Talk:Hotel Kimball

Poor use of the "advert" tag
I nearly laughed aloud after I read through this article, after noting that an "advert" tag had been placed on it. Apparently, the person who placed the tag missed the oh-so-flattering (sarcasm) paragraphs about how the condominium developers went to jail and the building was managed by the FDIC for nearly a decade. What a great advert!! LOL. PLease read the whole article before placing a 'designation' atop it. (People seem overly designation happy these days.)

This exemplifies one of the main problems with Wikipedia: sourced and cited 'positive' information -- for example, that Presidents stayed at the Kimball; or that WBZ, the nation's first radio station, was headquartered at the Kimball -- are facts that are sourced and cited. They are not adverts; merely historical information that could be perceived positively.

It is also a fact that this building became part of a very troubled condominium development during the 1980s. Fact, which could perceived negatively.

Adverts contain exaggerations or falsehoods. Facts, however, are not adverts. If an article is written with sourced facts that happen to be positive, that does not an "advert" make. 76.119.66.131 (talk)


 * Content need not be false or exaggerated to be an "advert." Most advertisements are in fact true, but they possess a promotional tone or may include WP:Puffery not appropriate for an encyclopedia. Furthermore, you claim that this article is fully sourced, but I see several passages and statements that give no indication of any source -- and several of the "sources" cited in the article are rather weak. --Orlady (talk) 13:53, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

Writing again because the same person put "advert" on this article, and also recommended it for deletion
I suggest that this one person do a bit of research on this well-known building before recommending wholesale deletion of the article. Indeed, why not improve it? Wholesale deletion of a building that is on the National Registry? On the building that housed the United States' first-ever commercial radio station? On the building that became the Sheraton companies headquarters for a time?

Surely, there are better articles to recommend for deletion than this. This was Springfield's most famous hotel for nearly 70 years. Apparently, you're not from New England..?

Also, based on what do you deem this article to be an advert? There are facts, both positive and negative, reported regarding the building. Is there not enough criticism for you..? It's an historic hotel -- what criticism do you want? The troubled condominium development was mentioned and briefly expounded upon... Personally, I do not understand your fixation with this article. 76.119.66.131 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 05:52, 19 September 2011 (UTC).

Advert-like content that I found in the article includes:
 * Who recommended the article for deletion and when? I see no such request in the article history. Are you thinking of some other article?
 * The radio station's headquarters in The Hotel Kimball lured the day's most popular entertainers to Springfield - a mid-sized, albeit very wealthy city - who were drawn by the hotel's reputation as much as the radio station's. (unsourced)
 * During the new millennium, as Springfield's Metro Center revitalized, the Kimball Towers became an increasingly attractive residence for artists, bohemians, and empty-nesters—people who were attracted to urban living without the typical high expense. During this time, the building achieved financial and managerial stability, which had eluded it since its days as the Sheraton-Kimball Hotel. As of 2011, the Kimball Towers is a primarily owner-occupied building. Rentals can be found; however, they are increasingly rare—and increasingly expensive. As of 2011, a 1 bedroom, 1 bathroom, 795-square-foot (73.9 m2) condominium rents for approximately $1000/month, whereas 5–8 years ago, it might have rented for half of that amount. (Sourced only to a real estate ad. Yes, there is some negative content here --and no indication of its source, but the information on how to find rentals, the specs and price of an apartment, and the ref link to the real estate ad are hallmarks of an advert, not an encyclopedia article.)
 * Behind it, however, the Grand Ballroom has fallen into disrepair - although it still features its original maple parquet floor and a dramatic balcony. The "Millennium Room" - originally part of the Kimball's famous Pickwick Lounge restaurant and bar -- has been renovated and now features regular art shows and entertainment by the building's many artists and musicians.(unsourced)
 * The Kimball is perched atop a bluff, and thus features a section below the building's entrance gradient. That area features a little-known "secret garden" - a green oasis amidst the urban fabric of Springfield. To reach it, one must locate an obscure hallway in the back of first floor, which itself is decorated by examples of abstract-expressionist art, and then follow several flights of stairs down to the secret garden. (unsourced)
 * The Kimball's floor #2 (the building's third story) through #8 (the building's ninth story) feature similar condominium layouts. For example, Unit #204 is, essentially, similar to Unit #804. The Units #210-#810 are the only units in the building to feature Frankfurt kitchens. Only the top three floors -- #6, #7, and #8 were finished by the original condominium developer, who outfitted the units with luxury cabinets and left many of the original hotel's luxury features, e.g. doors and doorknobs. (unsourced)
 * I will restore the advert template to alert users to the need to fix the article. --Orlady (talk) 13:53, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

P.S.
Personally, I suggest that if the same critic continues to find the tone of this article advert-like, that he/she changes it to his/her liking rather than ask for the wholesale deletion of an article on a well-known, landmark hotel. The latter option seems immoderate considering that the former is an option. 76.119.66.131 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 05:58, 19 September 2011 (UTC).


 * Please refrain from personal attacks. If you are adamant that the content has value, then you are free to bring the article up to the standard of an encyclopedia. If no one who is interested in this hotel cares to resolve the problems with the article's quality, then someone else (like me) who has no particular interest in the topic will excise the problem content. As indicated above, I will restore the advert template. --Orlady (talk) 13:53, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

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