Talk:Juan Pierre

Adding hits leader to infobox
Edits to Juan Pierre have been reverted by Yankees10 for what I believe to be entirely arbitrary reasons. The document that Yankees 10 refers to (Wikipedia:WikiProject Baseball/Player style advice) clearly states that it is not a formal standard. See "This WikiProject advice page is not a formal Wikipedia policy or guideline, as it has not been thoroughly vetted by the community."

I simply added the following to the "Career highlights and awards" section:

2x NL Hits Leader (2004, 2006)

I believe Yankee10's continual reversion of my accurate and relevant addition is arbitrary in nature and appears to be more about his personal preference and not about any specific rule. Leading a league in hits is not a small achievement, and it should be noted as a career highlight/award. It's not as if I am suggesting that we list the man's shoe size or favorite color. The info I have added is correct and relevant, and it should be left intact. I would appreciate my edit being restored. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rkughen (talk • contribs) 03:41, 19 June 2018 (UTC)


 * WikiProject Baseball/Player style advice was created to avoid edit wars such as this. It based on consensus through numerous discussions that were had years ago and it has generally done its job. If we are going to ignore consensus on this, then what is the point of that page then? Why should one users personal preference come in the way over numerous others established consensus?--Yankees10 05:30, 19 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Consensus can change on the style advice. However, up until now, it’s pretty much no consensus between the two of you. Per WP:NOCONSENSUS, additions are typically removed when there is no consensus for the change. Let’s see if others support adding the hits leader to the infobox.—Bagumba (talk)

That's my point here. There is no consensus. The document that has been referenced as stating a consensus also contains this sentence at the top: "This WikiProject advice page is not a formal Wikipedia policy or guideline, as it has not been thoroughly vetted by the community."

If I was trying to add something entirely unrelated or of obviously unequal status, I could see Yankees10's point. No other user has cared about this other than Yankees10. It's not damaging the integrity of the page, and I think knowing Pierre led the league twice in hits is a solid piece of information that others might find both useful and possibly even surprising. Obviously, we both love baseball, and accurate information is important to both of us. The information is accurate, relevant, and worthy of inclusion. The fact that leading the league in stolen bases is acceptable but hits aren't should tell us that the consensus - if there is one - is flawed. Rkughen (talk) 06:25, 19 June 2018 (UTC)
 * not a formal Wikipedia policy or guideline: This is basically saying that WikiProject consensus does not trump community consensus. This is not relevant here, as there is (so far) no consensus on this talk page, let alone a wider community consensus.  Let’s wait to see others’ opinions. Regards.—Bagumba (talk) 06:40, 19 June 2018 (UTC)
 * There is also WP:ONUS: The onus to achieve consensus for inclusion is on those seeking to include disputed content.—Bagumba (talk) 11:02, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

The info I wanted to include wasn't disputed and wasn't incongruent with consensus (given there was no consensus) until a single user disputed it with the basis of his dispute being a Wikipedia guideline that is not relevant here. Because there is no prior consensus that prohibits the inclusion of hits leader in the infobox, I'm not sure that WP:ONUS is as applicable here. However, I do see the point about WP:NOCONSENSUS. And I am not arguing simply for the sake of arguing. As I stated previously, it is not as though I am attempting to list some esoteric or tangentially related information that clearly doesn't belong in the Infobox. Anyway, I appreciate the information, Bagumba. Thank you. Rkughen (talk) 18:27, 19 June 2018 (UTC)