Talk:John Cena/Archive 5

GA
I went and failed this article outright. It's heavily referenced, whih is great. However, there needs to be a 2-3 paragraph lead for an article this size. Even a 1 paragraph lead would be okay, but not a 2-sentence one. Plus, most of the paragraphs are one-two sentence ones, making it flow rather poorly. The 2004-2005 needs to be fixed up especially. Lastly, most of the outside of wrestling section is basically one sentence sections everywhere. Just have a good article writer fix up everything there and you can try again.-- Wizardman 21:13, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

Backlash question
Can I put a picture of John Cena that I took at Backlash? Clen_17 9:39, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I assume you'd be releasing it per GPL. Does it add to the article? Right now it's already coming close to being an image gallery.«»bd(talk stalk) 01:09, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Backlash & RAW matches
I don't know why people keep adding these matches, but they're simply not notable. Someone has claimed that among them are his first clean losses in three years, which would be notable, but needs to be (reliably) sourced, and even then the Backlash match wouldn't be worth noting. Unless the years of no losses can be verified, please don't add it back.«»bd(talk stalk) 01:12, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree. Zerorules677 17:15, 08 May 2007 (UTC)

Cena Signature Sayings
I was going to add his signiture sayings like. 1.You can't see me 2.Want some come get some. and so on but no its a protected article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tacodude21 (talk • contribs) 22:58, 13 May 2007 (UTC).
 * Quotes, properly sourced of course, would belong on a Wikiquote article, not here.«»bd(talk stalk) 21:23, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Word Life DVD
Shouldn't there be an article created of the DVD or mentioned in the article? Zenlax 10:11, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

The DVD is an entirely separate entity from John Cena, so it should have its own page. End of discussion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.216.119.56 (talk • contribs)


 * Sorry, you don't get to "end discussions". The DVD is barely non notable itself, there's really no reason for it to have it's own article. There's precedent to merge it here.«»bd(talk stalk) 23:27, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Word Life Redirect
I suggest removing the Word Life redirect at the top of the page. It is completely pointless as this article is NOT about Word Life but is about John Cena. Everytime I remove it, it gets placed back so I feel we should discuss reasons to keep or remove it. I am in favour of removing it for reasons already stated. -  Deep  Shadow  00:05, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * What has that got to do with it? The two words "Word Life", when placed in to the search box, turn up this article. That is also very likely something someone would put in when looking for Word...Life. Hence, a redirect. «»bd(talk stalk) 00:12, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Fair enough, but why does does the search go directly to Cena's page and not the album? If that problem can be fixed then we won't need the redirect anymore. -  Deep  Shadow  00:25, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Probably because the phrase is more closely linked to Cena. The redirect hurts nothing.«»bd(talk stalk) 13:25, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * To me it's just clutter and I think that article should just be deleted. Govvy 10:29, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
 * That's ridiculous. The article for the CD isn't getting deleted because it causes a DAB on another page.«»bd(talk stalk) 16:10, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Archive 4
I went ahead and created a new archive since this talk page was cluttered with a lot of dead discussion and all the headers made it rather long.«»bd(talk stalk) 21:26, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

The new image
I think it comes of a tad small when it resizes for the infobox, so how about cropping it to something like this, doesn't need resizing? «»bd(talk stalk) 18:06, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * That one looks decent, but does anyone want to use this one? Stormin&#39; Foreman 18:17, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * That one is from a screenshot of WWE television, and therefore a violation of copyright and Wikipedia's fair use policies for images, so we cannot use it to depict a living person. Bmg 916  Speak Sign 18:23, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * My apologies Stormin&#39; Foreman 19:03, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * No need to apologize, I'm sorry if I came off as any sort of rude. I just wanted to explain why we couldn't use it, again I'm sorry if you felt I was condescending in any form or fashion. Bmg 916  Speak Sign 15:26, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I can crop it!!!! Just give me some a few hours!!! BATMAN rules677 12:48, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Does the picture work now? BATMAN rules677 00:18, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Minor edit war over phrasing
I find this diff a bit troubling. I made a good faith edit that sought to improve the article. I reduced verbiage: "received" says the same thing as "found himself confronted with" in fewer words and with less POV. I removed parenthetical information and integrated it in the article, which improved the prose. "Fans in the stands" is basically redundant, since fans who aren't in the stands won't be noted for their signs or chantss, so removing that phrase reduces verbiage. Mentioning prior mixed reactions could be relevant, so I have no objection to including it, but the use of quotes strikes me as POV, as it suggests the reaction is not actually mixed. The commas in "he lost the match, and his title, after" are not good writing. They make the "and his title" phrase into a parenthetical, which basically encourages readers to either skip it, makes the prose herky-jerky, or both. I removed the detail about Heyman counting the pin because I don't think it's necessary to an article on Cena. That said, it's not a big deal, so I would not object to including it. However, too much detail in match recaps is one of the reasons that a lot of articles on wrestlers become 100kb cleanup jobs. I'm going to restore my prose and leave in the details that I deleted. Croctotheface 06:58, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't call it a war. You're right, I reverted it when I shouldn't have so I could get part of it back.«»bd(talk stalk) 11:45, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Almost ready to be renominated as "Good"
Things it needs, but I can't find.
 * A mention of (with a cite) the first instances of the "mixed reactions" in arenas before One Night Stand.
 * The WON awards need a cite or to be removed. I'm leaning towards removal based on the rumor mongering WON engages in.
 * Half of the "personal life" section can probably be moved in to an "early life" section (where he grew up, colleges attended, football career) that goes before career, and the other half into the lead (left handed, brothers) and the rest (cartoons, video games) outright deleted as non notable.
 * Cites for his appearances on random TV shows would also be nice.

A lot of people have done a lot of work on this thing, it would be nice to get it officially named a good article. If you can find some (reliable) places with information on this stuff please add it.«»bd(talk stalk) 22:26, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

The thing with Cena's mixed reactions can be found on any WWE Pay-Per-Views. This holds true especially for New Year's Revolution 2006, Wrestlemania 22 and ECW One Night Stand 2006, as you said. NYR 06 had Cena being booed whenever he got offence in in the EC, and fans cheered HHH and booed Cena in the Main Event, even though Cena was meant to be playing the face.--90.198.96.39 12:20, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, but what the article needs is the earliest possible review that specifically mentions the reactions.«»bd(talk stalk) 15:40, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Finishing move
I just want to be sure: The FU was, at some point, a Death Valley Driver rather than a Fireman's Carry slam, right? Ma-Mutt 00:36, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Cite?«»bd(talk stalk) 17:01, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

He doesn't need a site. And yes, it was referred as the DVD.

Weight
Can someone allow me to change his weight and site a reference for it, he ways 258 pounds now

Wow, that's big!!! Zenlax 03:33, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
 * No. Please don't change the height or weight. These are the measures as officially stated and they should not be changed.«»bd(talk stalk) 00:30, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

somone needs to change his weight to 258 lbs as because wwe.com never updates the weight in the stats section, last time I watched raw his weight was up to 258 lbs
 * See above.«»bd(talk stalk) 17:05, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Summerslam
It says in the article

"At SummerSlam Edge defeated Cena in Cena's hometown of West Newbury, Massachusetts, pinning him after hitting him with a pair of brass knuckles while the referee was distracted."

Actually Summerslam 06 took place in Boston, Massachusetts not West Newbury. I know the JR, Lawler, and Edge said it was in Cena's hometown. But the article still should be edited —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.255.170.110 (talk • contribs)
 * fixed«»bd(talk stalk) 16:24, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Context tag
added this - no idea what "pumping up" sneakers means. What does "You can't see me" symbolize? "World life?" i am a wrestlng fan and have of this i don't understand. I can't imagine how non-wrestling fans would interpret it. The "generalize" tag could have also fit but the context one had more of an exmplanation so I picked that.La Parka Your Car 20:45, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
 * This article doesn't need to explain what pumping up sneakers means, that what the sneaker article does. If that article fails to do that, edit that article. Word Life is an empty slogan that doesn't mean anything, and that's explained.

During this time Cena adopted a variant of the 80's WWF logo -- dropping the "F" -- along with the slogan "Word Life" as his "signature symbol".
 * To make it clearer I've wiktionary linked it to the interjection of Word. "You can't see me", like the sneaker thing, isn't Cena exclusive and doesn't need to be exceptionally explained here. That slang was around years before him.«»bd(talk stalk) 22:50, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

Good Article nominee
I don't think this article is ready to be a good article nominee. The references still need a lot of work (fitting the citation templates) and some other minor fixes. I'll try and work on it in the next couple of days before it gets reviewed. Nikki311 03:10, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Does it matter that Online World of Wrestling is the only source of RAW and SmackDown! results in the article? - <font color="teal" face="Herculanum"> Deep <font color="purple" face="Herculanum"> Shadow  05:36, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't see why it would. Using multiple places would get the exact same results since it's the exact same show.«»bd(talk stalk) 14:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm almost done with my minor fixes. One more thing, though. The lead is still insufficient. From WP:Lead: "The lead should be capable of standing alone as a concise overview of the article, establishing context, summarizing the most important points, explaining why the subject is interesting or notable, and briefly describing its notable controversies, if there are any. The emphasis given to material in the lead should roughly reflect its importance to the topic according to reliable, published sources. The lead should not "tease" the reader by hinting at but not explaining important facts that will appear later in the article. It should contain up to four paragraphs, should be carefully sourced as appropriate, and should be written in a clear, accessible style so as to invite a reading of the full article."

I've added a little more about his notability to the lead (his album and movie). Someone who knows more about him (which isn't me...I'm not a fan of his) needs to continue fleshing it out a bit. Nikki311 23:33, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Parts Taken Out
Why was the 5-6 Moves of Doom and Fan Backlash sections taken out of the article?

I did not feel like reading 5 pages to find a simple answer to this question. Those two subjects are very important to the aricle and are of high debate within WWE and in various sites that report wrestling. If Google dot fucking com makes note of the 5 Moves of Doom and Fan Backlash then Wikipedia should be encyclopedic enough to report on this.

Also the article is way to pro Cena. The article mentions that Cena beat the founders of DX at back to back WrestleMania's but doesn't site the crowd's response to him doing so.Also, it leaves out his feud with Triple H. How the fuck do you leave out a WrestleFuckingMania World Championship Title defense?

In the end, there is a lot that needs to be done to this page.
 * The reason the 5-6 moves of doom aren't noted is because it is not notable! It is something that has been created by wrestling fans. What fans believe is not encyclopedic.
 * A section dedicated to fan reaction/backlash is pointless. There is little to include in said section. Plus, it is already included in the body of the article.
 * The article doesn't include his title defense against Triple H because it doesn't add to the article.
 * There is a lot of work needed to be done to the page but not by adding fan reaction, speculation, opinions, and week by week reports. Those are actually counterproductive.
 * Also, sign your comments using ~ . - <font color="teal" face="Herculanum"> Deep <font color="purple" face="Herculanum"> Shadow  11:09, 13 June 2007 (UTC)


 * The FMOD are nothing but unsourced fan speculation, and the Fan Backlash was just a slander campaign in my opinion. It got watered down and it's still in the article if you bothered to read it. Plus, please act civil, and don't swear unnecessarily in every sentence. If you were dead serious with all the F-bombs, please calm down. Blacklist 07:26, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

PWI problem?
in the championships and accomplishments section, it says for the PWI that John Cena was wrestler of the year for 2006, but i clicked on the link to PWI, and it said Edge was the wrestler of the year. Which is the mistake? No its not Edge was wrestler of the year for 2006

The page must have been vandalized. <font color="Blue">Vermon <font color="Red">CaTaffy  <font color="Black">8 
 * The PWI page was vandalized, as is easily verifiable by the citations. John Cena was wrestler of the year in 2004 and 5, Edge has never been wrestler of the year. It has been fixed.«»bd(talk stalk) 15:00, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

John Cena Films
Does anyone know if anymore film are coming out with John Cena in them? I heard rumors earlier that there were. Obi-WanKenobi-2005 07:15, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
 * There is another film that will have Cena star in. The film is currently Untitled, and the plot is not known to the public. Blacklist 08:14, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I can't wait. Obi-WanKenobi-2005 23:25, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Even though it's still unknown to the public what the title of the film, let alone plot, will be. It's heavily rumoured this will be a live-action version of Dave The Barbarian with himself playing the title character User:AKR619

His age
Can Someone Please Notice He's 31 Now NOt 30 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.113.20.81 (talk • contribs)
 * He was born in 1977 (per this cite), which would make him 30. Also, the age is calculated by an automatic template.«»bd(talk stalk) 18:46, 25 June 2007 (UTC)