Talk:Hocking College/Archive 1

Hocking College graduation rate
"Hocking College is working hard to increase its notoriously low graduation rate"

I hope this is not too embarrassing. What is the graduation rate?

Wanderer57 23:32, 1 November 2007 (UTC)


 * According to the State of Ohio, Hocking College's graduation rate is an abysmal 17.2%, the lowest in Ohio or indeed anywhere in the northeast United States. Several explanations have been given for this rate, many of them centering on whether Hocking is a "real" college in any meaningful sense of the word. The college accepts all applicants in order to get as much money as possible from the state. Unfortunately, most of the students are locals (despite the bragging points of "all 88 counties" and "24 nations"), and the local student population consists of Appalachian people who are very right-wing, intolerant, and do not hold education as a value. Many of them dress in cowboy hats and western dusters and drive pickup trucks that display Confederate flags.
 * In order to understand the problem, you have to understand that 25% of Ohio is Appalachian--22 out of 88 counties, as officially designated by the federal government.
 * However, the problem does not end with the students. The college has always been dreadfully mismanaged. While the students are right-wing (there is even a unit of the KKK in Nelsonville, which is often referred to as "Nelsontucky"), the administrators are liberal holdovers from the 60s, more interested in making the students feel good than in educating them. Thus, there is a revolving door for complaints against any instructor who is actually trying to teach. Many quality instructors have been driven off campus for giving students the grades they deserved. This is frowned upon because it leads to high dropout rates, and high dropout rates lead to lower enrollment, which means less state money for the college.
 * The man now being investigated, Xxxx Xxxxx, was investigated by the state for malfeasance in the 1990s. Somehow, on a salary of $100,000 per annum, he has amassed luxury vacation homes throughout the northeast United States. Even now, his underlings, the vice presidents and deans, are salivating over the prospects that he will be perp-walked off the campus, allowing each of them to go up in rank and power.
 * None of this, of course, serves the students or the teachers. A wonderful African American man, Xxxxx Xxxxxx, having taught Police Science on the campus for many years, could not even walk about that campus, because drunken local "hilljacks" from the student body would drive by in their pickups, Confederate flags flying, and scream "Nigger!" at him. The bureaucrats, busy feathering their own careers and putting pressure on teachers to teach five or six courses per term (thus making the teachers ineffective) have never done anything to address the endemic racism in the student body.
 * But now it looks like all of the big lids and little lids are finally going to blow off. There are several investigations--the higher-up who put his mistress on the payroll in the early 90s, the male instructors who have impregnated students, the administrator who kept a "dirty book" full of gossip and allegations and then was terrified of being blackmailed when the book was stolen, the married teachers who have had adulterous sex with each other (sometimes in offices), and then the killings--Hocking College has a murder rate that's every bit as high as its graduation rate is low. For the past fifteen years or more, there's been a case almost every year of a student murdering a fellow student, usually drunken "hilljacks" shotgunning or stabbing their gilfriends.
 * All told, it's an ugly environment, and nothing until now has been done to address all of these terrible problems. The nursing program is typical--all that matters is growth, and poorly prepared instructors are sent into the satellite campuses in the hinterlands, where poor medical practices are taught without adequate supervision. If you doubt that this is true, consider the email that was sent to all staff this morning, which demonstrates the desperation of finding warm bodies to staff the program with as minimal qualifications as possible:
 * From--Human Resources (personnel@hocking.edu)
 * To--allstaff@hocking.edu
 * Date--Fri, 2 Nov 2007 14:32:11 -0500
 * Subject--Job Posting
 * The following positions are open at Hocking College--
 * NURSING CLINICAL INSTRUCTORS (Quarterly Contract) – Hocking College is accepting applications for part-time obstetrics nursing clinical instructor in the Chillicothe and Marietta areas. Under the direct supervision of the Dean, responsibilities include Provides instructional services; Performs academic advising activities; Engages in continuous professional development. Position Requirements BSN in Nursing, MSN preferred Current active licensure as a registered nurse in Ohio; At least two years experience in nursing as a registered nurse.
 * Hocking College staff who are interested in applying for the above position should submit an updated resume to the Human Resources Office by November 9, 2007. Hockingtruth 19:13, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Criminal Investigation
This section of article was deleted due to Wikipedia Policy on reports about living persons.

One reference was given. It did not document the "investigations", the "house ownership", or the "Senior VP" mentioned in the section deleted. Wanderer57 16:47, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

(I also dropped the FBI link as it related only to the deleted section. Wanderer57 16:51, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * There are about ten sources out there for the information. Yes, a criminal investigation is actually being conducted. Rather than just delete the truth, the thing for you to do is go to Google News and put the sources into the article. Just gutting an article out of lack of attention is not the solution. Also, BLP has to be applied across the board. You can't just apply it to some articles but not others. Hockingtruth 17:20, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Hi Hockingtruth: I'm sorry if I did not explain fully enough. There is a Wikipedia policy involved here that is not really negotiable.


 * QUOTING THE POLICY: "Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material—whether negative, positive, or just questionable—about living persons should be removed immediately and without discussion from Wikipedia articles, talk pages, user pages, and project space."


 * The onus is on people putting information into the article to document it. If there are ten sources out there, it should not be too difficult.


 * Based on your name, you know a lot more about Hocking College than I ever will. Wanderer57 17:58, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

C I Section still needs better sources
The section had specific, seemingly factual statements, without good sources. If there are news sources for the statements, fine. But the three sources given did not cover all the points. The following is meant to indicate the sort of specific information that is currently missing.

August 2007 - It has been announced that the College is under investigation by the Ohio State Attorneys' office, and the Federal Bureau of Investigation.


 * Announced how, by who, what day? was there a news report?

According to numerous local and national press reports, ETC, ETC


 * Give reference for some of these news reports.

Specific targets of the investigation are the ______________ and __________.


 * Where did it say that?

It is alleged that ______used money ETC ETC


 * Who alleged that?? Was it only the newspaper that made allegations?

In addition to investigations by the FBI and Attorney General, the Ohio Ethics Commission is now investigating ETC


 * Did the Commission announce this? Is there a news release maybe?

Wanderer57 19:29, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

The Truth About Hocking College's Rates (Graduation, Murder & Nursing State Board Exams):

Some incorrect stats
Taken directly from The Ohio Board of Regents Performance Report for Ohio's Colleges and Universities, 2006: Institutional Outcomes Measures (p. 77): Hocking College 2002 Entering Cohort Full-time students: 1,140 Total 3 year success rate: 52%

According to Hocking College Police Department Crime Statistics, as reported to the US Department of Education, there has never been a murder on the Hocking College campus.

Nursing State Board Exams (NCLEX Scores)report that: Hocking College 10/1/06 - 9/30/07 Practical Nursing Graduates was 98.19% (Ohio was 92.04%, US was 87.36%) Hocking College 10/1/06 - 9/30/06 Registered Nursing Graduates was 93.75% (Ohio was 86.56%, US was 85.74%)198.30.5.211 15:40, 13 November 2007 (UTC)


 * "Three-year success rate" doesn't mean a thing, as Hocking is a TWO-YEAR college, in case you haven't noticed. All the "three-year rate" proves is that a majority of students leave Hocking College to complete their educations elsewhere.
 * And it is simply not true that a murder has never been committed on the campus. All of the murders have taken place in campus housing, which is physically off-campus but actually part of Hocking College. In other words, the students are not safe under their own campus roofs.
 * Not sure what your stats about nursing are supposed to prove. In terms of improving the article, we should get all of the facts I'm talking about into it, including the malpractice lawsuits against O'Bleness Hospital based on the allegations of incompetence by Hocking College nurses. Hockingtruth 02:13, 15 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Hockingtruth, while your writing makes me think it is probably at least partially true- cite, or move on. Rants are useless here, but citeable facts are very welcome. Anyone can talk up a storm, but cold hard facts make an encyclopaedia. This is the page that the anonymous poster was referring to- http://www.hocking.cc.oh.us/campus_services/transportation_and_safety/campus_safety/crime_statistics.htm —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.69.219.3 (talk) 04:05, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

Redundant Information
The following information is poorly written and contains the same information as above, only the information in the above paragraph is better written and more accurately quotes the sources. Because of this, the following information is being removed:

In January 2010, the FBI began investigating a hate crime, when a note was found written on a bathroom wall that threatened that black students would be killed on February 2.[25] A racist note was found a short time later.[25] Subsequently, some black students withdrew from the school out of fear for their safety.[25] [edit] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.30.5.4 (talk) 17:25, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Also there are many redundancies with the following paragraph, as the paragraph above it also explains this information. In fact the same quote is used twice. So in an attempt to make this sound well written I am combining the two paragraphs:

These paragraphs are being removed simply because everything said in them is already said throughout the article: In recent years, the college has experienced some turmoil as senior officials have been investigated for and accused of financial improprieties. In August 2008, the Ohio State Auditors website announced an audit of Hocking College to explore "various allegations regarding certain activities and financial transactions at the college."[16] Eight months later, in April 2009, Hocking College president John Light was replaced by Dr. Ron Erickson of Minnesota.[17] Erickson himself was removed from office in June 2011 after "blindsiding trustees by sending out a campuswide e-mail that said he'd been micromanaged"[18] only to be reinstated three months later.[19] An investigation by the state's auditor's office found that Light, DuVivier (Light's Wife and senior vice-president under his administration), and two other employees illegally took money from the college. The Audit report shows that this money should be paid back to the college and criminal prosecution is impending a final investigation by the State of Ohio's Ethics Commission.[20] Light and his wife were charged with crimes related to these allegations in June of 2011[21]; they pled no contest to the charges and were fined and ordered to pay restitution.[22] Coincidentally, these charges were levied less than a month after Light's successor was ousted by the college's board of trustees.[23][24]

This is the paragraph that will remain: Also in 2009, Hocking College President Dr. John Light retired after 42 years of service to Hocking College.[8] He was replaced by Dr. Ron Erickson of Minnesota.[9] Erickson himself was removed from office in June 2011 after "blindsiding trustees by sending out a campuswide e-mail that said he'd been micromanaged"[18] but was reinstated three months later. In August 2008, the Ohio State Auditors website announced an audit of Hocking College to explore “various allegations regarding certain financial activities and financial transactions at the college.” Light and his wife, who served as his senior-vice president, and two other employees were found to have taken money illegally from the college. Light and his wife were charged with crimes related to these allegations in June of 2011[10] and they pled no contest to the charges and were fined and ordered to pay restitution.[11] These charges were levied less than a month after Light's successor was ousted by the college's board of trustees.[23][24] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.30.5.4 (talk) 17:50, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Notable Alumni
The criteria for "Notable Alumni" is subjective, based on the editor. Any person could potentially be called "notable" because no objective criteria exists. Look at any other college or university Wikipedia page, and you will see that they all determine "Notable Alumni" in different ways. Therefore,since the previous editor decided to inject their own opinion, as far as the people they determine to be "notable" on behalf of Hocking College, it is best to simply delete this section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.30.5.4 (talk) 17:15, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
 * You are completely in the wrong, Mister Anonymous Dial-Up. Please see WP:N and WP:BIO. And, since you are irrelevantly obsessed by what does or doesn't exist in other articles, please have a good long hard look at WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. Qworty (talk) 03:42, 25 January 2012 (UTC)

NPOV
However factual the negative content may be on this page, it is still extremely biased in that none of the positives are mentioned. For instance, history is only about controversies, except for the founding date. Obviously, someone has an axe to grind with Hocking College. It may be legitimate, but Hocking College IS more than just the negatives. jaknouse (talk) 04:29, 6 March 2011 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 18:08, 29 April 2016 (UTC)