Talk:Id Tech 3

Arena vs Team Arena engines
- There's really no such thing as the "Team Arena" engine, Team Arena didn't really enhance the Q3A engine in any way, the "notable" enhancement was just a new menu QVM, which is NOT engine-side, and also many games do not use Team Arena's menu code. I think uniting the list would be a good idea. CheapAlert 16:26, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

- I'd agree with that as well and would be happy to do the actual change unless someone objects to that. Ayavaron 2:44 November 13th


 * "Recently released games using the Team Arena engine (Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Jedi Knight 2, Soldier of Fortune 2, Medal of Honor) all have unique graphical upgrades (e.g. skeletal animation, weather effects). Use of the Team Arena code also means larger maps, outdoor areas, and a greater demand on your video card."  In short, the Team Arena engine is an enhanced version of the Q3 engine with support for outdoor terrain, like the aforementioned titles. 24.195.73.167 04:51, 14 November 2005 (UTC)

- The 'Team Arena' game, as boxed, runs the same executable as the stock Quake 3 Arena program, and runs the same code-paths. There is no technical difference except for replacement QVM files that change how numerous features work, and dramatically re-write how the UI is handled to support a fairly obtuse and primitive 'scripting' language. WolfWings


 * Same engine or not, if it's mentioned in the article as some different entity it should be explained what is it and how it enhances over the previous engine OR be removed, full stop. I have no clue about them, and reading the article I was confused after seeing the list of Team Arena-powered games with no previous mention to it.
 * BTW, if someone prevoides the clarifications and mentions QVM it should also be explained.--Outlyer 19:41, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

While not quite the same as the 'original' Quake 3 engine, the Team Arena changes were folded into the main Quake 3 codebase and even without owning Team Arena I suppose people who installed the latest updates/patches were all "switching" to the Team Arena flavor of the engine. Really, I would not call it the Team Arena engine. My guess is the article just wanted to specify that they were licensed the already improved Quake 3 code rather than one of the early iterations of it. 71.120.201.39 (talk) 18:20, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

"Powered by"

 * Powered by sounds too much like a marketing term to me, and hurts MY perceived NPOV. I've replaced it to "games using ...", just like the previous Quakes engines' entries.--Outlyer 19:41, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

How about "Rendered with", it seems less like a marketing term and it does describe what it is used for. Wethilio (talk) 01:12, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Animation

 * Both MD2 and MD3 use morph target animation. The major difference is that MD3 splits the model in head-torso-legs, while MD2 is a single mesh. MD2 models were shaky because the file format lacks precision in vertices (used integers instead of floats for vertex coordinates).

007 Games

 * Should there be an entry for the cancelled PS2 The World Is Not Enough video game? Wouldn't it be wiser to just alter the entry so that it's for Agent Under Fire? -TonicBH 21:22, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
 * I was informed that 007: Nightfire for PC was based off Quake III, true? - —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.244.234.173 (talk • contribs) 01:36, May 26, 2006 (UTC)
 * No, Nightfire for the PC uses GoldSrc. The console versions possibly are based off a modified id tech 3, but I'm not sure. --TonicBH 20:35, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Console versions of Nightfire used a custom engine written by Eurocom. 91.105.158.38 (talk) 10:32, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

KingpinQ3 Project
Hey, i have added the KingpinQ3_Project recently to the Id Tech 3 page under the section "Projects based on the GPL source release". This project is still in development and will be a free standalone game based on this engine. From my point of view it is a notable project but the entry has been removed by an editor called "Leileilol". He is a Open Arena team-member and i don't know what problem he has with our project. He's talking bad about us in topics, calls us a illegal project and I'm sure he doesn't have a single proof for it. We are not illegal, we are a clone, like Linux a clone of Unix is. I would like to add KingpinQ3 to Id Tech 3 ? Does anybody have serious reasons against that ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 0xA5EA (talk • contribs) 16:48, 5 January 2008 (UTC)


 * If you use ANY of the copyright assets from Kingpin or from Quake 3, then it is illegal to distribute them (Which, as a standalone game you'd need to do). If all of your assets are original (or at least licensed in a way that permits you to distribute them), then the only thing I see as wrong is the name. I don't know if Q3 infringes on any Id trademarks, but Kingpin certainly will infringe on Xatrix/Grey Matter's trademark. The name Linux is different enough from UNIX to keep them from infringing on trademarks.


 * On a side note, I don't really think any old mods or derivatives are automatically notable. OpenArena is more notable as it is. There are possibly hundreds of Quake 3 mods and offshoots and Wikipedia shouldn't list all of them. OpenArena is included as a package in numerous Linux distros and on numerous websites like osreview. I do not see any sort of widespread coverage or general knowledge of KingpinQ3 anywhere and Wikipedia is not the place to drum up support or advertise your product. 71.120.201.39 (talk) 18:35, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Links
The quality of the three linked blog posts about the engine is mediocre at best. I'd remove them; but i already know a lot about the way q3 works. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.63.10.226 (talk) 22:33, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

InvSqrt Links
While I was entertained reading the two stories about the origin of the InvSqrt in the 'external links', it is only tangentially connected to the article's topic and really seems irrelevant. I am removing them. Argue to keep 'em if you feel they're important! 71.120.201.39 (talk) 18:13, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

IW 4.0
Not sure about the original IW engine but shouldn't 4.0 have some reference as Infinity Ward based it on Id Tech 3? CHRONOS ome 18:54, 14 May 2010 (UTC)  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chronosome (talk • contribs)

Concerning ioquake3
It has a vanilla renderer hence technology-wise it's not different from id tech3 almost at all on graphics. However, there are two projects based on it that are at the equivalent of id tech 4 or more. One of them is 'bumpy' renderer (Full Bump Mapping support, Vertex Buffer Objects, GLSL, etc.), and the other Xreal (similar features). Such features can be found only on id tech 4 onwards. --194.219.254.51 (talk) 08:12, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

ioquake3 also has a new renderer in test builds: https://github.com/ioquake/ioq3/blob/master/opengl2-readme.md TimeDoctor (talk) 15:47, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Ioquake3 actually has a lot of differnet features. Actually even before upgrading its rendering engine, the 2007-ish equivalent version of ioquake3 already included stereo rendering, both the kinds used in 3d tvs and anaglyph rendering. There are actually so many features that I doubt anyone even knows more than 50% of the features the game engine changes from the id tech 3 engine, so I really wonder why the page was merged back into this page, because you really can't talk aobut ioq3 without its own page.ZdrytchX (talk) 22:02, 5 April 2018 (UTC)

CoD open source?
There's a line in the article claiming that Call of Duty's engine is based on the open source (GPL) release of IT3. This seems implausible, as the GPL would essentially require that CoD's IW engine be open source as well, but afaik it isn't. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.103.135.16 (talk) 08:59, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Ioquake 3 and lugaru
Not sure whether lugaru is ioquake3 based, if so, perhaps add to ioquake3 games list, see http://blog.wolfire.com/2010/05/Lugaru-goes-open-source It's stated it's based on Ryan C Gordon's branch, and he has ioquake3 in it's branch, however also many other game engines/games. KVDP (talk) 10:33, 29 October 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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Games using Übertools
I have seen the Table which claims Call of Duty (2003) uses Übertools, this is not correct.

I own a copy of the game so I did look into the gamefiles and the fact alone that it has a seperate sp and mp executable is a dead give away that it is not a Übertools game, because there would be no point in having seperate executables, in Übertools singleplayer and multiplayer is on the same codebase, so basically you can use Singleplayer content in Multiplayer as long as certain criteria and handlings are present.

How ever I made a list that has more indicators:

Here are some medium indications for that:  there are many filetypes that are not in Übertools games (mostly because it is done different or already included in other files) the scripting resembles a rudimentary likeness to scripting used in FAKK2 and Allied Assault, but is not nearly as comprehensive scripts are mainly scattred all over the place and are mostly for configuration and setup of objects there is a hunkusage.dat, something I have never seen with a Übertools game script files are not using .scr file-extension 

Here are some strong indications for that:  the bsp files start of with: ibsp</li> <li>no tiki files (they use a different language for model configuration)</li> <li>no urc files (they use a different language for menus)</li> <li>binary model files are arranged completley different</li> <li>the scripting uses operators that are used in completley different context in Übertools</li> </ul>

Files that should not exist, because Übertools has SP and MP code in one codebase: <ul> <li>ui_mp_x86.dll</li> <li>game_mp_x86.dll</li> <li>cgame_mp_x86.dll</li> <li>CoDMP.exe</li> </ul>

Even if they would have made modifications to the code and changed things to make them easier or better (which they are technically speaking mostly not), they would not have removed features to add something else that resembles the abilities and structure of the Übertools features so closely but with much less functionality to just about match their requirments.

I am a 100% sure Call of Duty is not a Übertools game. To verify that further, you can look into the Heavy Metal Fakk2 and Elite Force 2 GDK/SDK that was released that contains the gamecode in which you can see how sp and mp code is mostly seperated in different files and with if checks.

I don't know on which bases/sources the claim is made that COD1 is a Übertools game, but EA-Games held a licence to Übertools for Alice and Medal of Honor Allied Assault. COD1 is a Activision Game and Activision did not aquire a License for Übertools.

There is also a Interview, I could not find, but it still exists with former Medal of Honor Allied Assault developers that did create COD1 after MOHAA and they mention that they had to basically start from scratch without Übertools. Chrissstrahl (talk) 12:05, 24 June 2023 (UTC)