Talk:Hyon Yong-chol

Dead?
I think Wikipedia has jumped too early to say that he is dead.--Jack Upland (talk) 03:47, 13 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I changed it to reportedly executed (from executed) and added not confirmed by North Korea.[CNN]] ,BBC and most sources say he has been executed we need to mention it.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 05:56, 13 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Most news sources that I have seen say it is reported that he was executed - a report by a South Korean MP of a intelligence briefing. From what I have seen, the SK intelligence service hasn't confirmed this yet. But reports are still coming in.--Jack Upland (talk) 09:22, 13 May 2015 (UTC)
 * If you check, every single news source is citing that single MP, and that MP got it from this website http://www.hrnkinsider.org/2015/04/unusual-activity-at-kanggon-military.html, which used a ton of conjecture. I'd call the entire thing speculation and rumor. After all, since when didn't North Korea broadcast executions? (Downix (talk) 16:48, 13 May 2015 (UTC))
 * I changed it back to alive for now and updated the information. South Korea's National Intelligence Service was the source for all the media reports that said Hyon was executed. However, the source has now revised its statement and says it is not sure whether Hyon was executed. Need more sources before declaring him dead. (Michael5046 (talk) 23:30, 13 May 2015 (UTC))

It is shameful how biographies of North Korean people are frequently filled with rumours spread by the South Korean intelligence agency and echoed by Western media. Not only put the death date of a person, but silly things like "publicly executed by anti-aircraft fire". Why the living persons policy is not respected? emijrp (talk) 10:53, 16 May 2015 (UTC)


 * The "confirmation" is actually a South Korean news service reporting an anonymous Chinese source that claims to have seen a secret North Korean diplomatic bulletin. I would say it is still not confirmed by North Korea, but there is no point in having an edit war about it.--Jack Upland (talk) 06:55, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

another confirmation by south korea http://news.yahoo.com/seoul-north-korea-media-confirms-purging-defense-chief-030411677.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.49.6.225 (talk) 07:05, 13 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Exactly - it is from South Korea. As the source says, North Korean media has not mentioned Hyon's execution, just referred to a new defence minister.--Jack Upland (talk) 07:25, 13 July 2015 (UTC)


 * I've now found a source from July last year which quotes a South Korean spokesman as saying the execution is a rumour.--Jack Upland (talk) 04:46, 25 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Appears to be alive – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 03:38, 31 August 2016 (UTC)


 * That's Kim Yong Chol...--Jack Upland (talk) 03:40, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
 * My bad, it is... Anyway, did you reach a conclusion in May? The article still state that Hyon is dead. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 03:43, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
 * As it stands, a year later, we have reports of his death, and sources which indicate some scepticism. What do you think we should do?--Jack Upland (talk) 05:07, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
 * No opinion, I leave it up to you. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 05:10, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
 * This title leaves no doubts: North Korea Confirms: Defense Official Executed for Napping at Meeting. Needless to say, the factual substance is the same as in other reports. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.72.74.207 (talk) 05:44, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
 * This makes it clear there are doubts: .--Jack Upland (talk) 05:55, 31 August 2016 (UTC)
 * I have changed the article to reflect the fact that we still don't have confirmation of his death.--Jack Upland (talk) 06:10, 31 August 2016 (UTC)

'Current'
Unless someone's updating daily, current and currently should not be used in an encyclopedia article, as the reference could become outdated at any time. For similar reasons, past-tense verbs should be used, as most articles will outlive the present-tense status of breaking news. Sca (talk) 16:24, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Pattern
There seems to be a pattern here. In 2012, Vice Marshal Ri Yong-ho was reported by North Korean media to have stood down due to illness, but there were rumours of a firefight or an attempted coup. Also in 2012, Vice Defence Minister Kim Chol was rumoured to have been executed by mortar round for "carousing". It could be true that North Korea has a practice of secretly executing its military leaders for minor reasons. Or South Korean sources could simply circulate such rumours whenever there is a change in personnel. As of today, none of these rumours have been confirmed.

Added to this we have the case of the singer Hyon Song-wol who was reported executed by multiple sources, only to turn up alive and well the following year. And Kim Jong Un's aunt, Kim Kyong-hui, whose death has been reported on many occasions by many causes. I think we should be very cautious about accepting such reports as fact.--Jack Upland (talk) 09:42, 13 July 2015 (UTC)


 * And we have the case of General Ri Yong-gil who now has turned up alive.--Jack Upland (talk) 06:22, 23 May 2016 (UTC)

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