Talk:Indian Institute of Management Lucknow

It's "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow"
... and not "Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow". The word "Lucknow" forms part of the name, and there is no comma that separates it from "Indian Institute of Management".
 * This is incorrect per UNIGUIDE. -- DanielKlotz (talk · contribs) 02:06, 31 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Disagree. IIMs are not really part of a university system (unlike the University of California for example), they are all independent institutes which are not affiliated to any common university. Except for the fact that their names are similar and they are all public institutes ultimately run by the HRD Ministry in India, there is no connection. The name of the institute is not dependent on the name of the city - for example, IIM Calcutta's name was not changed to "IIM Kolkata" when the city's name was changed. Aurorion (talk) 09:40, 31 July 2012 (UTC)
 * OK. This should be changed in the info box, too. But, why does their official website usecthe comma? -- DanielKlotz (talk · contribs) 10:57, 31 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Good question. Maybe Anbu121 can shed some light on this. The websites of most other IIMs do not have the comma: IIM-C, IIM-B, IIM-K.

globalize
Should we claim that Manfest is one of the best in India or should we rather place it somewhere between the events of the best b schools like harvard, standford etc? Students here are undoubtedly the best in corpo india. how about the world?doles 13:44, 18 October 2005 (UTC)
 * That question is moot now as someone has NPOV'd the whole thing out of existence. So I've removed the globalize tag. Need to start from scratch now. --Ravikiran 19:23, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

Have removed a lot of other NPOV matter like "best infrastructure among the world's B-schools. The page has been marked for speedy deletion. Someone please check my edits and remove the notice if the speedy deletion criteria is no longer met. kapitanniemand 21:34, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:IIML.jpg
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Fair use rationale for Image:FAUNA - 1.JPG
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BetacommandBot 05:28, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:DRAGON IIML2.JPG
Image:DRAGON IIML2.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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Caution; removing copy vio, unreferenced/promotional statements
I am in the process of searching for reliable sources and placing information only if the same is validated by reliable sources. As my previous request to the editors of the page was not responded to, I have removed all information that is without sourcing. Some of it also had copy violation issues directly from IIM Lucknow blog sites. Kindly do not copy paste material from the net. If there's an exceptional claim, kindly add that only after you have ensured that the claim is backed by reliable sources. Beyond that, you could follow some of the work that I shall initiate on the page and learn how to add reliable sources and how to paraphrase statements. If you require any support whatsoever, please feel free to write to me on my talk page. Kind regards.  Wifione    .......  Leave a message  16:43, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

Neutral Point of View
I am a student of IIM Lucknow. If you find any of my edits to this article as biased or not written from a neutral point of view, please notify me or make appropriate changes yourself. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 09:35, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't find anything biased in this article. In fact, I think it's rather well-written. However - since you say you are student at IIM Lucknow - could you verify the first section of this discussion page, i.e., the official name of the institute? From what I know, some other IIMs like Calcutta, Bangalore, etc. are named as "Indian Institute of Management Calcutta", "Indian Institute of Management Bangalore", etc. Is this the case with IIM Lucknow as well? I know that whoever made the section here claims that it is "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow" - but the contact section on IIM Lucknow's website gives the name of the institute as just "Indian Institute of Management", followed by the address with "Lucknow" in it. The logo on the left of the website also says "Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow". So which is correct? "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow" or "Indian Institute of Management, Lucknow"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aurorion (talk • contribs) 20:50, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * All the official documents say "Indian Institute of Management Lucknow". Even the official logo does not contain comma. The website development was outsourced and hence the inconsistency. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 22:56, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Reliable sources
In good faith towards Anbu's self disclosure and his request to me on his talk page, I've removed the COI tag. I suggest we proceed step by step. First the lead section. Once we've addressed these issues, I'll move to the next sections. Thanks. Wifione  Message 06:26, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
 * It is also engaged in Research and consultancy work with a focus on socially relevant projects: Please provide valid sources to support this statement. MSN is not a reliable source.
 * Major festivals organised by the institute includes Manfest (Business Conclave), INDEX (Market Research Fair) and Varchasva (Sports and Cultural Festival).: Please provide reliable sources that confirm these are major festivals. If the sources are given within the article, just mention the links here as I'm proceeding sequentially so have not cross-linked the refs.
 * Admission to the programs is done through Common Admission Test (CAT): Can you provide a reliable source please? Even an institute's source will do in this case; but the source has to mention which programs exactly use the CAT.

References have been added and CAT is moved to separate sub section -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 09:27, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Anbu, can you please show your reference links here? Please point out which reference are you using to substantiate which statement from the above. For example, your Yahoo link simply shows the opinion of Mr. Devi Singh from IIM Lucknow. That is a self-published statement which should not be used to make a definitive statement. Therefore, till you show such details, I am reformatting the lead. Also, I see no references that support the fact that the festivals being organised are major festivals. If they are festivals, they can be mentioned below in the article, not necessarily in the lead. I'll await your references. Thanks.  Wifione  Message 19:02, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

I think its OK to remove the festivals from the lead. There are many sources for the social relevancy statement, but all of them quote the IIML's press release. I am searching for an independent source-- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 11:09, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

I couldn't get independent secondary source for that statement. Lets move on. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 21:33, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

History section
I've changed the statements to match exactly what is given in the citations provided. If you feel anything has been missed out, do mention. Thanks. Wifione  Message 19:20, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

I have added the missed out part.-- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 11:09, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Comments
I haven't really worked on article assessments, but how about the following:
 * Try Tony1's redundancy excercises. They'll help you weed out unrequired stuff.
 * An example of how it will help: During the initial days, due to its remoteness, the students used to walk to the Highway-bypass Junction, which had a milestone saying "IIM Lucknow 3.4 km", to buy amenities and to hang out.
 * Try to avoid using commas if the sentence is perfectly correct even without them.

Done. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 11:25, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Giri institute of developmental studies: shouldn't this be "Giri Institute of Developmental Studies" ?
 * Maybe add the sanskrit (devanagari) for the building names? (I'm not sure what the policy on this is.)
 * 5 reading halls with seating capacity for 250 people --> each hall has 250 capacity, right? State that.
 * E-Journals, E-Databases --> check if WP:CAPS says this should be lower or upper case
 * Check grammar and spelling in general

Most of the sources are primary sources. The material that is referenced from these sources is not necessarily fact. For example: "is located in an isolated serene area". How can I be sure that the area is "serene"?
 * Sources

Looking at the sources it seems that books have been forgotten. Books are a great source of information and referencing, and people are bound to have written books on IIML. The only job is to find them and use them as references. Google books should be [//books.google.com/?q=IIM+Lucknow helpful] in that.

All in all, this article needs lots of good references (which shouldn't be too tough to find), and some redundancy, spelling, grammar checks.

Articles from National newspapers used as secondary sources.Could not find books. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 11:25, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

PS:As an exception, "Referred to as 'Hel(L)' by the students,[5] the rigorous lifestyle at IIM Lucknow is packed with academics, extracurriculars and entertainment." seems a clear (student) POV to me.--Siddhartha Ghai (talk) 04:11, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Changed. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 11:25, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Anbu, please do not comment between the comments left by another editor. It confuses the reader completely. Right now, it's completely unclear which comments have been left by the previous editor and which by you above. I've tagged the article as being based on self-published sources. I'll suggest that make a good attempt to find reliable sources, otherwise remove the exceptional claims. I'll go through the article tomorrow and give you some suggestions. Thanks. Wifione  Message 12:05, 22 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Only one third of the references used are self published and they have been used only to support authoritative facts. UNIGUIDE says self published sources are reliable sources in the case of authoritative facts. You have added the tag that self published sources are used inappropriately. Please read the article fully before judging that the references have been used inappropriately. As of now, I am removing the tag as I feel that self published sources have been used as per WP:UNIGUIDE. Please add the tag if you feel otherwise after reading the article fully. -- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 13:43, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply Anbu. Pagalguy.com, Indiaprwire.com, lucknow.org, indianmba.com etc are completely unreliable sources as these are not editorially acceptable. Claims about library, social infrastructure, board of governors, etc are exceptional claims completely based on self published iim Lukcnow sources. Same is the case with details within sections like "Administration". These are exceptional and should not be supported by primary sources. Add to this the fact that even statements like "Peacocks dwell on the grounds" etc sound so promotional. And a statement like this "The college is packed with regularly maintained lawns and tree lined pathways. Rooftop lawns have also been developed on the top of academic buildings." does not even have sources. Unfortunately, because you are a student of the institute, I really would like to see secondary sources for all exceptional claims. I'm again placing the tag. Please don't remove it. If you wish, you can have a week to find secondary sources. After a week, I shall proceed to remove all claims that I feel are exceptional and based purely on primary sources. But I shall not remove these claims until I've pointed them out here and given you at least a day to respond. Thanks. Wifione  Message 06:35, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

Response for your concerns on

1)so called 'editorially unacceptable sources':- Please read the source before tagging it as editorially unacceptable. The Pagalguy.com reference is not an editorial source at all. The source is an interview with the director of IIM Lucknow. I have added another reference to support the same statement. Also read the sentence for which the source is used and then give a valid reason why do you think the information in the source could be wrong.

2)Self Published sources for library, board of governors, etc:- Do you expect a Times of India reporter to go to IIM Lucknow Library and count the number of books there? As I already mentioned to you, there are around 20 college/university FAs in Wikipedia and all of them are written with Self Published sources. In most of the FAs, 50% of the references are self published sources. In this article only 35% of the references are self published. Please understand that it is impossible to write an article on a college/university without self published sources. WP:UNIGUIDE says Self published sources are reliable for authoritative facts. If IIM Lucknow website says so and so is the chairman of the board of Governors, it is an authoritative fact and it has to be accepted on the face value.

3)Promotional sounding peacock statement:- I didn't included this statement. An IP did. I have changed it now.

4)Lawns and Trees:- I have included references for them.

-- Anbu121 ( talk me ) 14:24, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

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