Talk:Joan

Requested move 19 May 2024

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) BilledMammal (talk) 12:43, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

– The given name is the primary topic. None of the other entries comes anywhere close. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:57, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Joan → Joan (disambiguation)
 * Joan (given name) → Joan
 * Oppose. The TV series is getting |Joan_(given_name)|Joan_(album)|Joan_(TV_series) several times the views of the name. Station1 (talk) 07:28, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
 * This is obviously recentism, as this topic |Joan_(given_name)|Joan_(album)|Joan_(TV_series) has been showing a lot of reader interest while still in the pre-release stage, and its long-term significance is hard to measure. Even so, if we compare it to Joans listed after another click, all-time views from Joan (given name) we see ~6k/day for Joan of Arc, ~5.5k/day for Crawford, ~4k for Collins, ~3.5k for Cusack, ... so all that we can really say is that the current navigation from "Joan" is not serving the average reader well.
 * (Regardless, it probably should be pointed out that the previous graph shows a single day of ~3k views for the TV series, whereas these other articles about Joans get that on average every day. |Joan_(given_name)|Joan_(album)|Joan_(TV_series)|Joan_of_Arc|Joan_Crawford|Joan_Collins|Joan_Cusack Here's a better comparison. Collins' article had a one day spike of 189k, while Crawford had a day with 155k views.)
 * Now, would this move be helpful? We don't really know either, because they'd still get a huge alphabetically sorted list where most of these top items are smack in the middle with very little help from the table of contents, and I don't think we have particularly positive experiences in this regard.
 * I'd rather recommend we try to put some of these at the disambiguation page, per my June '23 suggestion at WT:D. --Joy (talk) 11:26, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Weak oppose the name may be primary by long-term significance but clearly not by usage.  Crouch, Swale  ( talk ) 17:17, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
 * @Crouch, Swale what do you mean by usage, though? We know from https://wikinav.toolforge.org/?language=en&title=Joan that all identifiable traffic from Joan last month went to the name or prominent uses of the name such as Joan of Arc. No other usage registered. Incidentally, I just noticed that the TV series wasn't even linked. Yet, nobody seems to have guessed the formatting of its title and went there from "Joan", but a more measurable contingent of readers did that for Joan of Arc. --Joy (talk) 07:15, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Well the fact it wasn't linked would mean it couldn't be clicked on so this doesn't show anything.  Crouch, Swale  ( talk ) 14:06, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Joan (TV series) has been in article space since 19 May 2023‎, and has received thousands and tens of thousands of views since, yet in an entire year, nobody bothered to add it to the Joan list. While this is certainly testament to search engines driving our navigation, the page "Joan" did receive around 5k views in the same time period, so it's still a tad suspect that none of those readers, some of whom had to have been searching for the TV series, bothered to reach for the internal search engine to find the TV series (which would have been registered in the clickstreams as 'other'), or in turn click edit to add the TV series. I checked the clickstream archive up to July and didn't find anything, either. --Joy (talk) 15:25, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
 * Oppose With the TV series and album, I wouldn't say there is a primary topic. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 05:16, 23 May 2024 (UTC)