pronunciation, but an acceptable - and I would argue preferable - English one too.
 * Also /ˈhiːloʊ/ is not a pronunciation. It is a phonemic transcription. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.1.84.240 (talk) 12:57, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

City Status
So the Hawaii page says Honolulu is the only city in Hawaii, and this page refers to Hilo as a city at least twice. Could someone explain the discrepancy? -Laikalynx 14:35, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Honolulu is incorporated where as Hilo is an unincorporated city. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.105.133.219 (talk) 03:12, 6 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I would guess that the article calls Hilo a city in the sense of "an urban area with dense population", not in a governmental sense. Honolulu is somewhat different: although there's a CDP of Honolulu (somewhat similiar to that of Hilo), all of Oahu is part of the City and County of Honolulu.  Nyttend 04:51, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Is Hilo not an inhabited urban area of a dense population? Is it not "the second largest city in the state", "the southernmost city in the United States", "the wettest city"? Obviously it is not an incorporated city or technically classified by the U.S. census as a city, but it was not even technically classified as a "census-designated place" for most of the existence of the city so it is not only obscurantist to define it as a census-designated place but outright false for the totality of "Hilo". —Centrx→talk &bull; 21:50, 13 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Hawaii says that it's not a city, so it's not a city. I don't see how it matters that Hilo wasn't a CDP until 1980; it is now, and therefore it is outright true to define it as a census-designated place.  Nyttend (talk) 22:42, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
 * The English language says it is a city. This is an encyclopedia in the English language, not a government census. Hilo is not incorporated as a city, but it is nevertheless accurate and clear to describe it as a city, perhaps an "unincorporated city"? It matters that Hilo was not a CDP until 1980 because "census-designated place" is a term invented in 1980, which did not exist before and at any time may be changed again for the purposes of the U.S. Census. It would then suddenly cease to be true not because of any change in city--the unincorporated city was the same unincorporated city the day before and the day after the designation changed--but because the language was changed. It is fine for the Census to invent terms which clarify its statistics, but the English language is not determined by government decree. So, it is both theoretically more accurate to call it a city, and practically more helpful to any reader trying to understand what this place is. (Note that "unincorporated city" is fine because a) corporation is a rather basic concept with a long history in the language, its meaning is independent of a government release; and b) "city" remains clearly in the phrase.) —Centrx→talk &bull; 01:44, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, "city" is actually much more precise than "census-designated place". A census-designated place is not necessary a real urban center, it may e.g. be a military base; and a census-designated place may actually cover, intersect, or include an incorporated place. Even if Hawaii called it a "city", the U.S. Census might still call it a "census-designated place", and then we would be conflicted because different government entities call it different things, not because there is any confusion in reality. —Centrx→talk &bull; 01:50, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I might call a community of 40000 people a town; how do you know that it's really a city and not a town? Are you desirous of changing Russell Springs, Kansas away from being a city, since the common definition of "city" doesn't include communities of 32 people, or Hempstead, New York| away from a village, because communities of 52000 people aren't often called villages?  Wikipedia uses official designations because they're verifiable, and because local government (or lack thereof) can reliably be sourced.  If the language changes one day, Wikipedia's language should change, because Wikipedia is based on what the sources say, not on the editors' feelings about whether those sources "seem" right.  Nyttend (talk) 09:39, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
 * The local government refers to Hilo as a city, as do books, maps, and newspapers. See Website of the State of Hawaii. See Google Books: city hilo; compare Google Books: hilo "census-designated place". "Census-designated place" is a word invented for the specific purposes of the U.S. Census and used elsewhere only in reference to it. —Centrx→talk &bull; 00:52, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Regardless, Hilo is not a city. There is but one city in Hawaii: Honolulu.  Nyttend (talk) 01:27, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Every source, including the one you pretended above was so important--the local government--disagrees with you. If you believe as you said above that Wikipedia is based on what the sources say not the editors' feelings about what seems right, then your course of action is clear.
 * Also, the word "city" is not confined to corporations with mayors. The primary definitions in both the Oxford English Dictionary and Webster are a "a large town", or an inhabited place with "a title ranking above that of ‘town’". I am not wed to the word "city", but "census-designated place" is inappropriate. Encarta has "community", but that is a wishy-washy term that does not really apply to an inhabited place of 55 square miles and 40,000 people most of whom are not going to know each other. —Centrx→talk &bull; 01:46, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

[unindent] Throughout Wikipedia, municipality and other community articles for the USA have their "statuses" determined by the legal standing of those municipalities and other communities. Hilo is not legally a city; regardless of broad usage as listed in those various places, it must not be listed as a city in order to comply with municipalities and other communities nationwide. Nyttend (talk) 02:55, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Has this been discussed anywhere? The standard everywhere else on Wikipedia is neutral point of view and verifiability in reliable sources, and this is no exception. You seem to be grasping at whatever argument you can conceive to label this city a "census-designated place", and then when your argument is proven invalid you invent a new one. —Centrx→talk &bull; 03:17, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
 * To the contrary: you have no official sources that it's a city. Casual references such as these aren't definitive; otherwise, we could call any Kansas city a town, because a state-run agency says that they are.  Similarly, what would you say about the village of Hempstead, New York, with nearly half again as many people as Hilo and a denser population than Los Angeles or Boston?  Finally, going for the lexical definition: when legal standing (such as that of being a city) is involved, the official governmental designation has to be followed, as a contravention of the legal definition cannot possibly be right.  Nyttend (talk) 12:48, 17 May 2008 (UTC)


 * If you look at the state of Hawaii search page I linked, maps published by the Hawaii County Department of Public Works and official meteorological publications, among others, call it a "city". Official publications also call it a "town". None call it a "census-designated place" except specifically for demographic data obtained from the U.S. Census Bureau. None of the examples you give, whether Kansas cities, New York villages, or major national cities, should be described in Wikipedia primarily or throughout as a "census-designated place".
 * Also, in general, legal declarations are often fickle, contradictory, and designed to rigidly classify than to describe; they are more casual than the meanings of words. It is far better to follow the established wisdom of thousands of years and dedicated intellects than to follow the latest legalisms promulgated by an over-worked legislature--and more people understand the established words, which is the purpose of language in the first place. —Centrx→talk &bull; 18:49, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
 * My point with the other communities was specifically to answer your objections above: to say that those places should be called what they were, not to say that they were CDPs. As far as legal designations: they don't change much.  When you get to local government, changing is very inconvenient; imagine if (assuming you're in the mainland USA) your state decided to declare that all municipalities were suddenly "burgs"; even if the way they functioned was no different, the paperwork would be immense.  Because local government is a creature of the state, a state cannot be incorrect when it declares that a specific government is a specific type; therefore, anything in conflict with the designation (including the Census Bureau; see Harrogate vs. Harrogate-Shawanee, Tennessee) isn't reliable for that purpose.  Nyttend (talk) 00:30, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
 * While it is generally okay that ordinary words like "city", "town", or "village" are currently the standards for state governments, we should not change from them if those state governments were to suddenly invent new terms like "census-designated place", which was invented fairly recently. Town seems to make sense in this case; it does not step on the toes of the the Hawaii state government declaring that there is Only One City in Hawaii. —Centrx→talk &bull; 07:38, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

removed ", including a U.S. Courthouse"
Under the government section, I changed "Hilo is home to county, state, and federal offices, including a U.S. Courthouse." to "Hilo is home to county, state, and federal offices." Although the "Federal Building, U.S. Post Office, and Courthouse" at Hilo, HI exists, the building is no longer a U.S. Courthouse nor is it used as a courthouse. So to say it IS home to a U.S. Courthouse is misleading. Perhaps it WAS home to a U.S. Courthouse may be correct, but that can be done by someone else. Here's my reference.

http://gsa.gov/Portal/gsa/ep/contentView.do?programId=9593&channelId=-17573&ooid=19383&contentId=21011&pageTypeId=8169&contentType=GSA_BASIC&programPage=%2Fep%2Fprogram%2FgsaBasic.jsp&P=PMHP

64.75.136.234 (talk) 00:29, 13 May 2008 (UTC)SMtg


 * Yes, I put some info on the civic buildings that are on the NRHP, see U.S. Post Office and Office Building (Hilo, Hawaii) W Nowicki (talk) 19:31, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Hilo district
If we get around to making a separate article for the North and South Hilo district, I have made to highlight the section of the island and uploaded it to commons. Perhaps it will be needed eventually, but I feel it really doesn't work for the Hilo, Hawaii article... --Travis Thurston+ 07:02, 21 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Agreed, not high priority, but I would say split off the "points of interest" and some History, perhaps climate and geography into a Hilo District article (for both North and South, the divisions are for county government representation). Keep demographic info here for the CDP. W Nowicki (talk) 19:31, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

vandalism magnet?
Does it make sense to semi-protect this page, since it seems to mostly vandalism edits going on? W Nowicki (talk) 21:04, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * What's annoying is that the vandalism is enough spaced out that we'd essentially have to semiprotect it permanently; it's important enough for non-autoconfirmed users to be able to edit that we really shouldn't do that, so it's better just to block revert and warn. Nyttend (talk) 22:11, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

The addition of Ryan Higa to notable residents
In my opinion this should be followed up in favor of. He is equally as famous and well known as many of the people already on the list and arguably more so over people such as Gerald Okamura. Regarding wp:note he fits the needed criteria for notability (for as much as can be said from a policy based on notable articles than notable people). -WingsGoesWiki (talk) 07:39, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Disagree - Higa does not have his own article here on WP and his inclusion does not meet the criteria for notability. If the argument is that nigahiga has so many subscribers on youtube, I'd point to policy WP:THISNUMBERISHUGE. According to wikipedia history here, people have tried to add a bio article before and it was deleted every time... --Travis Thurston+ 20:50, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Disagree :3 After much studying of the WP's TT provided, it's obvious that Ryan Higa cannot be added because he doesn't have his own article, and the members of Nigahiga themselves are numerous. *Feels most stupid* -WingsGoesWiki (talk) 21:46, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Agree - If Ryan Higa cannot be added, why not add "Members of Nigahiga"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 113.151.39.202 (talk) 14:11, 23 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Disgree - Ryan Higa does have his own wikipedia page. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigahiga so why should he not be added? Violetnhz (talk) 10:19, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment: Nigahiga is an article about a youtube channel, not about Ryan Higa... Beyond the fact that a channel he created has a lot of viewers on youtube, (see WP:THISNUMBERISHUGE) his notability as anything else is just nonexistent. As stated above, once there is an actual article built about him and not the channel, we can add him as a notable resident. See article that has been deleted. --Travis Thurston+ 21:04, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

Is "Hilo, Hawaii" a necessary title?
Since the city of Honolulu's article does not carry a "Hawaii" dab for having the best known use of that name, I suggest this article should be moved to Hilo, over the redirect already in place there, for the same reason. Plus, is Hilo a town or a city? -- 92.8.125.36 (talk) 16:31, 17 December 2010 (UTC)


 * The stye is to append the state unless it is one of the few large cities in a specific list, see Naming conventions (geographic names). To answer your question, legally it is neither, but a "Census Designated Place". There are no incorporated cities in Hawaii. Honolulu comes the closest, but it too is a county government, just given the odd name City and County of Honolulu. As for informal usage, both "city" and "town" are commonly used. W Nowicki (talk) 18:43, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Hilo Box Image
I switched the box picture with one that is more recent and more pleasing. It is the skyline of Hilo as you would see it from the only real place where you can actually see the 'skyline' of our town (the other is the scenic point from Hamakua Coast Road, and I can try to take a shot from there as well. While we don't have a 'skyline' per se, one of the most interesting views is this view with the Niu (coconut) trees that are planted along Bayfront Drive. You can change/switch the picture back to the other shot if you would like, it's located just down the page I think the new picture captures the view of Hilo town that most people know/see and it is more pleasing visually. Also, it was taken just last week. Feel free to change. Thank you AlaskaDave (talk) 08:07, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I like the new picture. It does give a nice context of how the town sits in the setting. The old one was probably taken through an airplane window, so even though I tried to adjust the color, it was still not very good quality (although it does show the harbor nicely and town layout - if someone has another chance to do one from above that would be helpful). The suggestion I have for your photo is to crop out the uninteresting parts. I can do that in five minutes if you don't mind. For that matter, it is probably time to edit down the photos on this page since there are too many. The layout is broken for me, and I get a bug ugly white space in the middle of the article. This is not a photo album web site but an encyclopedia. Perhaps some of the 1956 era could go. The other long-standing project would be to split into two articles, one on the town and one on the district. There would need to be enough cited encyclopedic material to justify both of them, but it seems the way to go in the long run. W Nowicki (talk) 15:42, 28 August 2013 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed
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Education
I changed "There is also Connections Public Charter School located in downtown Hilo serving primary and secondary students." to read "There are also various charter schools in the area serving primary and secondary students.".

It seemed odd to pick out one charter school by name and not others. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.1.84.240 (talk) 12:40, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

silly thing
I do not have permissions to fix anything on Vladimir Putin's page (for obvious reasons)

However there is a typo there... just thought it'd be fun to do my part to improve the page by fixing the typo.

So... someone with more permissions than me can do it.

... of the corruption schemes persecuted in France."

I'm pretty sure that should be "prosecuted" in France.

That's all.

Goodbye.

Bnwwcs (talk) 21:37, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Civic Technology
— Assignment last updated by Farouk Najjar (talk) 06:50, 11 October 2022 (UTC)