Talk:Hungarian cuisine/Archive 1

Incredible Superiority
This phrase doesn't seem consistent with an evenhanded discussion of Hungarian cuisine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.67.144.57 (talk) 11:50, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

List
The list isn't so bad. . . Well, this is an encyclopedia and not a restaurant review, so I won't bloat the article with my opinions, but I share some with you here, maybe they can be used somehow.

First: usually the places you find on the net (except personal reviews and guides) are only expensive, but usually neither really authentic nor exceptionally good. The places hidden in the deeps of the country can give you the best culinary experiences. They're offline, they're hidden.

For example, cakes and other sweets in Budapest must bought from Daubner cukrászda (confectionery), which is an ugly, small, crowded place in Buda. Why crowded all the time? Go, guess!

Or for normal restaurants, go to the city Gyöngyös and see Kékes étterem on the main square. Everything is excellent, and costs 10 times less than, say, Gundel.

On the way to the east you can hop into Miskolc-Tapolca (they have a nice cave-bath, anyway) and see Tusculanum restaurant somewhere deep in the small streets. Ask for Granny's Meat Soup, and don't think you'll have space left for anything else in your stomach! (Summer only.)

I remembered those out of my silly head, there are probably others. But, um, does this info fit into an encyclopedia? --grin 16:52, 10 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Shouldn't this article mention paprikash and nokedli!? —Michael Z. 2006-09-29 19:18 Z 

Sorry, I had to change Gulyásleves to Beef pörkölt. Gulyásleves contains vegetables, small dumplings (nokedli) and potato, not only meat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Borzas (talk • contribs) 19:04, August 26, 2007 (UTC) Small Text

Is there such a thing as ancient  turkish cuisine??!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 31.52.75.59 (talk) 19:17, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

HUNGARY ROX74.244.13.21 (talk)!!!
--62.251.121.48 (talk) 13:01, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

Vandalism
I've removed the following vandalism:

Spices
“Other common flavor components are onions (raw, sweated or caramelized), garlic, black pepper, marjoram, thyme, saffron, caraway/cumin, juniper berries, ginger, lemon peel and wine.”

Saffron and ginger are absolutely not commonly used spices in the real Hungarian cuisine, they are, on the contrary rather unusual. They might be mentioned or used in English style “Hungarian” cooking. Parsley, bay leaf, and dill, on the other hand are common.

Warrington (talk) 10:12, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

I smile at these comments. George Lang's famous Hungarian cookbooks contain many recipes that use ginger or saffron. Ginger was very commonly used in medieval Hungarian cuisine and continues to this day. It is a flavor component; nobody ever said it was a common one but it is used. However, saffron is a MUST in many Hungarian dishes. Chicken paprikas (csirke paprikas) often contains saffron (safrany in Magyar). In fact the version of the recipe served on the Orient Express from Paris to Istanbul contained saffron; the dish was served the evening the train entered Hungary from Vienna. Saffron is also used on crescent potatoes cooked with sweet paprika and pork drippings. No offense to anyone out there, but ethnic Hungarians --in Hungary and elsewhere-- need to be adding to and refining this page, not epicurian Brits who think they know Hungarian food. The cuisine of an ethnic group spans much more than the dishes made by middleclass housewives in the extant country, or fine restaurants in its largest city. Many Hungarian specialities have been maintained in the U.S. and Canada by Hungarian-North Americans, as well as in Romania by Transylvanian Magyars. George Lang and Karoly Gundel would both admit that much of Hungarian cuisine has been lost since the Treaty of Trianon and the Communist takeovers. This page should be as inclusive as possible. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.210.91.116 (talk) 19:17, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Well, that's George Lang's idea about Hungarian kitchen but I am sure that the guy is American or English. And what they served on the Orient Express is not necessarily the food they eat in Hungary. As I told you my mother is Hungarian and I spent many holidays in Hungary but I can not recall any dish with saffron. I have relatives and friends among the Transylvanian Magyars too. I am not an epicurian Brit who think he knows Hungarian food. I am talking about the real Hungarian cuisine. I understand that you think saffron is a Hungarian spice but I do not think any Hungarian uses saffron in the chicken paprikas in Hungary or Transylvania. “Many Hungarian specialities have been maintained in the U.S. and Canada by Hungarian-North Americans”, as you say but than they became slightly Americanised, like the Chinese kitchen and food in USA, for example, and not that authentic any more. You say that much of Hungarian cuisine has been lost since the Treaty of Trianon and the Communist takeovers. The Austro-Hungarian Empire and it's haute cuisine disapeared, and it is a little bit nostalgic and sad, but so did the British Empire, the Victorian era and cuisine too.

But I can reasure you that Hungarian cuisine is still alive and flourishing, just take trip to Hungary and you will see. Warrington (talk) 22:10, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

The anonymous user claims without sources that saffron is "often" used in Chicken Paprikas. I've never seen a csirke paprikas recipe that calls for saffron from my various Hungarian cookbooks and my Hungarian mother-in-law has never used this spice in her csirke paprikas. The only time I've seen her use ginger is to make ginger cookies. What is being argued here isn't whether saffron and ginger are used, but whether they are common _today_. They are not common in comparison to the other spices used. Those ingredients were much more commonly used in recipes from 300 years ago. http://www.chew.hu/taste_of_300yearold_dishes.html It would be ridiculous to write that they are common ingredients in Hungarian cuisine. --Stacey Doljack Borsody (talk) 05:39, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

"Those ingredients were much more commonly used in recipes from 300 years ago”. Why not mention medieval food, old spices and the Orient Express in the History section? It would be more appropriate and even quite interesting.Warrington (talk) 07:11, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Oh Lord, Warrington, he thinks he knows about Hungarian food, but doesn't know who George Lang is. George Lang is not American nor English. There are German surnames like 'Lang' in Hungary because over the centuries many Germans (as well as Italians, Greeks, Serbs, Russians, Jews, Roma, etc., etc.) were invited and moved to the Magyar Kiralysag. George Lang was born and raised in Hungary and is one of the most famous restaurateurs of the 20th century. He has written umpteen Hungarian cookbooks, which have been translated into a dozen languages. Many of the authentic Hungarian recipes he includes use spices like saffron. One must remember that although Hungary today is only the size of Indiana, there are different regions of the nation. The food in the Dunantul is not the same as on the Alfold. The food in the far south and Serbia is not the same as the Felvidek (north) and Slovakia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.175.191.121 (talk) 07:41, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Well, even if sarmon is used in just one typical Hungarian dish, does this make it common? Squash Racket (talk) 09:19, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Saffron is a forgotten spice which was used in Hungary in the Middle ages, see plenty of referrences on that saying saffron is a  forgotten  spice in Hungarian cuisine:

http://www.gourmandnet.hu/konyha/site.php?tpl=theme&id=71

http://www.mon.hu/engine.aspx/page/article-detail/cn/boon-news-ed07-20051022-021107/dc/im:all:health-family http://network.hu/gelleon/blog/kl%C3%A1ri-blogja/kozepkori_magyar_konyha-4132

http://www.hotdog.hu/magazin/magazin_article.hot?m_id=29085&h_id=90500&a_id=455423

http://magicafe.hu/news.php?nid=667

If you do not read Hungarian User:User:Misibacsi is an available Hungarian translator here on Wikipedia. Warrington (talk) 10:31, 25 January 2009 (UTC)


 * "Spices in Hungarian cuisine: then and now... In recent times, however, it has been noted that the herbs, seeds, and roots that used to be in common use are now reappearing in the country as the result of foreign influences. These include tarragon, rosemary, basil, thyme, aniseed, juniper, saffron, and also ginger, which used to be just about the most important ingredient in Hungarian cuisine." From Culinaria Hungary (2006) page 23, a well researched and beautiful book that's more like a history book than a cookbook.   I got this book just about two months ago and my Hungarian in-laws love to thumb through it whenever they come over. It comes with an extensive bibliography, in which only one of George Lang's "famous cookbooks" appears.  --Stacey Doljack Borsody (talk) 19:02, 25 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Page 46... "Italian parsley is one of the most important herbs in Hungarian cuisine." --Stacey Doljack Borsody (talk) 19:10, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Page 54... "The most important ingredient in Hungarian cuisine is not paprika, but, in fact, the onion. ... as is confirmed in countless Hungarian fairy tales and folk songs.  And if there was no bread, then the song went, 'There's still an onion in the provisions sack, if a little bitter own its own...'" --Stacey Doljack Borsody (talk) 19:13, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Sure, but reapearing does not makes them typical or usual or common. Herbs, seeds, and roots that used to be in common use, but when? In the 15th century, in King Matthias Corvinus court, influenced by the Renaissance culture and disapeared around the end of the 17th cetury or so. Pizza and Chinese restauranst are also appearing in Budapest, which doesn’t mean that they are typical Hungarian. They appear because international cuisines are influencing every country, Spanish, Dutch, German or Hungarian. Nowadays you can buy avocado in Hungary, ten years ago you could not.Warrington (talk) 21:11, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

=

Just Gulyas
"(gyulyas hus literally "herdsman's meat")" nobody say “gulyas hus”. In Hungary,

Well, i was wrong. It is true that today nobody say Gulyas hus any more but the old name of the dish is actually " Gulyas hus", from 1787. I put the stuff back in the article again.

pickles
No mention of pickles at all? Sorry to be a bit cynical but without pickles there is no meal in Hungary. Especially the main meal. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.164.202.112 (talk) 23:20, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

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