Talk:Hugh Torney (Irish republican)

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Untitled
Torney pretty much wound down the IRSP, which was the political wing of the movement, so I would find it hard to say that he prefered political activity to military actions.--Deadmanonleave 09:40, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Prod
This is sourceable, or a sourced version can be written. I have a book called Deadly Divisions which deals with the INLA in detail, including Torney. Only problem is I haven't read it yet and it's 550+ pages with no index, so if any AfD can wait for a week or so that would be much appreciated. Thanks. One Night In Hackney 303  23:10, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

While Deadly Divisions is not a book that many Irps would have too much time for, I think it backs my original point that Torney was a military, rather than political animal. Where is the basis of the assertion that he preferred politics coming from....I can't see a single source on the net, and talking to those involved in both the eighties and nineties feuds that Torney was involved in it's not something that anybody I've met says.--Deadmanonleave 09:40, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

I notice again that my revision which stated that Torney wound down the political movement whilst trying to maintain the military side of things has been edited to read that he was more politically motivated than anything else. I find this a little frustrating to say the least, while the only written work I can quote from is the aforementioned Deadly Divisions and the IRSP's own publications, I have spoken extensively to people in the movement about what transpired between the end of the IPLO feud and the chaos of 1996. It wouldn't be right to name names when we're talking about this type of thing, but nobody, including some who left the movement around these times, would seriously dispute an assessment of the Ball's reign that said he wound down the IRSP whilst keeping the INLA active.--Deadmanonleave 09:40, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Rather than getting into a revision/counter revision nonsense of a fight, I'd ask that the person who's posting a different version of events to myself to make a statement on the talk page so we can at least get some honest discussion going

M —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deadmanonleave (talk • contribs) 06:14, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm aware the DD is a book that many Irps don't have too much time for. However the problem is that there just haven't been many reliable sources that cover the INLA in much detail, in particular the internal feuding. The bottom line is that if it can't be sourced, it doesn't belong in the article. One Night In Hackney  303  16:01, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

I agree with you on DD being one of the only quotable pieces of work on the history of the movement, although mine's only 384 pages long.....check out pages 346-347 (From 'The INLA is now controlled by one man...) - which if yours is laid out differently are the back end of the chapter 'Night Of The Long Knives' which is the last one before the Epilogue and and interview with Torney (although I'm told the interview never took place and was cobbled together from a series of written questions answered by Naomi Brennan, not Torney).

I think you will agree that whatever my disagreements with the authors, their assessment of Torney's reign is similar to mine, the IRSP was virtually wound up, while the military operations continued, but with a nod and a wink from the Provisionals. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deadmanonleave (talk • contribs) 19:34, 6 November 2007 (UTC) --Deadmanonleave 09:40, 7 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Night of the Long Knives starts at page 514 in my copy. One Night In Hackney  303  01:44, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Have you read it? What do you think? (I've just read about the ettiquette of signing my work, hence the signatures!)--Deadmanonleave 09:42, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Editted the page to reflect what I've written and quoted above Deadmanonleave (talk) 00:30, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

POV
Much of this article was POV and unreferenced. Billsmith60 (talk) 12:55, 30 April 2009 (UTC)