Talk:II Corps (Poland)

Old talk
There is a contradiction in articles Polish II Corps and Menachem Begin:

Polish II Corps article states:

''After being relocated to Palestine, the Corps faced the problem of increased rate of desertions of soldiers of Jewish nationality, most of whom defected en masse to the Haganah. The most noted among them was Menachem Begin, the future Prime Minister of Israel. General Anders decided not to prosecute the deserters.''

But Menachem Begin article states

...he joined the Polish army of Anders, but was unofficially discharged from that army along with many other Jewish soldiers.

Begin (and other Jewish soldiers for that matter) can’t be a deserter and unofficially discharged at the same time. (This comment is posted on both talk pages, since I can’t tell which article contains incorect facts) -- Obradovi&#263; Goran ( t al k  23:28, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * As far as I can tell, both Begin and many others simply deserted, but the Polish HQ later decided to accept the state of affairs and instead of reporting the desertions to the British MPs simply sent them the documents that all the deserters were discharged due to poor health. This was quite a good excuse since the Poles who left Soviet Gulags not so long before were all in relatively bad health and the Brits had more of their own problems than to look after the Polish deserters. Halibutt 06:14, Apr 2, 2005 (UTC)

I really don't have any information about what happened with Begin and the others, but I think that Poles will say that it was desertion, and Jews will say that it was a discharge. Maybe we should wait to hear “Jewish” side of the story, but your argument sounds OK, so if you want, you can “correct” Begin’s article. But there is one more problem: Menachem Begin article states: ... he joined the Polish army of Anders, but was unofficially discharged from that army along with many other Jewish soldiers.

Begin then moved to British-controlled Palestine, where he ...

If this is correct, act of desertion/discharge must have happened before Anders’s army went to Palestine. This is incosistent with what you have said and what is written in the Polish II Corps article.

I think that it will be rather difficult to determine weather it was desertion or discharge. Moment and location of the incident are however the facts that should be fairly easy to determine. Once we have a date of desertion/discharge and a date of Polish II Corps departure for Palestine, we will be able to say where the incident occured. Since both articles agree that not only Begin, but other Jewish soldiers left (one way or another) this army, I think that it is logical conqlusion that if this happened before II Corps went to Palestine, it was a discharge, and if it happened after II Corps went to Palestine, it was a desertion. -- Obradovi&#263; Goran ( t al k  16:52, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Though I personally couldn't care less, Begin seemed to see it as a matter of "honor" (he was very into being "honorable" and chivalrous) that he NOT desert even though he easilly could have. He made it clear in print oftentimes that he continued to wear the uniform and to appear at whatever station he was supposed to appear at (though there was rarely much for him to do, which is why he COULD have deserted without much notice) until he was discharged. I've read accounts by others as well who knew him at that time and spoke of him as a young soldier in uniform. Unless somoene has a damn good reason to believe that Begin and others were lying years later whjen it was totally irrelevant, I see no reason for the article to claim that he deserted. mnuez —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.55.97.27 (talk) 04:47, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Name
Roman or Latin numerals? Currently it is strange that we have a Polish II Corps and Polish 1st Corps.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 19:16, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Latin See Naming conventions (military units) -Philip Baird Shearer 14:48, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 07:32, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 08:25, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Polish Tanks Bologna.jpg
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BetacommandBot (talk) 08:31, 21 January 2008 (UTC)