Talk:John Stuart Skinner/GA1

GA Review
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Reviewer: Ealdgyth (talk · contribs) 20:20, 2 January 2021 (UTC)

I’ll get to this later today....Ealdgyth (talk) 20:20, 2 January 2021 (UTC)


 * GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)


 * 1) It is reasonably well written.
 * a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
 * 1) It is factually accurate and verifiable.
 * a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources):  c (OR):  d (copyvio and plagiarism):
 * 1) It is broad in its coverage.
 * a (major aspects): b (focused):
 * 1) It follows the neutral point of view policy.
 * Fair representation without bias:
 * 1) It is stable.
 * No edit wars, etc.:
 * 1) It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
 * a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass/Fail:
 * Lead:
 * The first paragraph .... every sentence past the first begins with "He..." which gives a very clunky feel to the writing. While we're not looking for FA brilliance here, we do want the prose to be not this repetitive. Perhaps "During his life he held several civil and government positions. He is associated with farming, domesticated animals, and agricultural management and his publishing interests specialized in outdoor sports, especially those dealing with horses."
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:26, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass/Fail:
 * Lead:
 * The first paragraph .... every sentence past the first begins with "He..." which gives a very clunky feel to the writing. While we're not looking for FA brilliance here, we do want the prose to be not this repetitive. Perhaps "During his life he held several civil and government positions. He is associated with farming, domesticated animals, and agricultural management and his publishing interests specialized in outdoor sports, especially those dealing with horses."
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:26, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
 * The first paragraph .... every sentence past the first begins with "He..." which gives a very clunky feel to the writing. While we're not looking for FA brilliance here, we do want the prose to be not this repetitive. Perhaps "During his life he held several civil and government positions. He is associated with farming, domesticated animals, and agricultural management and his publishing interests specialized in outdoor sports, especially those dealing with horses."
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:26, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Not required, but suggest mentioning and linking the "Star Spangled Banner" at the end of the second paragraph.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:26, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Early life:
 * Again, we have a lot of sentences in here starting with "He..." try to vary this somewhat. I've done a few, but there are probably more lurking.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:37, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * " a Maryland settler with governor Leonard Calvert." is this somehow significant? Does it mean he was an early settler? or came over with Calvert? Not being familiar with Maryland history, the reason for mentioning Calvert is lost on me.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:37, 3 January 2021 (UTC) a descendant of Robert Skinner, a Maryland settler who came to the Thirteen American Colonies in the early 1600s with governor Leonard Calvert. = will that work? I'll assume its alright if you don't say anything or copy edit again yourself.
 * It's fine as far as wording/etc, I'm just not seeing why it's important to mention the part about Calvert. I'd really suggest "descendant of Robert Skinner, who arrived in Maryland in the early 1600s." since I don't think the connection with Calvert is important to John Skinner? Ealdgyth (talk) 19:58, 4 January 2021 (UTC)
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:29, 4 January 2021 (UTC)


 * "on a 600 acre faily estate referred" "faily"? do you mean "family"? I can't tell what for sure what this typo is supposed to mean...
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:37, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * "following his father around his various farms in Maryland" - this is the first time we've heard that the family had more than the estate mentioned earlier?
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:37, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * "One farm he often went to was 700 acres near the Calvert County courthouse." what's the importance of this particular farm to his life?
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:37, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly. One farm he often went to was 700 acres near the Calvert County courthouse learning husbandry and agriculture from his father there and studying the science of agronomy. = will that work? I'll assume its alright if you don't say anything or copy edit again yourself.


 * "mail and supplies of European ships" did he process mail and supplies or did he process mail and supply European ships? the current phrasing is awkward and unclear
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 13:07, 3 January 2021 (UTC) as an inspector of all packets going to Europe from the United States. Will that work, I'll assume its alright if you don't say anything or copy edit again yourself.
 * Much better. Ealdgyth (talk) 19:58, 4 January 2021 (UTC)


 * "In 1813 Skinner moved his offices from Annapolis to Baltimore." which offices? Law offices? Or the offices for his governmental jobs?
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 13:47, 3 January 2021 (UTC) In 1813 Skinner moved his law offices from Annapolis to Baltimore.


 * "For the executive position President Madison framed a special commission and assigned Skinner to handle personally the enforcement of regulations." What executive position? And you don't "frame a special commission" - you establish one. And "assigned Skinner to handle personally the enforcement of regulations" - couple of issues - one way awkward wording. Secondly - what regulations? Suggest rewording a bit to "assigned Skinner to personally handle the enforcement of (insert what regulations they were)."
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:19, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly. = established a special commission and assigned Skinner to personally handle the enforcement of all inspections.


 * New point - "navy's Chesapeake Bay Flotilla for commander Joshua Barney." "for" commander - is this a commission he accepted FROM Barney? or was it "under" Barney? Ealdgyth (talk) 19:58, 4 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Mid life
 * Okay, this heading is ... not the best. Perhaps divide into two sections "Events in 1814" and "After the war"?
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 16:58, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Suggest moving the sentence "They were allowed to watch the attack on Fort McHenry from their ship." into the second paragraph where the actual attack is described. Change it to "Skinner and Key were allowed to watch the attack from their ship, still under guard."
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 16:58, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * "a 14-year-old printer's assistant" is this important later? If not, we can cut the age at the very least.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 17:07, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * "At the time he advocated a system of advanced breeds for domestic animals through farm management." *I* am involved in horse breeding, etc and I haven't the slightest clue what Skinner was advocating here..."a system of advanced breeds"?
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 19:45, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly.


 * "The Society in October 1824 had a special fair in honor of French general Lafayette, who happened to be visiting Baltimore at the time. Skinner was in charge of this fair and also entertained LaFayette at his home. In November the United States government rewarded Lafayette for his services in the Revolutionary War with $200,000 and ownership of an entire township in Florida. The French general selected Skinner to managed the entire 23,000 acres (9,300 ha), now part of Tallahassee." the reader unfamiliar with American Revolutionary War history is going to be clueless about what the signifcance of Lafayette being honored is until a couple of sentences later. Also "to managed" - should be "to manage". Also don't say "The French general" but instead "Lafayette" nor do we need to know the monetary amount since this isn't an article on Lafayette.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:21, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly.


 * "In 1820 the first mail express coach was run between Baltimore and Washington. Surveys were then made of three different mail routes between Baltimore and Philadelphia." ... I have no idea how or why this is connected to Skinner?
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:21, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly.


 * did Skinner take any part in the effort to secure the charter for the B&O? If not, we really shouldn't mention its charter because mentioning it implies he had some connection with its grant.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:21, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly.


 * Personal life:
 * "where they lived over the post-office" was it their home or did they live over the post office in a public building? MOst folks are going to be confused by this because they think of post offices being in dedicated buildings that are owned by the public, not of the older practice of the post office being a room or two in the home and/or private building of the postmaster.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:40, 3 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Publications:
 * "Perley Poore's biography on Skinner says that the pedigrees of horses printed in this magazine rose in value from $100 to well over $5,000." ... well, no. The pedigrees themselves did not increase in value. The horses increased in value after their pedigrees were published.
 * ✅ --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:49, 3 January 2021 (UTC) Copy edited accordingly.
 * My interest in Skinner is due to his collecting of early blooded horse pedigrees - I had no idea he was at all connected with Key. I merely know of him through my Thoroughbred and Quarter Horse research... heh. This is why the line about pedigrees like JUMPED out at me.... I do pedigrees all the time. Ealdgyth (talk) 19:58, 4 January 2021 (UTC)


 * I randomly googled three phrases and only turned up Wikipedia mirrors. Earwig's tool shows no sign of copyright violation.
 * I've put the article on hold for seven days to allow folks to address the issues I've brought up. Feel free to contact me on my talk page, or here with any concerns, and let me know one of those places when the issues have been addressed. If I may suggest that you strike out, check mark, or otherwise mark the items I've detailed, that will make it possible for me to see what's been addressed, and you can keep track of what's been done and what still needs to be worked on. Ealdgyth (talk) 02:34, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
 * All issues have been addressed. Can you take another look. Thanks. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:49, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
 * I’ll look as soon as I’m able...I’m traveling with my husband in a semi truck so am hostage to the vagaries of how bouncy the roads are...Ealdgyth (talk) 15:37, 4 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Everything looks good. I just had one other tiny thing I noticed... and a bit more clarification on Calvert. I assume that if any of my copyediting was bad, you'd have said something. Please do not let me change the meaning of anything beyond what the sources would support. Ealdgyth (talk) 19:58, 4 January 2021 (UTC)
 * All further issues have been addressed. Can you take another look. Thanks. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 20:29, 4 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Just "He then accepted a purser's commission in the navy's Chesapeake Bay Flotilla for commander Joshua Barney." is it "from commander" or "under commander"? And did Barney have the rank of Commander or was he just in a "in charge" type of commander? Ealdgyth (talk) 20:42, 4 January 2021 (UTC)
 * copy edited accordingly as under captain Joshua Barney. Will that work? --Doug Coldwell (talk) 21:05, 4 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Works fine. Taking care of the paperwork now... Ealdgyth (talk) 21:31, 4 January 2021 (UTC)