Talk:Joaquín Lavín

POV issues
Saying that he is known for his populism is completelly biased (removed). There are too many different views about that and you can write what his opposition thinks about him (this is supposed to be read by anyone...).
 * Just saying that he is catholic is enough.

I disagree. The articles on Opus Dei and Catholicism make the differences very clear. Eliot 14:39, 15 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * After reading those articles I say that I give up on wikipedia. It's just too biased. I hope that someone starts suing it for some of the articles. Bye

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 * actually, im from Chile and Lavin is a recognized populist, and heres just a few examples from that:

-in his campaign for presidency in 99, he made something called "my 60 proposals", they were all pretty much proposals that made changes for the middle class, such as local daycares, for example, none of these changes really presented a change in social structure on Chile, as one of the other changes was "ill sell the air-force one, so that i would not spend my mandate elsewhere". Hard to say that any of these proposals made a change on the gap between rich and the poor, or made a change on health or education or in economics, they were written mainly for a dumber audience, with very basic problems. -while he was campaigning, his main offensive was not speeches, in fact... it was carnivals, Lavin toured through out all of Chile with his "batucadas", wich of course costed more money that one could think of (one just wonders why all these corporations just handed the money to lavin just like that, and the answer was that Lavin probably promised tax cuts, and other liberalizations), to this date, Lavin made the most expensive presidential campaing on the history of Chile, on the radio it was imposible to listen to it without hearing one of his campaign adds (wich usually was a salsa). after his loss, Lavin decided to run as santiago's mayor... the results were disastrous, as lavin quickly run off on money, mainly because of his populist campaings, he ran the biggest presidential campaign as a mayor of santiago: -created a beach on santiago, wich was a swimming pool with sand wich was brought in by truck, it was as expensive as it sounds, and lacked any practical use: the swimming pools were for children only. -created a ski place, on sunny santiago, again, lavin brought snow from afar an created his ski thing... wich was even more expensive than the last plan, and lasted even less. -made dubious plans to fight delinquency, such as "panic buttons", red car patrols, and little anti-deliquency booths. None of these made deliquency go lower, although they did proved to make the budget run off very quickly. Lavin spent the cash in dubious proposals, none of them really made anything better, as they all dealt with making the people happier ("bread and circus") and appearing on the news pappers. As lavin quickly ran out of cash, Lavin showed everyone that he could top himself... not only he raised the bar, he broke it now: -sold the rights for water, santiago used to had free water for both schools and public places, Lavin sold that to make quick cash... the result was the ski center (that lasted less than a week) and of course the loss of the rights of water, wich are now a new debt every year for Santiago. -Sold the building where the offices of santiago used to be. Yet, another bold move, he sold the building to get more cash, and the result was that now santiago has to pay for rent. -the results of all this was a void of 1500 million pesos, today Lavin denies the source, but doesnt denies that in fact he was a horrible mayor. there is more, of course. Needless is to say, that Lavins' popularity droped, now it wont even go up the 30% (as oposed the 48% he had in 99). Not to mention that it caused that the "Alianza por Chile", the coalition between the 2 right-wing parties to win the presidency, to split, now there are 2 right-wing candidates running, as RN did not wanted to see a hegemony of UDI in the elections.

I cant accept that
Im sorry but I just cant accept that, the "60 proposals" of Joaquin Lavin were ideas to help the middle class who has been for years pass over by the left coalition "Concertacion", to treat the one of us who vote for Lavin as "dumb" is an incredible political intolerance. And by the way the people of Santiago endorse the decisions made by Lavin as mayor, electing his favorite candidate Raul Alcaino independent from the UDI over the PPD left candidate Jorge Schaulson.


 * Exactly. Lavín is actually quite popular and is reflected by that fact that 1,601,169 voted for him. The split of the Alianza had probably more to do with Piñera's lust for power. I doubt you've ever read the 60 Proposals, since most of them are in fact pretty significant. As the previous post says, the people of Santiago supporter Lavín, since they voted for Alcaino. Additionally, your post was quite useless, since it adds nothing to the article.

oh dear, but Lavin lost in the recent election!, with less than a 25% of the votes, where were the people of santiago to support him?. I dont recall treating people who voted for him as dumb (ill need a quotation there), perhaps you should had studied a little bit to know that ours is still a presidentialist country mainly because theres a clear lack of political discipline (we are not europe, thats for sure), back in 99 it was a different year, we just had one of the worst goverments in history (Frei) and people really believed in Lavin as the next best thing, yet as i went through in all i sayd, i made it clear why he lost his popularity, losing to the RN candidate (and of course the socialist candidate), but most importantly, and considering that UDI is a much bigger party than RN, it all meant one thing: Lavin lost all outside-udi votes. About the campaign in santiago, the people went for Alcaino mainly because he was surprisingly the best choice (Schaulson being an unknown in the political field and Alcaino a respected TV host and Engeneer), yet if Lavin would had run again, we would just had to see if he would had won again. I read the 60 proposals, and none of them attacked the real issues of Chile, such as AFP, ISAPRES, unequality in wealth distribution and education for everyone. Most of the proposals were really simple: Jobs/crime/healthcare, yet from where would the fund would come for the most daring of the proposals?(such as to give salaries for neighborhood babysitting, where would a country with only a 20 billion dollar budget would get the money for that?). Many if not all of the proposals were very populists, and id be happy to go 1 by 1 on each of them.


 * Well I hope you are happy now we have Michelle Bachelet as president, obviously you think that she is better prepared that Joaquin Lavin to be the chief of state, but so far SHE HAS DONE NOTHING but embarrassing herself with ludicrous economic opinions (she doesnt understand the effect of the dollar in the copper industry) and trying to defend the mistakes of the Lagos administration (the embarrassment of patio 29) oh dear indeed. Agrofelipe 12/05/06

And now the students of Chile force her hand without problems, what a complete lack of authority, this Bachelet is a joke. Agrofelipe 25/06/06


 * Lagos?, you mean the dirt campaign of his name by the UDI in beginnings of the year?, so far Lagos is still seen as one of the best presidents in Chile's history, the UDI campaign proved of little importance as the strugles within the Alianza seem to be of more importance right now than pre-emptive attempt to discredit the man of the 70% poll ratings (such as millionaire debts for campaigns and of course that Piñera took the the helm out of the UDI's hands, and that the UDI has leadership struggles at the moment), and about Bachelet, I never sayd i supported her, on TV she has stated bold opinnions such as that the battle of Angamos ocurred on May (although, every chilean should know that the battle of Angamos ocurred nowhere near May) and of course the cherry on top about her statements on copper and dollars, so far she's beginning to look more like a Frei than a Lagos. About the students, you should research a little, it goes back to Pinochet's last day, in wich he signed the LOCE, wich effectively turns education into a profitable business, at the expense of education that is, and of course like many other goverment issues that were turned into a business by Pinochet (such as ISAPRES for health and AFP for pensions, all of them deeply criticized as down-right selective thievery), it cant be rooted out of the system as there are economics involved. Although, what a bold move to defend Lavin by attacking Bachelet, thats pure 100% punditry right there.

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