Talk:Hypnagogic pop

Structure
I don't believe this edit was an improvement. The layout made sense; paragraphs were split up as followed by The split makes for awkward reading. Not only are we introduced to Keenan twice, but the "History" section is just more info about "Characteristics". Basically, followed by --Ilovetopaint (talk) 14:36, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
 * 1) Keenan's definition
 * 2) Influences
 * 3) First applications
 * 4) Derivative styles
 * 1) Critical theories
 * 2) Reception
 * 1) Keenan's definition
 * 2) Characteristics
 * 3) Keenan's definition (again), more characteristics, "chillwave"
 * 4) "Chillwave" (again), and first applications
 * 5) Derivative styles
 * 1) Critical theories
 * 2) Reception.

My issue is that there's would seem to be a distinction between the sections that are simply defining the basic characteristics of the style, and those that have more to do with the history/etymology and critical terms that were used around it over time. The first two paragraphs of the original section were essentially "these are the characteristics of the style" and then it awkwardly transitions to "by 2010, critics were talking about it xyz" which seemed weird. Plus, there's a load of extra sources you've added that you use to simultaneously further define the style AND connect it to other terms/scenes AND refer to particular albums, which seems like too much tied together at once. If you wanna change it back that's fine, but it seems like a clump of redundant information already. Gentlecollapse6 (talk) 14:46, 29 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Ilovetopaint re the "Round and Round" bit........why not just pick a different song with better description?? There's certainly other Pink tracks, or something by Ferraro for sure, that's been described as hpop in terms that actually reflect what the article is talking about. Among other things, that Atlantic description is totally off, it sounds nothing like Ade OR the beach boys, more like 80s soft rock.  gentlecollapse6 (talk) 15:52, 29 March 2017 (UTC)


 * If you can find a better song referenced "definitively" in a source then go ahead and I'll upload a sample of it - that was the only article I could find that named anything specific. I could've used "Feel It All Around" but I thought that was more chillwave than hypnagogic. And I've never listened to King Sunny Ade but I'm pretty sure the author had "Steamboat" in mind (I don't believe the comparison is unwarranted). --Ilovetopaint (talk) 16:11, 29 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Hey, from the Oxford Handbook: "Lopatin's video for "angel" exemplifies hypnagogic pop's format for cultural appropriation..." and goes on to talk about both the track and video aesthetic—so perhaps we can even get a short clip of the audio/video, rather than just the mp3 for that one. gentlecollapse6 (talk) 18:33, 29 March 2017 (UTC)


 * I'll see what I can do --Ilovetopaint (talk) 20:06, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Nice! Any way to alter the thumbnail? That early animated image of a speaker/clock is almost too good.gentlecollapse6 (talk) 21:14, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Nevermind, got it! gentlecollapse6 (talk) 21:23, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

Hey User:Ilovetopaint, not really sure what you're getting at with this edit. The second part seems more specific to Pink, and the first doesn't seem to be explicitly about h-pop. If anything it might belong in the critical response section. gentlecollapse6 (talk) 18:14, 13 April 2017 (UTC)


 * The article has to do with the origins of hpop, so it makes sense to go under the "origins" header.






 * I wasn't sure how to paraphrase all of this so I just copied two sentences that I thought were the most relevant. The "critical response" section is more about "artistic intent" and "feedback" than it is about how such a scene formulated.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 22:08, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
 * I wasn't sure how to paraphrase all of this so I just copied two sentences that I thought were the most relevant. The "critical response" section is more about "artistic intent" and "feedback" than it is about how such a scene formulated.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 22:08, 13 April 2017 (UTC)


 * It's just, once again...all of that seems to be about Ariel Pink specifically i.e. is he the pioneering lo-fi pop artist? Is he the first to do this stuff? I'm not sure the article suggests that anywhere, it just describes him as a progenitor of and influence on the h-pop scene, which doesn't seem very contentious. not sure how Pink's big inspirations like R Stevie Moore necessarily belong in this article. It all seems like a minor quibble between Reynolds and Harper over "who did lo-fi pop first," and I don't think it needs to included IMO. Either way, there's definitely no need for the lengthy Harper quotes on this when they could be summarized more succinctly. gentlecollapse6 (talk) 19:56, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

Retromania: Pop Culture's Addiction to its Own Past
Just found this, haven't read it yet but it surely has some things worth putting in this article and others.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 16:14, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
 * (right-click and "save as")


 * that link didn't work for me, but I'm sure there is—note, however, that the Oxford handbook source runs through Reynold's Retromania argument pretty thoroughly, so it might just be redundant. gentlecollapse6 (talk) 17:01, 29 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Also, this might be helpful—from Adam Harper's blog, contains a link to the original Keenan Wire article. gentlecollapse6 (talk) 17:01, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

It won't work if you left-click, which I why I recommended to "save as" the link. If it still doesn't work then I uploaded it here too. --Ilovetopaint (talk) 17:09, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Still didn't work, my mac doesn't seem to have a program for it, but no big deal.gentlecollapse6 (talk) 17:15, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

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