Talk:Indian martial arts/Archive 8

Kenneth Tennyson's racist campaign against South Asians
''no evidence in any indian religious text of anything that approximates martial arts... the greeks actually had documents, statues, historical evidence of greco-roman wrestling maneuvers and styles that you can correlate with current greco-roman wrestling.''

That is one of the most ignorant guesstamations I have ever come across. Did not the Greeks have religious texts of their own describing their warfare? The Illiad written by Homer is comparable to the Ramayana. Apart from Mallayuda, the Tamil historical text such as the Silappadikaram and the Purananuru (Four Hundred Songs of War and Wisdom) mention of the Dravidian martial arts. As far as statues are concerned, there are literally hundreds of thousands of them found throughout South Asia of warriors showing different fighting techniques. I have read many of your postings on other martial arts Forums including a book review on Amazon.com. Apart from martial arts, I have read other topics where you have posted or edited parts of items on wikipedia with anything to do with India or South Asia. On one topic regarding Asian American achievements you have deleted Congressman Bobby Jindal off the site and added another person from Korea and have stated that "bobby jindal is not the most attractive person to have on the asian american page". In one of the Martial arts Forums online you stated that "The Indians have a lot to owe to the Greeks in Martial arts". Did you just come up with this idea after watching the movie Alexander the Hollywood Blockbuster? Also, when talking about the origins of martial arts in India you have just mentioned on this page that it may have originated from Turkey. We have been talking about Greek, Chinese, and Indian combat styles. Did it ever occur to anyone that Africa has their own martial arts and that the Dravidian martial arts may have originated from there? In another statement you stated that Alex Doss being a Tamil and Joyce Gracie being a Brazilian do not have the authority to speak on Chinese and Japanese martial arts. So, does this apply to you too? After all, you are not Chinese, Japanese, or even Asian either... Aren't you contradicting yourself when you make rash comments like that? So you may have a Phd., but in what? The fact that the Dravidians of India having a lot of African traits probably ticks you off, especially when they tend to achieve in any field. Also, as far a peers opposing Freedom skies views, it is basically and only from two people namely you and JFD, not the whole world. It seems to me that you have something against those from South Asia and South Asian culture in general. More over people of color... Indran Croos 23:47, 1 September 2006

Are you threatening people now who speak out against your insensitive actions? For time memorial, you have been preaching about proper postings on wikipedia, INSTEAD OF PUTTING POVS on it. You must practice what you preach instead of getting drunk and simply going to a wikipedia site and removing someone from there just because your "POV" is that Bobby Jindal does not have an attractive face. The bottom line is that you are against people of South Asian decent. Indrancroos 03:00, 4 September 2006 (UTC)


 * if i remember correctly, i didn't remove his picture... i merely moved it down to the politician section that he was part of... the statement that he was not attractive was merely meant at his picture... i did not make any blanket statement on race.Kennethtennyson 01:13, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

You must make up your mind whether you did so or not. First you admitted that you removed his picture. Now you are saying that you didn't. I hope you are not under the influence of alcohol. It's just not professional when posting or editing things in wikipedia.Indrancroos 03:00, 4 September 2006 (UTC)


 * - first of all, the removal of bobby jindal occured late at night after a few beers and really, you must agree that bobby jindal really is not the most attractive person in the world


 * - if i remember correctly, i didn't remove his picture...

(cur) (last) 01:21, 24 March 2006 Kennethtennyson (Talk | contribs) (bobby jindal is not the most attractive person to have on the asian american page)

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Asian_American&offset=20060406035027&action=history

FYI: The Asian American page did not consist of a Politics section back then. It is only recent when the Politics and Sports section were added.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Asian_American&diff=prev&oldid=45194085

Indrancroos 03:00, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

I guess to Kenny, we all look alike.Indrancroos 19:44, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, for quite some time now, I have been quitely reading these posts from Kenneth Tennyson and JFD. They have been bashing other authors, editors, writers, and even stocking them via the internet. At one point, Kenneth finally admitted that he was drunk when he edited one of the articles on wikipedia. How do we know he is not drunk now. He has been preaching about clarity, and now he has proven that he has not been practicing what he preaches. He also thinks that whatever he says is the supreme truth just because he supposedly holds a Phd. He has claimed in this page and in other websites that in order for someone to write a book, post an article, etc. on topics, they need to hold a Phd. Anyone can simply post that hey have a Phd. online. So far, he has not proven online that he has one by stating what he has his Phd. in, what school he got it from, and what his profession is and in which state. Indrancroos 20:53, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Kenneth Tennyson's reckless behavior in other forums
As far as Kenneth Tennyson bashing other authors, here is an exerpt from a book review on Amazon.com:


 * Founder of the homemade Mushindo Karate movement, never studied under a legitimate teacher, or any martial art teacher, never set foot in Asia, completely disproven, shown to have plagiarized many photos and other materials from other published written sources. Of course he claims to have studied under masters in Tibet, and been a disciple of Okinawan Karate teachers - since disproven by such worthy sources as Gorge Mattson, et al. Was involved in an abusive sex scandal with several female students a few years back ("Sleep with me and I'll enlighten you" kinda thing), uses abusive and coercive tactics to control what ex-students say at him, a propaganda liemaster.

The person he is bashing is none other than Terrence Dukes (or the real Frank Dukes from the movie Bloodsport)

While putting others down, Kenny brags, or advertises about his martial arts expertise to scare people:


 * Hmmm... well, kalaripayattu has a lot of similarities with caopera, alot of jumping and posturing, and a lot of religious themes to it. I guess it depends on what martial arts you've trained in to determine whether I can kick A$$ or not. let's see... I'm a red belt second degree in tae kwon do and have some knowledge in shotoken. I've got to start learning about grappling though.

'''Freedom skies and myself are not the only ones who feel that Kenny is a racist. Here are some excerpts from users from other forums:'''

(The Armchair Analyst - Asia Times Forum)
 * I see. However, you sounded like a racist.
 * No, I have no "South Asian sensitivities". I am no nationalist/jingoist. I consider myself above it all.


 * ALL your posts are based on the rather silly assumption that militaristic power in the last three centuries is a sign of "greatness". It may be in a narrow Anglo-saxon way, but not in a Gandhi-Buddha sort of a way. Get it?


 * Civilizations such as India (actually even China until today) have NEVER had a negative impact on other civilizations that remotely matches yours.


 * You have generalized Indians to be bigots etc., I agree that SOME not all are. But the fact that you generalized it to include an entire ethnic group as "obnoxious", by definition makes you a racist. YES IT DOES!

(rocky - Asia Times Forum)
 * What inaccuracy are you referring to? If Brits came to India and got rich, was the wealth Indian or British? Besides looting, what exactly did British accomplish? While your bias is clearly visible with this statement, what is your purpose of posting this in this forum?


 * Isnt it quiet evident that even in yr 2005, it is difficult for you to get off your pompus ass, why on earth would anything written by Anglo-Saxon when Europeans were busy colonizing the world accurate? Isnt there a vested interest on part of the European to disparage Native Cultures and delibrately belittle their achievements?

That's just a couple of the many others. However, I do not want to clog up this page.

'''I have also noticed that Kenny tends to have a habit of cutting and pasting articles, and also cloning the article he had fabricated on a few web sites

I know that I am not the only one who knows this:

(Brahman - Martial Arts Planet Forum)
 * i really do hate to post on this topic seems as it was only to counter mine, which by the way it would be nice if you would simply post this on my topic were you could get a real discusion, were as here people might simply ignore you becuase of the topic cloning.

(Bliss - Asia Times Forum)
 * Thats not from a 'social studies journal' you fraud, thats a copy paste...

(rocky - Asia Times Forum)
 * I believe Kenneth probably picked up a web-site of some Tourist Board, most likely Kerala, and made a religion out of some possible over exaggeration.


 * But wait, it is the same guys who create more categories just to be the highest or tallest or biggest in that.

Kenneth Tennyson brews hate in martial arts forums:

(Kennethtennyson - Asia Times Forum)
 * Alas, this thread has degenerated into a hate fest not suprisingly enough in the South Asian section of AToL. Regardless, I want to posit something to all of the bigoted South Asians out there who think that they are the masters of the world, greater than any East Asian or white european...


 * First, without a shadow of the doubt the latter 3 centuries have been moved by White Europeans. Europeans and americans until the 1950's were the movers and shakers of the world.


 * However, What is the one, the only one, non-European country in the whole world that has been modernized for the last 2 centuries? 
 * -Japan, in East Asia


 * What are the only non-European countries in the whole world that was a colonial power, obtaining land during the colonial period?
 * -Japan in Manchuria, China in Central Asia


 * What are the current non-European countries that have reached first world status and Technology?
 * -Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, all in East asia


 * What are the two U.S. wars to result in a military defeat or a tie for the U.S.?
 * -Vietnam War and Korean War - East Asia


 * What is the only non-European country to have played a major role in WWI and WWII militarily?
 * - Japan, in East Asia


 * What are the three largest economies in the world today?
 * - U.S., China, Japan


 * Name one South Asian country to have ever won a military war against a European power?
 * - Hmmm........ India's independence against Britain does not count. Britain ruled India with the same amount of military personnel that it the French to administer all of Vietnam. Britain was broke after the war, and Gandhi was lucky he did not get himself killed for preaching non-violent protests (although I do admire him for it). If Gandhi had gone to Vietnam to preach his non-violent approach to freeing the country against the French, he would have been laughed out of Vietnam or possibly killed by the French.


 * Name one instance in the recent 1000 years of India's history in which it has won a military engagement against a foreign power?
 * -Hmmm.........


 * Name one instance in the last century, where a European or American military engagement did not result in complete annihilation of a Middle Eastern or South Asian power?
 * -Hmmm........


 * Name one country to have defeated 6-7 other countries in a span of a few days?
 * -Isreal against its Neighboring Middle Eastern countries


 * What are the shortest wars that the U.S. has ever fought with the least amount of casualties involving a majority of the U.S. military?
 * - Persian gulf war, Recent Iraq war, Recent Afghani war


 * Look, I want to state that I am not bigoted. It's just that I'm getting tired of reading racist posts by obnoxious people from South Asia who think that they are the masters of the world.

(Isn't that true that racists say that they are not racists?)

(Reply form Asterix - Asia Times Forum)
 * OK lets accept you are not a bigot for a moment there.


 * Now lets see who is a bigot here out of the two:


 * 1) A Non-South Asian who butts into a South Asian forum and starts showing why South Asians are inferior to East-Asians and Europeans!


 * 2) A South Asian who is discussing issues about South Asia in a South Asian board.


 * The person in (1) suits the profile of a Bigot more than the person in (2) above, I would say. What do you think, Kenneth?


 * Regards,
 * Asterix.

'''Kenny then appologizes for the offensive post above due to a few too many drinks... err... 3 cases actually:'''


 * Alas, if I could have taken back that previous long post on military history, I would have. My bad - now that I look at it, it does seem sort of vindictive and acrimonious. It just goes to show you that drinking 3 cases of Guinness and typing on forums does not go well together.

Kenny's hate brewing encourage others to do the same:

(agent Orange - Asia Times Forum)
 * Only difference being that he wouldn't have the shamelessness to claim another country's achievements as his own. Now that China has gained more confidence in the world, its people find it less of a need to brag about the past. For me, I don't really care who invented what. All I know is that any Shaolin cook or janitor can beat the crap out of any Indian guru.

(Butterfly Palm - Fighting Arts Forums)
 * I suppose the Indians will next claim that silk was discovered by a 2000BC Indian princess who happened to be singing and dancing round a mulberry tree one day (as they still do now in Indian movies?) and why not, given that the majority of Indian women in India to-day still wear silk sarees as an everyday wear.


 * Since humans or pre-humans needed to fight right from the stone-age period and the present state of archaeological knowledge suggests that the earliest humans were found in Africa, then we can say, guite confidently, that kung fu or MA in general must have been practiced first in darkest Africa and then maybe spread to India or that perhaps the early dark-skinned Africans tracked their way to the Indian subcontinent (bringing their primitive MA with them) and eventually evolved into the present day dark-skinned south Indians.


 * This should make a good topic for a PhD. dissertation.

(Butterfly Palm - Fighting Arts Forums)
 *  Asking someone to accept that one's jealously guarded family art actually originated in a small thatched-roof, dung-strewn village populated by a people speaking an unheard of language 1000s of miles away and 100s of years ago is very very difficult to stomache.  Indrancroos 23:37, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Kenneth Tennyson does not have the authority to dictate to others what is right or wrong given the fact that he had admitted twice that he was under the influence of alcohol when editing material on wikipedia or posting offensive material on other sites. He also lacks professionalism when he makes heavy personal attacks against other authors, scholars, and the general public on various other sites. Apart from his alcohol abuse and abuse of others, Kenneth Tennyson has so far not shown us what he has his Phd. in (for all we know, he might not even have a Phd. at all), what school he has graduated from. So far, there is no visible proof that Kenneth Tennyson holds a Phd. Also, out of all the scholars and authors, he has not quoted from a single South Asian for a balanced, non-biased proof. Even though wikipedia is pretty much a free for all site, he should not be wasting his time in the Indian Martial Arts section of Wikipedia. But, then, who am I to dictate on who or who should not be able to post anything?

... Oh yeah, and by the way Kenny, my posting about you does not go against wikipedia regulations as what you may call "vandalism". I am speaking out against those with such bevioral problems and pose direct or indirect threats to others in wikipedia. Who do you think you are about telling Freedom skies not to worry about you finding out where he lives? I am taking that as a threat to not only him, but to other users as well. Do that again, an I will surely report you to the Wikipedia department on your behavior. Regards. Indrancroos 23:37, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

look Indran cross
you are not discussing anything that is of any merit... you have accused me of racism - where have i made a racist comment? you have taken discussions out of other discussion groups out of context and further have accused me of being other people on other discussion groups that i have no idea about... as far as i can tell, you are having problem swallowing the fact that I disagree with your POV view of the world and you have nothing to add to the discussion.. you have not brought anything to the table to this discussion except accusations... and your viewpoint is quite POV on the world... you have also accused me of being drunk on two occasions - what are the two occasions? and did anyone disagree with my edits on wikipedia? No! as far as i can tell, the edits that you and freedom cross have made to articles have led to two to three locked articles...Kennethtennyson 03:08, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

blocked - looks like bakasuprman, indrancroos, and shiva's trident were blocked. Kennethtennyson 03:23, 5 September 2006 (UTC)