Talk:Jadovno concentration camp

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Claim that Tuđman denied deaths in Jadovno
So Danko Plevnik claimed in an article in Slobodna Dalmacija that Tuđman "denied that any deaths took place in Jadovno during the war. This claim was put forward in his 1989 book Horrors of War: Historical Reality and Philosophy." In his Horrors of War book (or Bespuća povijesne zbiljnosti) he mentioned Jadovno on four occasions.

1. "Osim Jasenovca, Drašković je spomenuo i Borač, Gračanicu i Kulu Fazlagića, koja »uporišta mržnje i zla« »po brutalnosti zločina nad Srbima« »ni najmanje ne zaostaju iza Jasenovca, Jadovnog, Gradiške i drugih ustaških kasapnica«. (p.130)

2. "Godine 1963. on će u svojoj knjizi pisati da su u NDH »po uzoru na konclogore u Njemačkoj, osnivani strašni logori smrti: u Slanom na Pagu, Jadovnu na Velebitu, Jasenovcu, Staroj Gradiški, Lepoglavi, kod Siska, Slavonskoj Požegi, Koprivnici, Đakovu, Zemunu, bezbroj mučilišta i jama po Bosni, Hercegovini, Lici, Baniji, Kordunu, Dalmaciji i drugim krajevima. Na teritoriji NDH ubijeno je oko 800.000 Ijudi." (p. 137)

3. "U svom govoru u Jasenovcu, patrijarh German spomenuo je jasenovački logor iza njemačkih logora, uz Jadovno i Glinu, označivši ratne žrtve biblijskom slikom. Bilo je to doba, reče, »kad je Otac greha, zla i večnoga mraka zamahnuo svojim smrtonosnim krilima i prosipao krv i suze, zločin i smrt«, kad su »kršteni ljudi bili izvršioci njegove volje (...)" (p. 598)

4. "Najdalje je u tom »sintetiziranju« ipak otišao Vuk Drašković, koji u svom bjesomučju u hrvatstvu ne vidi drugo do »kaptolsko, starčevićansko, frankovačko srbožderstvo« proizašlo iz »vatikansko-frankovačko-kominternovske propagande«, a u Kuharićevu apelu za istinom o Stepincu ništa drugo do zahtjev »za još jedan Jasenovac i još jedno Jadovno«. Da takvi neodmjereni izljevi književne nepodopštine nisu u suzvučju s cijelim orkestrom kojekakvog »znanstvenog« tumačenja, nazočnosti njihove bubnjarske nesuvislosti ne bi trebalo poklanjati nikakve pozornosti." (p. 603)

He doesn't even discuss the number of victims in the book, let alone claim that no one died at Jadovno. Tzowu (talk) 20:53, 22 April 2017 (UTC)

Also, according to this article, Tuđman stated that around 25,000 people were killed in Jadovno: "Dr. Franjo Tuđman, u svojstvu povjesničara tvrdio je da je na Jadovnom izgubilo živote oko 25 tisuća ljudi". Tzowu (talk) 21:18, 22 April 2017 (UTC)


 * I've removed it until a better source comes up. 23 editor (talk) 15:20, 23 April 2017 (UTC)

Jadnovo.com
I've had a look at this site, and it seems like that of a community group related to victims of the camp. There is no evidence of an editorial board, or even details of the qualifications of the supposed editor-in-chief. It appears to be a self-published source and therefore unreliable. I have tagged the material cited to it, and will be removing it shortly unless it can be shown that it is a reliable source. Regards, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:53, 8 April 2020 (UTC)


 * I agree Jadovno.com is problematic, but my citations are from a book by Ante Zemljar, "Charon and Destinies", fully reproduced on the site, and more specifically from Italian army documents, for which Zemljar provides photocopies, gives Italian archive numbers, who from the Italian army sent him the photocopies and when, etc. Also these documents are cited, although very briefly, by very respectable authors - Slavko Goldstein in "1941: The year that keeps returning" (he cites a couple of sentences which are identical to the Italian docs in Zemljar's book), and Zagreb University historian, Ivo Goldstein, in his superbly documented "The Holocaust in Croatia", where under the section on Jadovno, he mentions these same Italian army reports and gives the same name of the Italian officer, while citing Ante Zemljar's book as his source, so obviously he considers this a legitimate source Thhhommmasss (talk) 03:04, 9 April 2020 (UTC)
 * In that case, the book should be cited directly, with a full citation. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:31, 9 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Also, if the reproduction of the book is a copyvio, you can't link it to WP. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:40, 9 April 2020 (UTC)