Talk:John William Waterhouse/Archive 1

Chunk of text removed
This text was stuck in the middle of the gallery section -- looks like someone's essay test!

"The first word that comes to my mind is extreme. In the painting of Ophelia by John William Waterhouse, Ophelia takes her time to prepare for her death with flowers. As I gaze at this picture, it looks like it takes place in a forest near a lake.  The lake is dark, and it is filled with lily pads, showing behind Ophelia.  The picture is focused on Ophelia putting flowers in her hair as she sits on a branch leaning over the lake, right on the boundary between land and water. The grass is tall enough to notice in the foreground of the painting.  Ophelia is surrounded by the greens and browns of the natural setting.  Ophelia is sitting on tall but small branches which are growing out of the water in the left side of the painting.

Ophelia is wearing an elegant white long dress with gold trimming around the waist, wrists, and at the bottom of the dress in a fancy design. The gold trim also has pearls or beads, colored red, blue, green, and white. Her head is tilted back, silhouette style, facing away from the painter where the viewer can only see her left eye, the side of her nose, and half her of lips. Her right arm is lifted up near her right ear so the observer can not see her hand. Her left hand is slightly lifted near her neck touching her hair softly. Ophelia’s long, red, stringy hair has red and white flowers tied into it. She has white daisies resting on her lap. This painting has light and dark shading. The trees and the water surrounding Ophelia are dark. Ophelia is the lightest shade of the painting because it is focused on her. She has a rosy tan complexion. She looks as if she is finding peace and pleasure.

With his great accomplishments throughout his oil paintings he had to enter a work of art for his RA diploma (Artmagick 2). The painting he wanted to submit was titled A Mermaid, but, unfortunately, it was not completed so he suggested that they take a temporary painting until it was completed. He decided to turn in, temporarily, the Ophelia painting of 1888. After the submission the painting was lost until the 20th Century, and it is now displayed in the collection of Lord Lloyd Webber (ArtMagick 2).

John William Waterhouse was interested with women dying in or near water. This gives explanation of his interest with Ophelia, since she died in water. It is said that this idea may have also come to him because of the paintings by Rossetti, Horatio Discovering the Madness of Ophelia and also from the painting by Millais’s, Ophelia. J.W. Waterhouse imitated Millais’ work by adding some of the same ideas to his work. He added the idea of the lack of sunlight and the foreground. In Trippi’s book J.W. Waterhouse, another version of the Ophelia painting was completed in 1894 (133-5). In this description of Ophelia, J.W. Waterhouse shows her right before her death. The article, entitled “Ophelia,” states that “certain aspects of the composition underline the mortal turn of events: the poppies in Ophelia’s hair, for example, laden with the symbolism of sleep and death” (Trippi 1-2). The time of finishing the same painting varies throughout two different books. In Hobson’s book The Art and Life of J.W. Waterhouse RA, the Ophelia painting was finished in 1910 (173).

Waterhouse started a collection of Ophelia paintings, which were never finished because his illness of cancer started to become unbearable during the year of 1915. Trippi suggests that John William Waterhouse may have revisited Ophelia in early 1909 after his 1894 painting hung in the Academy in the McCulloch collection. His third Ophelia painting was shown in the Summer Exhibition in 1910. In 1915 he started giving “three to five” paintings to the Academy for the next couple of years. Even though the Ophelia series was never finished, a drawing titled A Study for ‘Ophelia in the Churchyard’ was entered in the 1926 sale, years after his death of cancer in 1917. Records show that there is no painting titled the same as what was entered in the sale, so they are considering it to be the Ophelia painting where she is sitting on the branch (Hobson 174)."

--mervyn 14:52, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Categorizing images
It seems to me that all the images in the "Gallery" (and any others by this artist) should be categorized, for instance, under Category:John William Waterhouse. Would that be appropriate?  B. Mearns * , KSC 19:29, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Pre-Raph?
Was Waterhouse strictly pre-rapaelite? The Pre-raphaelite article lists him as "loosely associated". My understanding was that although he was stylistically pre-raphaelite, he was neve actually part of the "brotherhood". Unfortunately I have no sources and even less certainty. Epeeist smudge 16:55, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

About the Pre-Raph thing
I have to agree that while Waterhouse may have drawn inspiration from the ideas of the Pre-Raphaelite painters, he really can't be called one, I don't think. All one really needs to do is look at his style compared to someone like Rossetti & the differences become starkly clear. One writer described the Pre-Raph's models as looking anemic, while Waterhouse's always have a healthy, warm look to their skin. The colors of the Pre-Raphs are very unnatural, & their attention to detail is meticulous. Waterhouse's colors are more natural in comparison, & as his style progressed, he seemed to not go into meticulous detail, instead kind of more suggesting detail with a few strokes. The subject matter is sometimes fairly similar, but not always. And the Pre-Raphs drew predominantly on the Middle Ages for pretty much everything (hence their name), whilst I think it is safe to say that Waterhouse, while inspired by such things, didn't really incorporate them as the Pre-Raphs did. I mean, some of their models look like they're in unnatural poses, kind of like some Medieval pieces, whereas Waterhouse's models always look very natural. Waterhouse's style is very un-Pre-Raph; he seemed drawn more to warmer colors & more dynamic compositions, & was also fairly influenced by Italy, where he was born. There are very few similarities between Waterhouse & the Pre-Raphaelite painters, & I think it's fairly obvious, so I really don't understand why people insist on labelling him as such. Maybe he was influenced by them a little, but just by looking at his pieces, I think it become very evident that he was not a Pre-Raphaelite.

(nazgrrl@hotmail.com) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.160.174.51 (talk) 22:59, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

IPA
I'd greatly appreciate if somebody could write his name with IPA, please. --Deerstop (talk) 15:30, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Shalot
Does anyone have more info on the other versions of the Lady of Shalott painting? (moved this content from article to here. Not my request, but a good one nonetheless. --Zippy 04:56, 2 Sep 2003 (UTC


 * Another question: In this article is the year of the first version of "The Lady of Shalott" 1888, but in the article The Lady of Shalott - 1894. What is true? AN(Ger) 16:56, 22 Dec 2004 (UTC)

His Telegraph obituary gives it as 1894. Another version seems to have been produced in 1915 or 1916, I'm not certain which. Drutt (talk) 16:41, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

His Model
Has anyone anywhere confirmed or denied that he had an affair with his model? Or her name? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.113.49.126 (talk) 11:10, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

"Miranda" (1916) and "Miranda - The Tempest" (1916)
I noticed that "Miranda" (1916) isn't shown in the gallery. Is this intentional, due to its similarity to "Miranda - The Tempest", or is it an omission? The two paintings are almost identical (other than original size and material), though they do differ in detail. For reference, images of the two are available are available at www.johnwilliamwaterhouse.net: Miranda and Miranda - The Tempest. Even if it's not considered worth having images of both, then it might we worth mentioning that he painted two almost identical works in (relatively) rapid succession.

Also, I noted that the current Wiki image of "Miranda - The Tempest" is very slightly cropped at the top. This can be seen by looking at the top corner of the ship's sail. In the original, there is a clear gap between the top of the sail and the top of the painting, but in the current Wiki image, the sail touches the top. An image at www.artofeurope.com is more complete, but is smaller then the current image. 86.7.22.39 (talk) 10:53, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Jeanne d'Arc
Just noticed that this (File:St Joan - John William Waterhouse.jpg file is not part of the gallery. Would add it myself except the gallery is somewhat organized and am not sure where it would fit. --12.213.80.36 (talk) 19:47, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Date of birth
Date of birth: Julia Kerr states "around January 1849"; other sources state April 6, 1849,. Which one is correct? Also, at least some text in the article seems to be taken taken from http://www.johnwilliamwaterhouse.com/bio.aspx – I'm not sure if there are any copyright issues here --Ktotam 12:21, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Not a substantial enought copy to be a problem (IANAL)  &mdash; Zeimusu | Talk 14:15, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * I've amended the information box and the first line of the article to reflect the lack of certainty about his birth date. Headhitter (talk) 11:15, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Nickname
Why did he have the nickname "Nino"? Headhitter (talk) 11:19, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Sister
Was the Lucy Waterhouse who married the Samuel Palmer and DG Rossetti patron Leonard Rowe Valpy in 1868 his sister?94.193.114.140 (talk) 11:15, 26 June 2014 (UTC)