Talk:Joint (cannabis)

Removing "How to" Section
Per WP:NOT, I'm removing the "How to roll a spliff" section. Quoting from the policy:


 * Instruction manuals - while Wikipedia has descriptions of people, places, and things, Wikipedia articles should not include instruction - advice ( legal, medical, or otherwise), suggestions, or contain "how-to"s. This includes tutorials, walk-throughs, instruction manuals, video game guides, and recipes. Wikibooks is a Wikipedia sister-project which is better suited for such things. Note that this does not apply to the Wikipedia: namespace, where "how-to"s relevant to editing Wikipedia itself are appropriate, such as Wikipedia:How to draw a diagram with Dia. If you're interested in a how-to style manual, you may want to look at Wikihow.

Other editors (listed below) have suggested that the "how to" section be moved to Wikibooks. If anyone is interested, feel free to do so, but please do not add a "how to" section to this article, as providing instructions is not the purpose of Wikipedia. --Impaciente 23:54, 27 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't know if weed is really a hallucinogen. It's effects are rather mild and don't really effect the senses, more one's mood. HighInBC 15:00, 19 March 2006 (UTC)


 * I dont agree. It can be very psychedelic and hallucinogenic. I know that from my personnal experience. --80.188.222.34 12:35, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
 * You either aren't smoking the right stuff or aren't smoking the right stuff right because acheiving tunnel vision is what i consider high...
 * Weed is a hallucinogenic. Just check the psychoactive drug page. Krastain 18:20, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Most doctors consider weed a minor hallucinogen. hallucinogens do not have to be visual. weed also can cause hallucinogens for people with certain types of schitzophrenia.

But someone with actual knowledge should edit this! Mikedelsol 09:48, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
 * "fronta" What is fronta? Google nor wiki turn up any usefull results. Remove?
 * "fronta" I have made a stab at this, on this basis of http://www.rockol.it/rockol/reggae/dizio.htm

The definition given for "fronta": Tobacco leaf used to roll herb. Would be closer to a blunt(a cigar with the leaf split and the tobacco removed used to roll marijauna) rather than a marijauna cigarette.


 * how to make a spliff should not be here but in a how to do section of another wiki i.e. not wikipedia. --SqueakBox 16:31, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)
 * I disagree. That would be making a political and moral judgement; information is free for all..to choose what to do with it is a personal question.
 * I believe that text on how to roll a spliff it would belong in Wikibooks with a link to it from this article. Text on how to create a spliff does not seem to be encyclopedic in nature and as such is beyond the scope of Wikipedia. This has nothing to do with control of information or censorship, instead it is founded in my interpretation of Wikipedia policy. Triddle 17:09, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I agree with that. Article must be a model for foreign language editions, for example. --Thialfi 19:51, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

US vs Europe
Was this article started by a European I wonder, since if it was American, it would almost certainly be 'joint (marijuana)' instead of spliff Youngamerican 18:23, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)


 * yeah. the way i've always heard it used in the US is that a joint is, well, a joint, and a spliff is different because it has tobacco; the little cardboard tubey thing is always just a "filter", not a roach or a crutch . . . perhaps there should be some edits.  --Heah (talk) 05:29, 30 July 2005 (UTC)


 * A crutch is the "little cardboard tubey thing" and a roach is what you're left with when you can't hold the joint comfortably in your fingers. It is not a filter, as it does not filter the content of the smoke at all, it merely allows you to hold the joint without a clip as well as avoid the unsavory taste of dark orange THC resin all over your lips. As far as I know, I have never heard of people preferring actual filtered marijuana cigarettes. A filtered joint would be difficult to construct and smoke, and it would also reduce the THC content of the cigarette.


 * A friend of mine always smokes his weed with a regular filter wich he just rips of cigarettes. It is not difficult to construct, it is not difficult to smoke, and I personally don't think the filter reduces the THC you inhale (but that is just my opinion). Krastain 18:31, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Spliff is a recent term that came form jamaica but certainly in the UK the most common term is also joint and, given the preferences for many Europeans to smoke joints with tobacco, at leasst partially because one cant smoke a hash koint withouit some kind of filler, a joint absolutely can contain tobacco. Using a cigarette filter will definitely reduce the potency of the joint (lol). In Britain the cardboard thing is called a roach and smoking a joint without a roach is relatively unusual as is using a clip, SqueakBox 18:42, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I live in South East London, and a spliff, joint, scud etc, all mean the same thing, a piece of rizla with tobacco, cannabis and a bit of card rolled into a tube at the end which is called the roach. The cardboard used for this "roach" is called "roach material". Noone keeps the smoked roach after a joint, it's essentially just a cigarette butt. However people roll these with no tobacco on occasion, called a "Purey". People roll blunts too, which you can buy the blunt paper from a Head shop which can be flavoured with a large variety of flavours. I've never seen or smoked one of these so called "empty cigar papers". People usually put minimal tobacco in blunts. 86.149.253.54 13:43, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Skinupperology
Why does my link to the Skinupperology Skinning Up Guide keep getting removed? It is more informative than all the other ones.
 * Agreed. This is the best guide I can find.Kernow 21:06, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Skin Up
I was going to make an article under Skin Up but it appears to have already been done, deleted and redirected here. However, the old Skin Up page here seems to have a much clearer lay-out as well loads more info. Does anyone else feel that this Spliff article should be given a similar lay-out, or at least some of the info brought in from there? Kernow 21:10, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Why not joint? or Cigarette (Marijuana)
Spliff is a specific type of joint, just joint points to spliff.

I think there should be a more general article for all type of marijuana cigarette's that mentions spliffs and other types of joints. Any comments? HighInBC 17:06, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, it seems only to be called a spliff in Jamaica and the UK. A search for 'joint cannabis' (2 million) actually gets more hits on Google than 'spliff' (1.5 million), let alone 'spliff cannabis' (112 thousand). Kernow 23:07, 21 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Completely agree; to me, those around me, and many people I have met travelling, spliff refers specifically to a joint with tobacco in it, while a 'joint' is a much broader term, referring to any marijuana cigarette, tobaconized or not. Regardless, I think as Kernow points out spliff is less used than joint. --Gregorof 11:55, 12 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I also agree, spliff always means mixed with tobacco, joint means just weed. -DJLO (talk) 02:22, 25 March 2009 (UTC)


 * OK, pending no objections im gonna move this article to Joint (Marijuana), and the contents of the Spliff article can either be expanded, or made simply into a component of the joint article, discussing this as their name in the U.K. and Jamaica, and otherwise simply a generic term for a joint with tobacco in it. Because the discussions here refer to marijuana cigrattes as a whole (as the article does as well obviously) I will not just move the contents, but the article itself.--Gregorof/(T) 04:43, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Sounds good, but just to be technically correct you should call it Joint (cannabis) - note the lack of capitalization in the parenthesized word as well as the word change itself. G Rose 06:54, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Good point yah ill do that, just give it a day or two in case anyone has any last words. --Gregorof/(T) 08:20, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Two or three decades ago, hmm, I did know a delightful person - where is she now? - whose cat was called 'spliff'; also a chap who was for a while custodian of a dog called 'acid'. The essence of the nomenclature may well have been, pace Noam Chomsky, that it denatures possible paranoia. The use of 'joint' may have come about because of the need to have a common neutral noun with non-prejudicaial connotations with which to describe the object/substance in question. The term 'shit' was, for example, widely used in the UK in the '60s and '70s as a substitute for 'cannabis resin'; clearly any 'parental overseer' would be inclined to ignore this.


 * Once terms have become part of common parlance, it doesn't always make that much differece which is used. The main point is that both/all parties to a communication should know what they are talking about; if necesary and appropriate to the disadvantage of overseers. It has always seemed to me that the use of the word 'joint' to describe something in the nature of a sacrement conveyed an aspect of sharing; and this aspect of sharing was crucial to the experience that 'joints' appear to provide. But then agsin, I'm part of a WASP sub-community and I don't know the origins of 'spliff'. Isn't there a possibility of using a disambiguation page? Davy p 03:09, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

"nigga"/"cracka"
Second paragraph: However, the most common term for a spliff rolled with clove tobacco is "Da Nigga" while the common spliff rolled with just regular tobacco is called "Da Cracka." Seriously? &#x2014;alxndr&#x00a0; (t) 01:48, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Quite obviously vandalism; http://www.urbandictionary.com/browse.php?word=da+cracka has nothing (not for "da nigga" either). Reverted. 82.32.65.149 22:43, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

No - this is quite serious, in spite of it's (regrettable) racial connotations. This is quite common terminology in the South East of England and London. "Nigga" refers to the blackness of the cloves (smoked in similar style to the Indonisian Kretec), whereas "cracka", or "cracker" (a racial term used against Caucasians) refers to a J devoid of "blackness" (ie, cloves). Niggas tend to smoke slower and have more flavour, whereas crackas smoke faster and are more intense (in my inexpert opinion....).

I removed the reference to cocaine
cocaine is rarely smoked, except in its freebase form (crack), because the drug is destroyed in combustion for the most part. I've never heard of anyone creating a crack joint either, I dont even know if its possible, not do I care to know since crack is just a whole other story completly :P --insertwackynamehere 01:52, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I also removed the reference to some unsourced study where Welsh people are 100 times more likely than Anglo-Saxons to get schizophrenia from marijuana. A) this isn't about marijuana its about spliffs B) There was no source for the welsh/anglo-saxon thing and C)the schizophrenia argument (there were studies IN GENERAL not about nationality) doesnt belong in articles talking abotu methods of smoking cannabis, they should stay in thier main article --insertwackynamehere 01:57, 3 September 2006 (UTC)


 * its actually very common for people to lace marijuana with cocaine. however it is uncommon to lace a joint with it but i have seen it done. yes a lot of the drug is destroyed but there should still be enough to get intoxicated.


 * Fairly common around here to roll weed with coke. Having neither smoked or snorted coke, i wouldn't know, but it's supposed to be fairly efficient at getting you stoned, according to some friends.

Request for Comment: article name
Please add your vote below for whether the title of this article should be kept as "spliff" or renamed (new name to be determined later - probably either "joint" or "cigarette (cannabis)"). G Rose 09:10, 1 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Rename, for two reasons:


 * 1) Use of slang. There is a formal name which can be used here instead of a slang term - "cannabis cigarette".  It's the same reason that the article Cannabis (drug) is not named "pot", "dope", or "shit".  A good reason not to rename the article "cigarette (cannabis)", however, is that the word "cigarette" is too heavily associated with tobacco &mdash; which brings me to my second point...


 * 2) Recognizability. At the very top of WP:NAME, you will read that an article's name "should give priority to what the majority of English speakers would most easily recognize, with a reasonable minimum of ambiguity".


 * I had never heard the word "spliff" in my life before using Wikipedia. Neither I nor anyone I know has ever referred to a cannabis cigarette by this term.  Thus, in my eyes, this article is confusingly named after an obscure slang term.  The most common term for a cannabis cigarette is "joint", as is evidenced by the roughly 15-to-1 ratio of Google hits for "cannabis joint" versus "cannabis spliff".


 * Even if "spliff" is the preferred term in the UK, "joint" seems to be recognizable enough to be mentioned in these BBC articles:  .  If I am interpreting this correctly, a British user will recognize the term "joint" as referring to a cannabis cigarette.  An American user, however, will most likely not recognize "spliff".


 * Based on these points, I believe the article should probably be named joint. G Rose 09:10, 1 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Rename: Joint per WP:NAME. Edwardsdl 20:42, 1 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Rename to joint per the google test. In my experience, the term "spliff" has been restricted exclusively to marijuana "cigars"- i.e., joints of similar size and wrapping to cigars. siafu 23:36, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Rename per Google and Wikipedia in other languages test. It's a no-brainer: Joint is the employed term on all other Wikipedias, even when joint is an English language term.  What's up with that? - GilliamJF 08:42, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Rename as joint. Spliff? First time I hear it. But I must admit English is just a second language for me. --Sugaar 20:17, 10 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Hehe, this debate I think was already had, but to a much more haphazard extent above, and finished. (Read above). Thanks for formalizing it. So its a consensus ill do all the dirty work, gonna have to copy-edit and change a lot of the wording tomorrow tho. --Gregorof/(T) 09:03, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * It's a consensus. I support the rename.  Peter O. (Talk) 22:16, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Done R e verendG 01:20, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Creating unnecessary redirects
Dont change the link from Cannabis (drug) to marijuana as the latter is a redirect to the former and by doing so you make the wikipedia worse as part of our work is to eliminate redirects not revert people and thus re-create them in the process, SqueakBox 17:03, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Wooden what?
If a spliff was a device made out of wood (a chillum) please source this. The claimm that people in the developing world still use this wooden device instead of cigarette papers is laughable and clearly false, SqueakBox 18:34, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
 * People all over the world who don't have normal rollingpaper use either pipes or paper from other sources (such as newspapers). But please, don't use the words 'laughable' and 'clearly', as it is just a way of saying you don't have proof. Krastain 18:27, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

-other types of joint, spliff, reefer, dube, bifta etc-

Tulips are not mentioned here, nor are flutes (double ended creation). there should be a scetion that mentions the wrap & roll style and the handrolling style.

smoking
I think under the smoking section for spliff that (generally to the left) should be removed. There is no set direction a joint is passed. In fact when people are driving and smoking its usually passed to the right so the passenger can grab the joint for the driver. in countries where cars hve a steering wheel on the left anyway. not only that but sometimes a rotation gets mixed up from people getting too intoxicated so they forget the direction it was going.

Remove this superfluous statement please
"Studies indicate the combination of cannabis and tobacco can cause nicotine addiction.[1]"

This just in: Water causes things to become wet when in contact with it. The sentence is underneath the fourth picture in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mhmandthen (talk • contribs) 21:13, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Definition of a Spliff
Is the definition of a spliff as "various styles of marijuana cigarette rolled with a mixture of cannabis and tobacco" a legitimate one. Its lack of citation, and contradictory definitions from several independent sources  suggest that it does not, by any means, necessarily include tobacco. Urban dictionary does have one reference to a spliff as exclusively a tobacco and marijuana cigarette. However it is only one, which by comparison to the number other sources is quite few. I'm planning on updating this in a few days, if there is no response to this post.(Lewzer99 (UTC))20:19, 20 February 2009


 * Someone has recently been mucking with the wording. Until yesterday it used to say that that a spliff could "also" mean one mixed with tobacco (ie, in addition to meaning one not mixed).  I guess that was too confusing for the anon yesterday who "corrected" it by removing the word "also".  I'll try to fix it. Til Eulenspiegel (talk) 21:05, 20 February 2009 (UTC)


 * As far as l know, a ‘spliff’ is not the same as a ‘joint.’ As far as l know, a ‘spliff’ is a joint that contains tobacco.--5.33.6.3 (talk) 01:49, 6 April 2019 (UTC)


 * From what I understand, in Caribbean spliff is a loose term for a marijuana joint with or without a tobacco leaf wrapper, it is generally a reference to smoking marijuana. I do know with Jamaicans at least some of the Rastafari grow their own tobacco to use the leaves to roll strait marijuana. I was told, as it was the first religion I learned, that the Rastafari do not use cigarettes, as they are "Babylon".72.187.209.126 (talk) 20:36, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

New Section
I was thinking this article could be streamlined by creating a section which simply describes the components of a joint, i.e. roach/mouthpiece, papers, smoking mix. This would reduce the repeated explanations of each component and clear up some of the articles redundancy. (Lewzer99 (talk) 19:41, 27 February 2009 (UTC))

"Variations" Section change
Thinking about the description of roaches. there's no source for the statement they contain more THC than Buds. Also, it wrongly references the resin as cannabis when referring to the residue left on the roach after smoking.

Smoking roaches sucks... Didymal (talk) 17:31, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

Low Importance?
In terms of cannabis, and its Wikiproject, wouldn't one of the traditional and most common methods of consumption rank higher than "low" on importance? Lewzer99 (talk) 17:16, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Agreed I've changed it to high. Smartse (talk) 11:38, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Wait... am I the only one noticing the double entendre here? InsertCleverPhraseHere InsertTalkHere 03:56, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
 * I appreciate your feedback. Any users interested in improving the coverage of cannabis throughout Wikipedia are more than welcome to join WikiProject Cannabis. Your feedback and contributions would be much appreciated by this brand new project with hopes of expansion. -- Another Believer ( Talk ) 19:57, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

professional made
are there any in the netherlands? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.217.59.87 (talk) 12:58, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Videos
I know it is not a howto, but videos of how it is rolled in the US vs. Holland would be good. I am talking about the backward paper thing where the glue is wetted by licking the non-glued side of the paper and then the excess paper is torn off. (I lived in Amsterdam for four years, so I know that well.)

Anna Frodesiak (talk) 03:39, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

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Far too many slang names
The opening sentence currently reads: A joint, spliff, jay, doink, reefer, doobie, zoot, kuda or jazz cigarette ... There really don't need to be NINE names in the opening sentence. Some of these are barely known outside certain areas and communities. Per WP:OTHERNAMES there should be no more than three or so alternative names, and even that seems unnecessary. I'm also removing "jay" and "kuda" because I can't find anything about those terms. Prinsgezinde (talk) 22:29, 31 January 2020 (UTC)


 * 'kuda' I've heard used to mean lower gradestreet methamphetamine that was an off white powder form as opposed to crystal. Firejuggler86 (talk) 21:03, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

isn't a spliff only cannabis, whilst a joint could also contain tobacco, however it doesn't require tobbaco
aka, all spliffs are joints, but not all joints are spliffs? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A01:79D:4699:AC90:5C62:BC7D:BB51:8901 (talk) 00:27, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

Actually the other way around. Spliffs by definition have tobacco added; joints don’t.  PacificBoy  10:18, 9 January 2021 (UTC)