Talk:Horrorcore/Archive 1

Artist Listings
i'm suprised that this page does not mention the geto boys...they have a big hand in "horrocore" especially bushwick bill's solo album...and i'm suprised that all the commentors here have not mentioned the geto boys...makes me wonder who knows what they're talking about 217.151.224.29 (talk) 15:31, 5 April 2008 (UTC) mental possibility

I think Bone Thugs N Harmony should be mentioned on this page. A lot of their lyrics can be considered as Horrorcore.ex from the song east 1999(187 you think that your going to heaven with slugs(bullets) all up in your chest to hell is where you be dwelling).Leegar84 01:03, 17 February 2007 (UTC)


 * WP:NOR Wikipedia isn't the place for opinions.  If Bone Thugs & Harmony are to be listed, it needs to be verified.  Read WP:Verify.--Scandalous 23:47, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Necro and his goons need a mention on the page because they put out the most evil grimy music in the world today with little humour and Necro is one of the biggest artists in the genre today although he claims to be Death Rap. Also some body asked about links to death metal and black metal i dont really know but i do know Necro has worked with Obituary, Slipknot, Voivod

I have no idea what the last paragraph has to do with anything. CoherentDelirium 19:15, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Too many pioneers listed, perhaps there should be a seperate list of artists of this genre. ReverendG 00:49, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Unsorted statements regarding article
The last paragraph is quite hideous.

The final paragraph of this page needs to be edited to conform to a more "encyclopedic" format. YARRRRRR! Entropic 16:55, 17 February 2005 (UTC)

Just a note to whoever writes this article. Please include the Template:Hiphop footer by typing at the bottom of the edit window. Thanks, Tuf-Kat 23:47, 1 April 2004 (UTC)

After reading this article, I still have one question: What is horrorcore? --Dachannien 00:51, 10 June 2005 (UTC)


 * From what I gather, horrorcore is rap with an emphasis on very dark/violent lyrics. If so, this is not even mentioned in the article. At the moment, this is just a list of hip-hop acts and record labels. There needs to be some clear definition of what horrorcore actually is. --Neural 23:53, 24 June 2005 (UTC)


 * I've updated the page to explain the genre a little more. The person who wrote it before me had very little knowledge of the genre. I will be making artist pages for the few artists who have not been added already so you can get a better understanding if you wish. --Eldi 20:07, 21 August 2005 (UTC)

The entire article is quite hideous - the writing style reeks of an 8th grade research paper, and just the general approach is far too subjective.

I have the feeling that this article is trying to defend Horrorcore in a simple persuasive essay format. It needs to be redone entirely and without bias. The0208 00:59, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

It seems like whoever edited it is trying to promote this Killa C --.Greven. 00:22, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Be bold... I deleted this: "Eminem has dabbled in horrorcore ..." - this point is remotely arguable, but more importantly - it has almost no significance. Eminem has no notable connection with Horrorcore, and the fact that an artist "dabbled" in it is hardly relevant -Joe NY —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.188.152.115 (talk) 00:12, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

I tried
I read this article and was sickened. I tried to edit what I could, but it still sucks. It no longer bashes Horrorcore or the artists on that page, but it still needs work. I hope in the meantime that this helps for those of you looking for information on Horrorcore music. Whoever wrote this article in the first place was very rude and to all that had to view it, I apologize on behalf of the person. 66.140.98.239 (talk) 07:08, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Removed this
"Acid Rap" is a term that a DJ from Clatskanie, OR, Beleaves it correct. Daniel May is a DJ in Oregon that has a ton of music and knows that sound of Acid Rap. This is what Horrorcore should be called.

looks like a 2 year old wrote it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Burgz33 (talk • contribs) 02:55, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

I've made some changes
I have added pretty much everything that is on the page right now, I know there are still a few things to work on, but I did what I could (I'm not really an expert on the subject, but I know a thing or two). I will also add redirects (from murder rap, for example). skribb 17:57, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

Juggalo
Deleted the section entitled "Juggalo", because the information almost exactly duplicated the information available on the Juggalo page. There is a "see also" link near the bottom to the Juggalo article, which should be sufficient. Here's hoping it doesn't reappear without someone rewriting it to explain why Juggalo and horrorcore are related. --Dachannien 00:20, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

Big L
Just wondering should Big L be on the list. He did record some songs that can be considered horrorcore but that was not his main style so I am not sure if to include him or not.-- hasafienda 20:11, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

dude big L is not horrocore at all... ---Burgz33 05:29, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Devil's Son was Horrorcore 220.240.18.178 (talk) 12:12, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

One song doesn't make you horrorcore.... Erryday I'm 13:39, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Yeah but it was a Horrorcore song, there should be a list of artists & tracks that have been horrorcore, ie DMX, some Bone Thugs etc —Preceding unsigned comment added by B7 (talk • contribs) 11:54, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Artists
I think the grocery list of artists should be removed, or at least their significance explained. The0208 03:06, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Death Rap is not Hororcore, Necro created Death Rap as a term for his own brand of music, Juggalos use to term horrorcore to explain the pathetic style and abundance of face painting, there is a difference.

Bias: Makeup vs. Originality
"Or they just don't wear face paint because they want their own original style." This seems to imply a bias against makeup, in that it's very use is inherently less unoriginal. Although that may be true for derivative makeup styles, I don't see how not wearing makeup by definition makes a group any more original. --Scandalous 07:28, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Death Metal/Black Metal Links
The article states that Horrorcore artists often have links with death/black metal artists. Other than the subject matter I'm not aware of any links myself. Can anybody actually name any links?

http://necrohiphop.com/prefix.htm

Necro's "Prefix For Death" album fatures many metal legends & acts, including Away of Voivod, John Tardy of Obituary Dan Liker of Nuclear Assault, #0 of Slipknot, and Jamey Jasta of Hatebreed.


 * WP:VERIFY WP:NOR WP:NPOV Please read the policies and guidelines, and revisit the question.  We need a reliable source, if the statement is to remain.  --Scandalous 01:06, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Rollback
Who's up for a rollback? This article is utterly sub-standard now. skribb 20:18, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Shawn Devlin Kidnap Case
According to Newsweek magazine an man who lived in an apartment upstairs from where Shawn Devlin was being said "There was often loud banging and blaring music, including "horrorcore" bands like Insane Clown Posse and Twiztid" 69.114.117.103 19:33, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Page needs to be locked down.
people are adding a musical artists list, with no sources, and half the artists dont even have a page on wikipedia 70.253.168.239 (talk) 03:30, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Terrible page
I'd re-write the entire page if I could, but I don't know enough about the topic to... hopefully someone with knowledge on this subject can come forward and do a clean-up of this page. At the moment it needs:

- To explain what horrorcore actually is

- A history that actually makes sense

- A list of notable artists

- The random lyrics at the ends to be removed

- Many grammar errors to be fixed

58.108.15.68 (talk) 02:18, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Entire Article is Crap
Horrorcore was a puerile fad. The only reason this whole article hasn't been deleted is because NOBODY WITH HALF A BRAIN GIVES A SHIT about it. 68.0.119.181 (talk) 21:32, 28 October 2007 (UTC)


 * WP:DISCUSSION Talk pages are for discussing the article, not for opinions on the topic. --Scandalous 00:09, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Did you get beaten up by an artist or something? 220.240.135.22 (talk) 08:35, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

this discussion page isnt here for your oppinon. take it to a forum because you are just vandalizing on wikipedia --Mpfterd 01:51, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Artists that are NOT horrorcore
three 6 mafia should be taken off because they were once considered horrorcore and it would be misleading to say that they never were --Mpfterd 01:51, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

"Satanic Music" section.
A question about this section: What purpose does it serve, other than to "defend" the genre? It would be one thing to explain the controversy surrounding that issue, citing examples. This section appears to be taking a stance however, and I'm not sure that's appropriate from an encyclopedic, or npov perspective. It also smacks of a bias against Satanism in general.

While on the topic, musicians of any just about any genre can come from any faith, including Satanism. Sure, a satanist isn't often going to be inclined to put out a Christian rock album, but there's nothing that really prevents him/her from doing so, just as long as he/she finds a way to publish/distribute it. --Scandalous 10:53, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

Satanic Music Many people have the misconception that horrorcore music is satanic, however horrorcore is nothing more than a horror movie without the visual aspect. Horrorcore is largely fictional, not fact. Horrorcore is done more for the means of entertainment, and is in no way real, many artists have explained this in their songs after being called "Satanic" by the media.

I am removing that section of text for the reasons I mentioned above. Please read WP:VERIFY, WP:NOR, and WP:RS. --Scandalous 00:54, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Article Submitted for Deletion
The article has been submitted for deletion. Although I did not submit the article for deletion, the points made are valid. The article is not in keeping with Wikipedia's policies, notably: Verifiability, No Original Research, and Neutral Point of View. A lot of work needs to be done on this article if it is to remain. So, if anyone can provide any reliable sources, it would be a good start. --Scandalous 01:53, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Other notable horrocore artist
wouldnt it be prozak who is signed to tech n9ne's label strange music he is also part of the group project dead man with producer mike e clark who has produce for ICP also should you place Necro and his Psychological records since most of them do horrocore and is kinda of a horrocore label dont you think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.194.185.191 (talk • contribs) 16 September 2008
 * Needs a source. And simply performing the style does not make one a notable performer of horrorcore. (Ibaranoff24 (talk) 15:29, 24 January 2009 (UTC))

Notable representatives
I don't believe that the notable representatives list is inherently slanted and have restored the section pending consensus. All that's required for inclusion is reliable sourcing, which stands to substantiate the label and the notability. The only inherent slant is away from original research. :) --Moonriddengirl (talk) 10:40, 14 July 2009 (UTC)


 * We're not a fansite nor are we a directory service. If they are a notable "representative" of horrorcore then they should be notable enough to have an article and be placed in that category.  Try not to give WP:UNDUE weight in what is already a mediocre article.  JBsupreme (talk) 06:46, 15 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Lists are a perfectly acceptable way of organizing information in alternative to or addition to category. WP:UNDUE has no bearing here. It relates to giving fringe opinions more space in articles than they deserve: "fairly represent[ing] all significant viewpoints that have been published by a reliable source...in proportion to the prominence of each." There are no more dominant viewpoints that are being overwhelmed here by these representatives. More notable representatives are not being omitted in favor of these. Every notable artist with a source is included with a simple list of name; nobody is given paraphraphs more of text than anyone else. A list of notable representatives of this musical style is a simple way for readers of this article to quickly locate articles about appropriate artists. It also allows for the inclusion of artists who may be sourced and notable within this subject that may not meet inclusion guidelines for an article of their own or for which articles have not yet been created. It is perfectly appropriate for those purposes and quite in line with the guidelines at Categories, lists, and navigation templates. As that guideline points out, "Many users prefer to browse Wikipedia through its lists, while others prefer to navigate by category; and lists are more obvious to beginners, who may not discover the category system right away. Therefore, the 'category camp' should not delete or dismantle Wikipedia's lists, and the 'list camp' shouldn't tear down Wikipedia's category system—doing so wastes valuable resources. Instead, each should be used to update the other." This list is not large enough for stand-alone, but is within practice; see List of industrial metal bands, List of metalcore bands, List of alternative rock artists, List of Swedish hip hop musicians. We do these all the time. If this list ever grows long enough to merit splitting from its parent article, it will be appropriate to do so. Meanwhile it belongs here. There are advantages to this list, and its inclusion is within standard practice and guideline. I do not believe you offer compelling reason for its removal. If other contributors to the article don't weigh in to help establish consensus, I will seek further opinion. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 11:01, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't see the relevance of WP:UNDUE here either. The MUSTARD style guideline, which represents consensus among editors from WikiProject Music, generally frowns on lists of artists on genre articles. There are alot of quality sources here though, which can be used to merge the list into the history section or create an 'artists' section based on prose. Why not expand the article rather than delete verifiable content? dissolve  talk  17:33, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Underground?!?!
I thought the word "underground" was slang.. Why is it being used in this article?? Furthurmore it's way too ambigous.. people call anything "underground" for any reason, I'm not even sure what it means. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.224.115.100 (talk) 00:14, 28 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Well... Underground is an opposite of Mainstream. And i hope my post don't get reverted or anything because i just pointed what is truth.

Is this a notable example?
I moved the following artist from the list because it does not have an article. Is this a notable example? Ibaranoff24 (talk) 19:28, 28 December 2009 (UTC)


 * The J.Hexx Project

Page protection
Due to edit-warring from multiple IP addresses, I've semi-protected this page for a day. Franamax (talk) 17:21, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

O.G. Vs. New Age
I can't help but cringe at the site of this Wikipedia page.. Personally the "History" section of this page (And by that I mean JUST the first paragraph, exempting Big L's album) is the only TRUE part of this whole page. ICP was out in 1992 already, they always called themselves juggalo's and their music wicked shit. No horrorcore artist (BESIDES all the juggalo bull) calls themselves "Juggalo's" or their stuff "Wicked shit" except ESHAM, who ICP got their entire style from. It was a small genre, but juggalo's have been adding more and more juggalo artists and labeling them as horrorcore.. Personally, I don't even KNOW any juggalo's that listen to horrorcore, besides the juggalo artists that get the label, and I grew up around juggalos! And D12? you do one song and now you're horrorcore? if that was the standards you might as well add EVERY rapper who says "Murder" "Kill" or anything like that. Please do me a favor and look at the artists who are listed, the majority of the people don't even list horrorcore as a genre! Gravediggaz does. Flatlinerz does.

Juggalo's already got the juggalo stamp, now they're trying to take the horrorcore stamp too. You got stupid little chubby white angsty kids like SYCO SAM trying to say they're Horrorcore. I've listened to a lot of that Juggalo shit and the major difference is they're silly.

Horrorcore: "Left pops hanging from the ceiling with a broke neck, and just to escape the drag I kicked back on the couch and drunk a 40 out of a paper bag. Watched his body dangle to the left, who am I? The mother fucking angel of death!" - Insane Poetry

Juggalo crap: "I'm twisted, I'll cut your finger off, and stick in your butt and glue it shut.... Guess what I'm a serial killer, it's a bad habit I killed Tony, Lucky Charms, the silly rabbit" - Insane CLOWN(S) Posse

There is a HUGE difference, and for that I believe they should not be included, or at least there should be a side note saying that they don't take it serious like REAL horrorcore artists.

I wish I could make an "Old School Horrorcore" page or a "REAL Horrorcore" page haha
 * Do you really think that swearing and expressions such as "stupid little chubby white angsty kids" are appropriate here? Mephistophelian (talk) 00:04, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Eminem
Eminem is a mainstream artist whose work consists mainly of horrorcore. The article should reflect that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.74.127.193 (talk) 12:12, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
 * It's not our job to promote specific artists. (Sugar Bear (talk) 21:30, 4 June 2010 (UTC))

Hess
The book by Hess has been used to source an awful lot of horrorcore artists. The ones actually mentioned in the section include:
 * Geto Boys (name-dropped as a root influence, not a mainstream horrorcore artist)
 * Ganxsta Nip
 * Insane Poetry
 * Esham
 * Flatlinerz
 * Insane Clown Posse
 * Twizted
 * Necro
 * Tyler, The Creator — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.53.22.17 (talk) 00:38, 13 October 2011 (UTC)

The article also mentions other artists who have used horror music movie in their songs (Beastie Boys, Busta Rhymes, Dr Dre, Tru, Project Pat, Metabolics and Mr. Dead), although these are not specifically labeled by the book in the genre. That's the extent of it. Page 370 of the book talks about some rap artists who have played characters in horror movies. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 23:29, 27 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Another effort to misuse Hess removed - . Considering that the last time this IP tried to add that band he indicated they were "newcomers" in 2012, it seems remarkably prescient of the Hesses to write about them in 2007. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 00:53, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Dre Dog
Also worth citing as an early example of horrorcore: Dre Dog's "Most Hated Man in Frisco" from The New Jim Jones (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Jim_Jones). Infamous30 (talk) 11:09, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

death metal
i removed death metal from stylistic origins since death metal has absolutely nothing to do with this genre — Preceding unsigned comment added by I call the big one bitey (talk • contribs) 09:07, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

OFWGKTA
I really feel like Odd Future should be on the list, or at least Tyler, especially since we apparently have a source for it (above)--82.132.213.196 (talk) 03:01, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

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Horrorcore in the News : Murderers
Murderers such as Jeff Weise, Richard Samuel McCroskey and the satanist guy, Noah Romando (part on S.I.N.) who killed his family were avid horrorcore fans, and when old media found out they did a lot of reporting on the genre, trying to pose the music as responsible for the actions of the killers, causing moderate to severe drama within the scene. Is this notable at all for the article? TheGuideMastah (talk) 11:01, 8 October 2016 (UTC)

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