Talk:James Oglethorpe

Copyright violation?
On editing this page to add some links etc, I noticed that some dates (1st) were written as 'ist'. This suggests taht this text has been scanned and OCRed. Might this be a copyright violation? SGBailey 08:41 Dec 14, 2002 (UTC)

Merger
I think that this page should be merge with the page "James Edward Oglethorpe" as they Beefpelican 01:38, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Variety of English
Following the MoS, I have changed this article to British English as the subject was British, albeit with interests in America. 82.32.238.139 22:08, 25 May 2007 (UTC) fduf

Birthplace
In the table, it states the birthplace was Berlin, which contrasts with the article which states the birthplace was Britain —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.55.170.82 (talk) 01:38, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Birthdate
Hi, I read this page everyday, and it's been bugging me that Oglethorpe's death date and age are incorrect. He died at 88 years old in 1785 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.64.184.16 (talk) 01:30, 2 October 2011 (UTC)
 * So... just like it says? - Seasider53 (talk) 14:36, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * As visible in the time signature the post was from 2011; back then the article showed different dates. ...GELongstreet (talk) 18:16, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

General Oglethorpe in James Boswell's Life of Samuel Johnson
Oglethorpe appears intermittently in Boswell's Life of Johnson. While Wikipedia prefers secondary source, the following anecdote from the Life is too good to pass up. It occurs when Boswell, Johnson, and Oliver Goldsmith are dining at the General's:

The General told us, that when he was a very young man, I think only fifteen, serving under Prince Eugene of Savoy, he was sitting in a company at table with a Prince of Wirtemberg, The Prince took up a glass of wine, and, by a fillip, made some of it fly in Oglethorpe's face. Here was a nice dilemma. To have challenged him instantly, might have fixed a quarrelsome character upon the young soldier: to have taken no notice of it might have been considered as cowardice. Oglethorpe, therefore, keeping his eye upon the Prince, and smiling all the time, as if he took what his Highness had done in jest, said 'Mon Prince,--'(I forget the French words he used, the purport however was.) 'That's a good joke; but we do it much better in England;' and threw a whole glass of wine in the Prince's face. An old General who sat by, said, 'Il a bien fait, mon Prince, vous l'avez commencé' and thus all ended in good humour.' Larry Koenigsberg (talk) 02:58, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

first paragraph and hotel
I have taken out one sentence in the opening paragraph, which states that a hotel has been named after him. Considering his importance in Georgia history - and the fact that Oglethorpe University exists - the sentence seems inappropriate in that prominent location of the article.Purplethree (talk) 23:34, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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James Oglethorpe's Involvement in the Royal African Company
I noticed that this article does not discuss James Oglethorpe's involvement in the Royal African Company. I believe he served on the board of directors and as the deputy governor of the company, which was itself designed to profit from the African slave trade. Mentioning his role is important to understand his development and why Diallo's letter had a profound impact on him as it directly contrasted his earlier views. Chief Lucy (talk) 19:29, 13 September 2020 (UTC) Chief Lucy
 * : I'm currently working on a complete rewrite of the article at User:Eddie891/Oglethorpe. I'll be sure to include this. Best, Eddie891 Talk Work 19:36, 13 September 2020 (UTC)
 * : Awesome! I went ahead and added two sentences at the end of the "Early life" section. Feel free to use or build out! I'll look forward to reading your rewrite. Best, Chief Lucy
 * I've found this book, which might be useful. Eddie891 Talk Work 01:17, 15 September 2020 (UTC)

Indigenous Cooperation
"indigenous peoples were sovereign nations, it is remarkable how often ordinary usage reinforces a contrary view … by accepting European (and, later, American) talk of ruling peoples and territories." (479) This quote was written by James H. Merrell in The William and Mary quarterly journal. I think its an important distinction in the case of the Colony of Georgia that the settlers largely benefited from relationships with the natives. The Native peoples of the area, notably the Creek and Cherokee, were well versed in European relations and had adapted it in their economic system which was a stark contrast the more well known native encounters with European settlers. I think this should be elaborated more as it is often looked over that the natives were an essential part of the Georgian Economy in the early years, and not a population subjugated and toppled over by settler-colonialism.Jakobfree1 (talk) 01:15, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 September 2020
Tomochichi and Oglethorpe's partnership benefited both parties leading to established roads, peace between native tribes, accepted boarders and even educational opportunities for indigenous children. Jakobfree1 (talk) 01:31, 21 September 2020 (UTC) Jakobfree1 (talk) 01:31, 21 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate.  JTP (talk • contribs) 02:08, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Opposition to slavery - Moral or Pragmatic?
According to this article, Oglethorpe opposed slavery from merely pragmatic reasons:

''Oglethorpe opposed slavery because he felt that it prevented Georgia from serving as an effective buffer, because he felt slaves would work with the Spanish to gain their freedom. Further, Georgia was not intended to develop a thriving economy like the Carolina's, and thus didn't need to use slaves. The colony's economy was intended to be based on silk and wine, which made large-scale slavery unnecessary. He also felt that slavery would have a negative effect on "the manners and morality of Georgia's white inhabitants".''

This may or may not be right, but it is not consistent with a couple of other Wikipedia articles. From Granville Sharpe:

''Sharp's work attracted the attention of James Oglethorpe, who had long been concerned with slavery as a moral issue. The two men remained close until Oglethorpe's death in 1785.''

And from Abolitionism:

James Oglethorpe was among the first to articulate the Enlightenment case against slavery, banning it in the Province of Georgia on humanitarian grounds, and arguing against it in Parliament, and eventually encouraging his friends Granville Sharp and Hannah More to vigorously pursue the cause.

Either those articles are wrong, or this one is. I hope someone who knows enough can correct what needs correcting. LastDodo (talk) 12:16, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

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House of Commons
please change ((House of Commons)) to ((House of Commons of Great Britain|House of Commons)) two times 2601:541:4580:8500:E0FD:71F5:A991:861D (talk) 19:46, 26 March 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ Happy Editing-- IAm Chaos  06:54, 27 March 2022 (UTC)

The Canard of Debtors' Prison
A turn of phrase or two in the discussion of Oglethorpe's involvement with Georgia prompted me to offer this source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/40579014?read-now=1&refreqid=excelsior%3Aba7716ef355d048a887e88ab75338742&seq=1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.169.93.139 (talk) 05:00, 20 April 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 November 2022
Submitted with respect for an excellent article.

1. Change "He led some British troops in the Jacobite rising of 1745 and was blamed for British defeat in the Clifton Moor Skirmish. " to "He led some Government troops in the Jacobite rising of 1745 and was blamed for the Government defeat in the Clifton Moor Skirmish. ( Reason: Both sides were British )

In Return to England: The article assumes a common error that all Jacobites were Scottish, that only Scots fought for that cause and that all Scots supported them. Also, both sides were British and a better way to describe those opposed to the Jacobites would be "Government"

Change

"Oglethorpe fought in the British Army during the Jacobite rising of 1745. By then a major-general, he took command of troops that were mustering in York, England, about 600 men. Jacobites invading under Charles Edward Stuart penetrated into England. Oglethorpe was tasked with intercepting retreating Jacobites before they reached Preston, Lancashire, in December 1745. On the 17th, he was initially ordered to engage with the rear of the Jacobites, led by George Murray, at Shap. The orders were amended to trap the Jacobites in town early the next morning upon Oglethorpe's intelligence, but the Jacobites left as the orders were changed. The following day, Oglethorpe travelled to Clifton in Westmorland and took a bridge from the Jacobites before the Clifton Moor Skirmish that evening. At the skirmish, the Government troops were defeated. Because Oglethorpe had allowed Jacobites to escape from Shap, he was blamed with the defeat, accused of disobeying orders, and potentially being a Jacobite. The following year, Oglethorpe was court martialled for his actions. After a lengthy defense, he was acquitted by a panel of twelve high-ranking military officials, led by Thomas Wentworth.[106] On 19 September 1747, Oglethorpe was promoted to lieutenant general.[107] However, the Duke of Cumberland, who had been in command at Clifton Moor, 'blacklisted' Oglethorpe from holding command.[106]"

To

"Oglethorpe fought in the British Army during the Jacobite rising of 1745. By then a major-general, he took command of troops that were mustering in York, England, about 600 men. Scots invading under Charles Edward Stuart penetrated into England. Oglethorpe was tasked with intercepting retreating Scots before they reached Preston, Lancashire, in December 1745. On the 17th, he was initially ordered to engage with the rear of the Scots, led by George Murray, at Shap. The orders were amended to trap the Scots in town early the next morning upon Oglethorpe's intelligence, but the Scots left as the orders were changed. The following day, Oglethorpe travelled to Clifton in Westmorland and took a bridge from the Scots before the Clifton Moor Skirmish that evening. At the skirmish, the British were defeated. Because Oglethorpe had allowed Scots to escape from Shap, he was blamed with the defeat, accused of disobeying orders, and potentially being a Jacobite. The following year, Oglethorpe was court martialled for his actions. After a lengthy defense, he was acquitted by a panel of twelve high-ranking military officials, led by Thomas Wentworth.[106] On 19 September 1747, Oglethorpe was promoted to lieutenant general.[107] However, the Duke of Cumberland, who had been in command at Clifton Moor, 'blacklisted' Oglethorpe from holding command.[106]" Piers Skerwhit (talk) 14:10, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
 * ✅ RealAspects (talk) 13:03, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 Oct 2023
In 1923, the president of Oglethorpe University Thornwell Jacobs excavated the Oglethorpe family vault in the centre of the chancel at All Saints'. Jacobs had asked permission to translate the General's relics to a purpose-built shrine at Oglethorpe University (Atlanta) but withdrew it after protests.(add citation below)

New Citation: The Times, FROM THE ARCHIVE How the Times prevented an exhumation On this day 100 years ago, October 17 2023

Note: fixed date from 1930's to 1923, clarified that wasn't formally rejected but withdrawn, added citation from Times newspaper. 2A00:23C8:7290:3701:4138:9BB1:D140:B709 (talk) 11:27, 17 October 2023 (UTC)