Talk:Italo Brazilian

Italian influence
"A bunch of loan words (italianisms), such as, batuta, partitura, sonata, ópera, dueto, tenor, soprano, escaramuça, escolta, piloto, cartucho, escopeta, sentinela, corsário, quiçá, novela, favorito, arlequim, bandolim, caricatura, pilastra, mezanino, pedestal, espaguete, macarrão, salsicha, aquarela, desenho, bocha, pastiche,  feltro, pivete, bisonho, cicerone, "

criticism
These words came from Italianisms that already existed in European Portuguese, they are not a direct consequence of the presence of Italian immigrants in Brazil.

Words like: libreto, nhoque, pizza, ravioli, lasanha, panetone, esquifoso, bisonho informática, can be considered as a direct influence of the Italian immigrants in Brazil.

Remover
I think that paragraph should be removed, since they already existed in European Portuguese that was brought to Brasil.

Italianate
Disagree. Maybe the paragraph is to be removed, not the words. It is not proved that the Brasilians learned them by Portugueses or that the Portuguese folks carried such Italian words in Brasil. On the contrary, you can find many of those terms (i.e. arlequim) in France, Germany, Canada, Argentina etc. and they were spread by Italians. Still now the Italian communities of Sao Paulo and Rio continue to (spread dialectal terms belonging to their Nation: foreign words such as pasteta or chapeuzinho italiano (milk & coffee), bananinas etc. which are included in no portuguese dictionary. Today those words, and many of the words above mentioned, are officially considered italian-brasilian terms. [Makakinho: 24 Nov 2006 - 16:22]

List of Italo-Brazilians
I made a page for a list of Italo-Brazilians, in the fashion of other lists on wikipedia. The list is mostly the same as the one that was formerly on the Italo-Brazilian page, but I organized it better. I removed the list from the Italo-Brazilian page, and just put a link to List of Italo-Brazilians under See Also. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Static Sleepstorm (talk • contribs) 16:56, 14 January 2007 (UTC).

ridiculous
it's ridiculous to say that "libreto, batuta, partitura, sonata, ópera, dueto, tenor, soprano, contralto, escaramuça, escolta, piloto, cartucho, escopeta, sentinela, corsário, quiçá, novela, favorito, arlequim, bandolim, caricatura, pilastra, mezanino, pedestal, ravióli, espaguete, macarrão, nhoque, pizza, lasanha, panetone, salsicha, aquarela, desenho, bocha, pastiche, esquifoso, feltro, pivete, bisonho, cicerone, informática, and many others" came directly from Italian in Brazil, which would make them, in fact, italianisms. This is definitely noy accurate.

Beware
Brazilian of Italian descent are VERY VERY VERY proud of being "Italian" though they have never been to Italy or ever speak the language. Beware of these pseudo-jingoists! They are fed falsities about their "race" from day one and pass them off as certainties without citations! (i.e. the Italo-Brazilian loanwards).

Also, does this sound iffy to anyone?

Coffee became the main export product of Brazil and there were few workers for planting and harvesting it. Furthermore, unlike sugarcane and cotton plantations, coffee required better trained and educated rural workers, and Europeans decidedly would be up to the job, since most of the Italian immigrants were peasants in their own country. Therefore, the Brazilian government started to attract more Italian immigrants to the coffee plantations. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.21.96.49 (talk) 18:47, 4 March 2007 (UTC).

Nationalism
Some guys are trying to damage the article, and they are from Portugal. I think that their nationalism and racism do not help to improve this article. Please, if you are not familiar with the Italo-Brazilian topic, shut up! Just my opinion... [Makakinho: 22 May 2007 - 8:39]

not 25 millions
The italians in brazil were 25 millions when the population of brazil were 169 millions. the 15 %. In the 2006, the population were 188 million, so the 15% is 28 million. When Brazil population will be 200 millions, the italians will be 30 millions, etc, etc..

More than 25 million
If we include all the people with either full or partial Italian blood, the number actually goes much higher. Sao Paulo state alone has at least 15 million people with either full or partial Italian descent. Parana, Santa Catarina and Rio Grande do Sul together account for over 10 million. People with Italian descent from those 3 southern states who migrated to other states (Mato Grosso do Sul, Mato Grosso, Rondonia, Goiania, Federal District) are over 1 million. Minas Gerais has more than 3 million Italo-Brazilians (again, either full or partial). Espirito Santo and Rio de Janeiro together have around 1 million Italo-Brazilians Finally, there are also small populations of Italo-Brazilians throughout the country.

Request for comment
There is undo/revert war in the migration section which is erased all the time, although following the official policy of Verifiability and citing sources, (contrary to what happens with the rest of the article which does not cite sources)89.181.200.245 14:12, 31 August 2007 (UTC)