Talk:John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale

Lauder or Maitland
This article should be moved to either John Lauder, 5th Earl of Lauderdale or to John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale, depending on which name the subject carried longer or under which he was longer known. The present version (John Lauder or Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale) contradicts the naming conventions. Phoe talk 09:27, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Alas, in such biographies everything is not black and white. The Great Seal of Scotland records a charter whereby Charles Maitland, 3rd Earl, received his wife's inheritance of estates "under condition that their heirs take the surname of Lauder and quarter the arms of Lauder of Haltoun and Maitland" which was ratified in 1663. This also appears in the General Index to the Acts of the Parliaments of Scotland, Edinburgh, 1875. John (our subject here) agreed to uphold that when he was personally invested in those estates in 1691.

Foster's Collectanea Genealogica (London, 1888) refers to: "Sir John Maitland of Ravelrig, 1st Baronet, assumed the designation of Lauder of Haltoun" and took his seat in parliament as Sir John Lauder in 1685-6, 1689, and 8th September 1696."

I have seen other references to this muddle elsewhere. It is unclear which surname he held for the longest period. What do you do if the periods are equal? David Lauder 09:44, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


 * The Peerage and Stirnet ( have him as Maitland - while Google is showing no link for Lauder. In this discussion User_talk:Alci12 the argument was also for the first solution. If the periods were equal, I would take the birth name (how it is done at Charles Stewart, 3rd Marquess of Londonderry). Greetings  Phoe  talk 16:29, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

John Maitland was created a Baronet as Sir John Lauder, and only reverted to Maitland on inheriting the earldom of Lauderdale. Thus he fulfilled the requirements of the charter, which did take account of the possibility that Charles Maitland would become Earl. When this happened, John took Haltoun and the name Lauder — Preceding unsigned comment added by Familyguru (talk • contribs) 20:02, 15 June 2011 (UTC)