Talk:History of ethanol fuel in Brazil

More carbon emissions
"One couldn’t pick a worse place to harvest cane than Brazil’s Atlantic rainforest. There, sugar cane crops have led to deforestation and, paradoxically, more carbon emissions."

"Brazil now ranks fourth in the world in carbon emissions, and most of its emissions come from deforestation.... the basic problem with most biofuels is amazingly simple, given that researchers have ignored it until now: using land to grow fuel leads to the destruction of forests, wetlands and grasslands that store enormous amounts of carbon. Backed by billions in investment capital, this alarming phenomenon is replicating itself around the world. Indonesia has bulldozed and burned so much wilderness to grow palm oil trees for biodiesel that its ranking among the world's top carbon emitters has surged from 21st to third according to a report by Wetlands International.... Deforestation accounts for 20% of all current carbon emissions.... no one checked whether the crops would ultimately replace vegetation and soils that sucked up even more carbon. It was as if the science world assumed biofuels would be grown in parking lots. The deforestation of Indonesia has shown that's not the case. It turns out that the carbon lost when wilderness is razed overwhelms the gains from cleaner-burning fuels. A study by University of Minnesota ecologist David Tilman concluded that it will take more than 400 years of biodiesel use to "pay back" the carbon emitted by directly clearing peat lands to grow palm oil; clearing grasslands to grow corn for ethanol has a payback period of 93 years. The result is that biofuels increase demand for crops, which boosts prices, which drives agricultural expansion, which eats forests. Searchinger's study concluded that overall, corn ethanol has a payback period of about 167 years because of the deforestation it triggers.... biofuels aren't part of the solution at all. They're part of the problem."

Is there any reason this should not be included prominently? &mdash; Cup co  00:51, 28 September 2012 (UTC)


 * This article is about ethanol produced using sugarcane, not about biodiesel (palm oil), not about corn ethanol, not about Indonesia. Also be aware that this is a Good Article rated article, and all content is supported by reliable sources, not opinions or editorial pieces (the Brazilian Altantic rainforest was deforested a long time ago, not due to sugarcane crops). As a GA all content not supported by reliable sources or editorial pieces pushing a non NPOV will be promptly removed.--Mariordo (talk) 01:57, 28 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Unless someone adds something about the carbon emissions caused by rain forest clear-cutting, then it does not meet WP:GACR 3(a) "addresses the main aspects of the topic" and 4 "represents viewpoints fairly and without bias" and should be delisted. What is your source for the implication that deforestation is not still occuring? According to Deforestation in Brazil, as late as 2005 Brazil still had the most rapid deforestation of any country. Why do you think those articles are editorial? They are WP:SECONDARY fact reporting from the past five years. &mdash; Cup co  02:11, 28 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Please produce reliable sources, preferably academic peer-reviewed research results demonstrating your claim. The article already has several independent research results showing otherwise. Current deforestation is not being driving by sugarcane crops. Please check the facts and stop pushing your POV. Both EPA and CARB have rated Brasilian sugarcane as an advance biofuel.--Mariordo (talk) 02:15, 28 September 2012 (UTC)
 * To which sources "showing otherwise" are you referring? &mdash; Cup co  02:18, 28 September 2012 (UTC)

Mariordo, this is my fault for not realizing that this is not a main article. I see now that Ethanol fuel in Brazil covers the issue well and with reliable sources. Please accept my apology. &mdash; Cup co  23:59, 28 September 2012 (UTC)

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