Talk:Jo Walton

Ex-husband info
In her book "What Makes This Book So Great" (p. 320), she mentions an ex-husband. There is no mention in the wiki page of a former spouse. Hotgardener (talk) 18:07, 15 July 2020 (UTC)

Hugo, Nebula, and World Fantasy nominations error
The article states "Among Others is one of only seven novels to have been nominated for the Hugo, Nebula and World Fantasy Awards." This is incorrect. There are actually 21 novels that have been nominated for all three awards. They are:
 * A Game of Thrones
 * A Stranger in Olondria
 * American Gods
 * Among Others
 * Bone Dance
 * Borderline
 * Briar Rose
 * Brittle Innings
 * Declare
 * Expiration Date
 * Finch
 * Gideon the Ninth
 * Inferno
 * Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell
 * Last Call
 * Little, Big
 * Mexican Gothic
 * Perdido Street Station
 * Piranesi
 * Tea with the Black Dragon
 * The City & The City
 * The Claw of the Conciliator
 * The Curse of Chalion
 * The Drowning Girl
 * The Fifth Season
 * The Goblin Emperor
 * The Hundred Thousand Kingdoms
 * The Killing Moon
 * The Obelisk Gate
 * The Ocean at the End of the Lane
 * The Other Wind
 * The Poppy War
 * The Shadow of the Torturer
 * The Strange Case of the Alchemist's Daughter
 * The Sword of the Lictor
 * The Ten Thousand Doors of January
 * Towing Jehovah
 * Trail of Lightning
 * Uprooted
 * Who Fears Death
 * Witchmark — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:681:100:4A60:7C16:3BC6:BFB9:ECB0 (talk) 01:04, 29 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Your edit creates text-source integrity issues, as the cited source (The Austin Chronicle) states "one of only seven". Also, your list is incorrect. I haven't checked all of it, but it contains many books that were not Hugo nominees (A Game of Thrones, A Stranger in Olondria, Borderline, Briar Rose, Last Call, ...), so there's no basis for "one of only 41". As such, I'm reverting your edit. Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 01:54, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I checked it again, this time removing the "honorable mentions" and "nominations under cutoff" for the Hugos, and I came up with 21 books that were nominated for all three awards (my source is the Internet Speculative Fiction Database: http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/award_category.cgi?261+1 http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/award_category.cgi?413+1 http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/award_category.cgi?532+1). Whoever calculated it before must have had an error in their spreadsheet formulas, caused by "no award" breaking the list. The 21 novels that received all three nominations are as follows:
 * American Gods
 * Among Others
 * Bone Dance
 * Gideon the Ninth
 * Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell
 * Little, Big
 * Mockingbird
 * Perdido Street Station
 * Piranesi
 * Tea with the Black Dragon
 * The City & The City
 * The Claw of the Conciliator
 * The Fifth Season
 * The Goblin Emperor
 * The Hundred Thousand Kingdoms
 * The Obelisk Gate
 * The Sword of the Lictor
 * The Ten Thousand Doors of January
 * Towing Jehovah
 * Trail of Lightning
 * Uprooted 2601:681:100:4A60:2B65:80EB:F86B:9031 (talk) 18:35, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Mockingbird wasn't nominated for the Hugo or WFA (source), but the rest look correct. I count 12 before 2013, so The Austin Chronicle was wrong even at the time it was published. Thanks for pointing this out, I've removed the sentence entirely. Btw, a note: while ISFDB is usually accurate, it is a user-generated wiki and so it isn't considered a reliable source to cite here. (An ok substitute would be SFADB). Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 21:14, 29 May 2022 (UTC)

Welsh-Canadian
Welsh-Canadian means a person of Welsh extraction born in Canada, at least to broad segments of English readers. WP:CONTEXTBIO says we use a single nationality in the lead sentence - the nationality held at the time the subject became notable. If the subject did not become notable until after emigrating to Canada, they are described solely as Canadian in the lead sentence, otherwise as Welsh. WP:CONTEXTBIO says we only include nationality in the lead sentence, not ethnicity. In Welsh-Canadian, Welsh is being used as an ethnicity. Skyerise (talk) 06:41, 14 November 2022 (UTC)


 * I don't see where that MOS guideline talks about a single nationality? The source is The Oxford Companion to Fairy Tales, which explicitly states Welsh-Canadian science fiction and fantasy writer and poet. Since this is a scholarly source, it seems perfect for determining which of Walton's nationalities is notable (per the source, both). Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 06:54, 14 November 2022 (UTC)


 * The phrase does not mean the same thing to all English readers, American and Australian readers don't read it the same as Oxford does. Hyphenated nationalities are misleading. Did you actually read WP:CONTEXTBIO: "previous nationalities or the place of birth should not be mentioned in the lead unless relevant to the subject's notability". Really I got it wrong, it should be 'Canadian'. But put an 'and' in it and I have no objections to including Welsh. Skyerise (talk) 07:00, 14 November 2022 (UTC)
 * "unless it is relevant to the subject's notability" - precisely; what I mean is that "notability" is best determined by an Oxford Companion bio (rather than by nationality at the time she won awards). In any case, I have no objections to your current wording. Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 07:10, 14 November 2022 (UTC)


 * That's not what relevant to notability means. We don't for example introduce black Americans as African-American, unless they were involved in an incident or protest which was notable because of their race. Once a person emigrates from Wales to Canada, they are of Canadian citizenship or nationality, and the use of Welsh is an ethnicity. Welsh-Canadian is ethnicity-nationality. Oxford's manual of style allows this; Wikipedia's manual of style does not. We don't use them even if they can be sourced to Oxford. It's not so hard to add 'and', which makes it mean the same thing to all readers. Skyerise (talk) 07:22, 14 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Dual citizenship is certainly possible, e.g. Alan Cumming (and there's the hyphenated David Thompson (explorer)). So I would not say with 100% confidence that Welsh is ethnicity while Canadian is nationality (or even that Oxford's MOS differs from ours). Mentioning both with the "and" seems ok. Olivaw-Daneel (talk) 08:17, 14 November 2022 (UTC)