Talk:John Alexander Dowie

Elijah reborn
I'd like to see a heading about Dowie's claim to being Elijah reborn: a pretty contentious claim to say the least and one that falls right under the radar in this article, under the guise of his debate with Ahmadiyya.

He also claimed to be the "First Apostle" of the entire world--it would appear that he ended up suffering massive delusions of grandeur once he moved to Zion city

Debate with Ahmadiyya
It seems that an unusually large portion of this entry is devoted to his debate with the Ahmadiyya Movement.
 * Oddly enough, there's an mosque in the city Dowie founded.  A.J.A. 02:25, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree that the article is poorly written with that long rambling non-NPOV section on his debate with Ahmad. It also seems implausible that the Boston Herald would have an article titled Great is Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, The Messiah (unless the writer was being facetious). My suggestion would be to merge this article on Dowie into the article on the Christian Catholic Apostolic Church. 68.252.39.38 21:22, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I disagree with the suggestion to merge the article on Dowie into the article on the Christian Catholic Apostolic Church. My reason is that Dowie created a movement called Dowieism that had impacts on communities around the world far beyond the Christian Catholic Apostilic Church. This hyperlink provides the results for a search on "Dowieism" in (some) Australian Newspapers that are held in the archives of the National Library of Australia: http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/search?searchTerm=dowieism . This one search of one library's records highlights the impact of Dowieism in England and on colonies/states around Austalia. I have also seen reports on Dowieism in New Zealand.  To merge John Alexander Dowie into the suggested article seems a narrow POV.  I am researching migration and am seeing the impacts of Dowieism.  (Dowieism is not the focus of my research.) Hopefully, someone will generate an article on Dowieism or expand the article on John Alexander Dowie to tell the greater story.  In the meantime, I have created a Dowieism page that Redirects to John Alexander Dowie.--Cruickshanks (talk) 23:36, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

Please remove this section--it has no relevance to anything Dowie was involved in — Preceding unsigned comment added by Barry Morton (talk • contribs) 22:16, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

I would also humbly request that the section in relation to Mirza Ghulam Ahmad not be removed as he plays a vital part in the history of Mr.Dowie. Simple historical research will show that the Boston Herald did in fact print the article "Great is Mirza Ghulam Ahmadi, The Messiah." The article was in relation to a prayer duel with Mr. Dowie

Expand article
I have read a number of books on John Alexander Dowie, and there is so much to his life that is not written here. So many interesting and amazing things. The story of his duel with the Islamic movement is such a minor fact that I wouldn't even mention it. There seems to be a lot of bias in these attempts to show some sort of connection between an off-hand comments and his death. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.41.1.38 (talk) 04:57, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Huge addition
While I think the views and sources have merit, that is WAAAAAY too much volume of quoting. Please consider adding a much, much MUCH smaller bit, citing those as sources. I won't revert it again immediately but all this is not going to stay. Also, it was damaged. Looks like a paste buffer overflow.- sinneed (talk) 03:30, 2 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Agreed. Definitely a paste job. I'd question it as much on copyright grounds as content. --Mikhailovich (talk) 19:06, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

J. A. Dowie in Australia
Dowie's time in Australia formed a significant part of his life and ministry. See Barry Chant, The Spirit of Pentecost (Emeth, 2011) for significant original research material on this topic. taborpub.--Taborpub (talk) 01:50, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

I've been looking into this topic and will add some materials on it down the line, prob in the fall — Preceding unsigned comment added by Barry Morton (talk • contribs) 17:10, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

J. A. Dowie in Australia
Dowie's time in Australia formed a significant part of his life and ministry. See Barry Chant, The Spirit of Pentecost (Emeth, 2011) for significant original research material on this topic. taborpub.--Taborpub (talk) 01:50, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

I also think Barry Chant says much more about Dowie. This Wikipedia article has no mention of Dowie's church in the Sydney suburb of Newton where genuine miracle healings began nor is their mention of his crusades in Sydney

Extremely important debate with Ahmadiyya movement
Death of Alexander Dowie is considered very important part of History of Ahmadiyya and thus it is extremely important to keep this information on this page. It is also very important fact that Dowie was on the rise and very popular among his followers until he was challenged for a prayer duel by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad(as) who is considered Promised Messiah and second coming of Jesus Christ by Ahmadi Muslims spread across 200 countries of the world. Some sayings about Dowie by founder of Ahmadiyya Muslim Community along with references are mentioned below.

1. '''The best way to determine whether Dowie's God is true or ours, is that Mr. Dowie should stop making prophecies about the destruction of all Muslims. Instead he should keep me alone in his mind and pray that if one of us is fabricating a lie, he should die before the other'''. Review of Religions, Sept. 1902, Vol I, No 9 2. If Dowie runs away from this challenge, be sure that a great catastrophe is about to befall on Zion (Haqiqat al-Wahee, page 71)

When Dowie was told of this challenge, he boasted: "Can you imagine me answering to these gnats, and flies. If I were to put my foot on them, I could crush them to Death." (Leaves of Healing, December 27th, 1903)

The world press took special interest in this Mubahila (prayer duel); over 30 newspapers in the US published the news story. The Boston Herald in its issue of June 23, 1907 observed: '''Dowie died with his friends away from him and his fortune dwindled. He suffered from paralysis and insanity. He died a miserable death, with Zion city torn and frayed by internal dissension. Mirza comes forward frankly and states that he has won his challenge'''

The fact that Dowie had predicted destruction of Muslims and Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad(as) had challenged him for a prayer duel asking him to pray to God for his death only and the fact that Dowie was much more powerful living in United States and Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad(as) belonged to small town in Punjab, India makes this piece of information very important. Now Dowie's followers are no where to be seen and Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad's followers have spread in more than 200 countries of the world, united under one Khalifa of Islam.

Further information can be found on the following links touseef.rehan

Comment placed as reference on page
The comment below was placed in the article in the form of a footnote. Charles Matthews (talk) 08:51, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

''A more balanced biography of John Alexander Dowie is on the net at: http://truthinhistory.org/life-ministry-of-john-alexander-dowie.html This gives a better perspective on Dowie's life and ministry of healing which was followed by the Pentecostal movement. John G. Lake who was part of his ministry in Chicago gives testimony of the many healings that he experienced in his family and neighborhood. Because of John G Lakes ministry, this gives further credence to the authenticity of Dowie's ministry. The biography below does not give credibility to Dowie's ministry but lacks empathy for the healing ministry. Begindavid''

Cylinder Recordings of J. A. Dowie's Voice
THe following link contains several links to voice recordings of J. A. Dowie's voice recorded live. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.28.53.148 (talk) 02:49, 3 March 2016 (UTC)